The two Main tracks will be from Gassman switch to West Temple for this year. This is the second year for a five year program to get to Glasgow. Last year they worked on the Williston Lead, Minot yard tracks,Tioga MP78.6-MP80.6, Manitou-CP67,Palermo MP46.6-MP48.7 and the Whatley Staging Tracks.
The last I heard the want to get to get to West Snowden by the end of next year. They say it will all depend on the oil business. I think it will be slowing going once they cross the Montana state line waiting for permits to build.
Right now they have a Track Lifting Machine working on th KO Sub. that recieves 6hr. windows Monday - Friday, so they have been running some eastbounders via the Devil Lake Sub. Amtrak has been running west on the KO, East on the Devils Lake.
Hillsbro Sub will work on four new siding Reynolds-Thompson, EES-WSS Buxton, ESS -WSS Grandin and Dakota Jct. - ESS Harwood.
The lastest plan I have heard is run east on the Devils Lake and Hillsbro, West on the KO. It was about 12hrs either way three weeks ago when I was riding trains. It will change with the amount of track work going on.
Minot to Williston will not be completely two main tracks this year, but should be next (this excludes, of course, Gassman Coulee bridge, which remains single track).
And yes, it will all be CTC (so 2 MT instead of Double Track, which historically means signaled in one direction).
Mark Meyer
Streak,
Read VerMontanan's post of May 23 at 5:55. He knows what he is talking about. Key statement is that Minot to Williston will be done this year. I am 99.9% sure will be 2 MT CTC, and suspect the sole exception will be at Gasman Coulee due to the long tall bridge there. That is roughly 120 miles. If you want more detail Friends of Burlington Northern has various date ETT you could look at for mileage.
Mac
This project has many points to be considered which affects the scope of this project.
1. Only the privately held BNSF could designate this much capital in one year to a project.
2. According to the Amtrak timetable for the Empire Builder the 277 miles is correct.
3. How many miles are already 2 main track ?
The next items need eyes on the ground to determine..
4. How many miles of sidings already in place ?
5. How many miles of sidings will have to be upgraded to MT standards ?
6. Will the subgrades of new main track be completed to BNSF class-IV standards ?
7. Will there be enough crossties available ?
8. Is there enough top grade rail available ?
9. Are there enough switch machines, bungalows, frogs, other switch parts to ::
a. connecting a siding will require at least one set to join one end of siding to new track.
b. To make a full CP will require three sets.
c. As KP has pointed out on his sunset thread. The set up of the signals will help us determine either present plans or final future lay outs of each separate CP. If signals with 2 or three heads then expect turnout in that direction. If some heads turned aside then future work will happen. ETC.
d. Some new track might have a turn out installed that goes nowhere until second track is in service to prevent shutdown of segment.
10. The news release from BNSF states double track and not two main tracks. So it is going to take eyes on the project to fully know what is the short term work this summer ?
greyhounds [ They say it here: http://www.bnsf.com/media/news-releases/2014/may/2014-05-01a.html
[
They say it here:
http://www.bnsf.com/media/news-releases/2014/may/2014-05-01a.html
Yes, that's what they say. I believe it will be about 50 miles of new double track this year. I guess we'll see on December 31.
Considering all the other enhancements (such as the Devils Lake-Hillsboro) and everything else, even 50 miles is a good effort, in my opinion.
VerMontanan No, there won't be 200+ miles of double track in North Dakota and Montana this year. The plan is for about 45 miles this year and a similar amount next year. Part of line is already double track (actually 2 MT CTC) between Minot and Williston (Minot to Des Lacs except for Gassman Coulee bridge and Epping to Williston), so expect Minot to Williston to be done by next year. ..
No, there won't be 200+ miles of double track in North Dakota and Montana this year. The plan is for about 45 miles this year and a similar amount next year. Part of line is already double track (actually 2 MT CTC) between Minot and Williston (Minot to Des Lacs except for Gassman Coulee bridge and Epping to Williston), so expect Minot to Williston to be done by next year. ..
Mark,
You know more about this than I do. I thought that 270+ miles of 2nd main was a whole lot to lay down in just one year. And so, I ask if I understood things correctly.
But, here is what the BNSF is saying they'll do in 2014:
"Completing construction of a second mainline track, referred to as double track, between Minot, N.D. and Glasgow, Mont."
Mark:Thanks for update. The Trains map shows 5 trains per day on the Minot -Grand Forks line in2012. Obviously all hell broke loose with oil trains and that line became pretty viable.
It sounds as if BNSF will basically use that line as a "double track" between Fargo and Minot. Yes, it is a longer route, but lets keep the freight moving boys and girls. No doubt someone is very happy that line didnt get purged back in the 80s...similar to the Montana Rail Link.
Now, it appears the Keystone folks are ready to move that Canadian oil by rail rather than pipeline down to Nebraska. Hmmm...things just get more and more interesting for the privately held BNSF.
ed
No, there won't be 200+ miles of double track in North Dakota and Montana this year. The plan is for about 45 miles this year and a similar amount next year. Part of line is already double track (actually 2 MT CTC) between Minot and Williston (Minot to Des Lacs except for Gassman Coulee bridge and Epping to Williston), so expect Minot to Williston to be done by next year. But, in upgrading the route between Minot and Fargo via Devils Lake this year, that is, in effect, creating a viable second main track for another 275 miles or so! Whether the remainder of the Glasgow subdivision all the way from Williston to Glasgow receives a second main track remains to be seen. Last year, BNSF added three auxiliary staging tracks (basically sidiings) at Whatley, east of Glasgow (all CTC/power switches). The line between Williston and Glasgow is basically flat (maximum grade .4 percent), so it's less critical than Minot to Williston which has a lot of up and down (though the maximum grade is only .65 percent westbound and .6 percent eastbound). Still there is a lot of Bakken-related traffic west of Williston; Trenton has a major crude oil loading facility; Snowden is the junction for the Sidney subdivision which features a crude oil load out and industrial park (sand and other material) at Dore, as well as abundant traffic for Sidney; Bainville and Culbertson receive fracking sand and other materials. Culbertson, which is trying to get an Amtrak stop, saw the opening of a shuttle grain train facility last year (and shipped its first train the same day that the first shuttle grain train left the new shuttle facility at Culbertson, Nebraska). West of Culbertson, Bakken-related traffic declines, but there are shuttle grain train facilities at Macon, Kasa Point (just east of Wolf Point), and Kintyre.
Is This a Bad Omen for UP?
This forum contributor is most familiar with two-tracking on the Sunset Route between Los Angeles, CA and El Paso, TX.
October 1, 2013 by Salton Sea, CA
June 23, 2012 east of Ferrum, CA
March 21, 2012 west of the Picacho sidings area, AZ
The expression this contributor has used reference that Sunset Route two-tracking in recent years has been snail paced, and is often ten or twenty miles total for the whole year. But, this thread has mentioned close to 300 miles of two-tracking in just one year in the northern states! Wow! Sounds like UP is going the route of Southern Pacific and in another twenty years the government will order BNSF to eat UP, and only one railroad in the west will be standing!
Anyway, if someone can put the northern two-tracking in a comprehendible form for southern two-tracking followers it would be most appreciated.
Thanks,
K.P.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- K.P.’s absolute “theorem” from early, early childhood that he has seen over and over and over again: Those that CAUSE a problem in the first place will act the most violently if questioned or exposed.
Not counting any "through" trains to/from west of Minot to/from east of Fargo, the Fargo-Grand Forks section sees at least a dozen trains daily. Not only the Empire Builder each way (well, one way for the time being), but also three merchandise trains each way, about 1.5 coal trains each way (loads or empties to/from either Ardoch or Cohasset), a local each way (a turn out of Grand Forks), and 2 to 5 loaded "grain" trains daily to or from the numerous shuttle facilities in the area, or just protecting single car orders. Add the additional traffic using the route (along with the Devils Lake line) as an alternate main line, and it can see upwards of 20 trains daily.
Following the Glasgow sub from Glasgow to Minot on Google Earth, I found several "super shuttle" grain facilities as of 2011 and four or five big crude oil loading terminals.
That would seem to be a strong driver for the two track business case there.
Is the Fargo-Minneapolis mainline double tracked? Or do they count both of their lines between these two points as equivalent to double track?
Jim:I agree that the direct route is considerably shorter (miles), but why would BNSF add capacity to the line by adding sidings for only 5 trains a day. It appears there will be 7 sidings added between Fargo - Grand Forks - Minot.
My guess and only a guess is this will handle lower priority freights and reduce flow on the Minot - Fargo line. Just a guess based on looking at the map.
The 'Main Line' is the cut-off between Fargo an Minot. The route via Grand Forks is used by Amtrak, trains to/from Duluth, and any overflow traffic if the cut-off is clogged. There has been a lot of work between Minot and Grand Forks in the Devils Lake area because of the rising lake levels of Devils Lake. BNSF and multiple government agencies have funded this project.
Even after all of the various capacity projects are complete, I suspect BNSF will route most traffic via the cuf-off(lots of miles shorter). Lower priority trains may use the Grand Forks route in the future as it will have added capacity, but it will never be faster between Fargo and Minot. The good news is that Amtrak will not have to suffer through all of the construction delays.
Jim
Modeling BNSF and Milwaukee Road in SW Wisconsin
Without knowing the territory, it is difficult to understand, but is it safe to say:
1. Double track from Minot west to Glasgow, Mt.
2. From Minot east to Fargo there are two lines, both single tracked. They will essentially use these two segments to provide "double track capacity".
3. Sidings added to both lines between Minot and Fargo, thus allowing directional on each segment.
The January 2014 Trains "Map of the Month" (BNSF trains perday 1994/2012) shows:
1. Fargo - Minot direct line handles 36 trains daily.
2. Fargo - Grand Forks - Minot handles 5 per day.
So...will the additional sidings allow Fargo - Grand Forks - Minot to essentially be upgraded?Ed
BNSF completed the 2 main track in the North La Crosse Yard last season, and also reconfigured the signals at the north end of the yard(Sullivan CTC). They have run into opposition for the next step(Grand X'ing to Graff CTC), but it looks like all to be settled is if a 'subway' under the track or a ramp over the track for the golf course(Right now a golf cart crossing is at grade). There has been some local opposition by groups worried about BNSF running crude oil trains through on the route(at least 11-12 each way right now). I am not sure if this work will be complete this season. A lot of fill needs to be done through the marsh area(and it may need pilings to be sunk).
I believe that the expansion was reported several months ago in the news wire, so this project is very much on track to finish this year.
On a historical note, this is part of the longest line segment built in one year from one end. It was James J. Hill's Manitoba from Minot to Great Falls, 545 miles in 1887, plus laying rail on the Montana Central between Great Falls and Helena for a total of 643 miles of rail laid by one crew in one season.
Maybe a few miles less, but not many. However, the terrain is generally much flatter and friendlier to rapid construction than what the TransCon was dealing with the last few years (e.g., Abo Canyon).
That said, here are links to the BNSF news release, and a map:
From http://www.bnsf.com/media/news-releases/2014/may/2014-05-01a.html :
"North Dakota
BNSF plans to invest approximately $400 million in North Dakota to expand rail capacity, replace and maintain the network infrastructure, and continue the implementation of Positive Train Control technology.
Expansion projects include:
Map: http://www.bnsf.com/media/pdf/2014capitalplanmap.pdf - see "6 Glasgow Sub: six double-track projects" (not terribly helpful, but that's the best I could find).
- Paul North.
Do I understand this correctly? BNSF says they are going to complete the addition of a 2nd main track between Minot, ND and Glasgow, MT this year. I make that to be around 277 miles of new track. That's a whole lot of new track to spike down. Have I figured the mileage correctly?
When did they start laying the 2nd main track? This sure seems like an "On Fire" project. I'll guess it's costing somewhere around $550 million. They went a lot slower when they 2nd mained the Transcon.
If I've got this right I think Trains or somebody should be writing about it. It's a tremendous project to rapidly add needed rail capacity.
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