30th Street Station....but in Manhattan

[John WR]

I just want to add a comment that by 1870 things had changed considerably for the New York and Hudson River Railroad.  That road was completed in 1851 to Albany; from the beginning it included a line down the west side of Manhattan.  When Abe Lincoln rode it on the way to his inauguration it was considerably faster than the boats that ran up and down the Hudson River.  Even so, the waterways still owned shipping in that part of the country.  The river was full of canal boats being towed up and down the river by steam boats.  But for passengers the railroad was a lot faster.  

Cornelius Vanderbilt acquired the road during the Civil War.  He wanted the freight from the New York Central; however Erastus Corning, who owned the Central, sent his freight down the Hudson River instead because freight rates were cheaper on the river.  Vanderbilt had to settle for freight business limited to the winter when the river froze.  

In one of the more famous railroading stories of the era on a cold January night during a snowstorm in 1867 Vanderbilt stopped a passenger train across the river from Albany leaving his passengers to make a treacherous crossing on the ice to connect with a New York Central train.  The public outcry caused New York Central stock prices to plunge; Vanderbilt brought it at a bargain price.  He later brought land in lower Manhattan and opened his freight yard.  He also built the first Grand Central Terminal on his New York and Harlem line and for many years had the only passenger terminal in Manhattan.  

However, all of the Vanderbilt influence was many years after Abe Lincoln rode the New York and Hudson River Railroad to Manhattan and then crossed over to New Jersey to continue his trip to be inaugurated.  

[henry6]

MIke...it would simply take looking at the picture's to determine publisher and date.  Then see if publisher is still in existence or has merger or been bought by another and if the copyrights are clear or still in force.  IF clear, publish and give credit to source, if in forece, get permission from owner.  

[micky]

Hi Wanswheel

What would it take to use the photo of the 30th street station (lower image) in a publication?

Thanks  Mike

[NKP guy]

Thanks, wanswheel...

   I certainly enjoyed these links & pictures. 

 

 

[wanswheel]

NKP, there are a few pictures of Exchange Street Station at these links.

http://www.buffalohistoryworks.com/terminal/history/history.html

http://www.buffalohistoryworks.com/terminal/history/memories-rule.html

http://wnyheritagepress.org/photos_week_2004/mcleods_hotel/mcleods_hotel.htm

Excerpt from History of Buffalo

In the order of their creation, the steam railroads now entering Buffalo date as follows:

1836. The Buffalo and Niagara Falls. Acquired by the New York Central Railroad Company in 1855, and extended to Lewiston.

1843. The Buffalo and Attica, which connected Buffalo with a chain of railroads through the State to Albany. The erroneous statement has often been made that this western link in the chain became part of the New York Central Railroad, in the consolidation of 1853. On the contrary, the Buffalo and Attica was acquired by the Buffalo and New York City Railroad Company and extended to Hornellsville, to connect with the New York and Erie Railway, then progressing toward Dunkirk.

1852. The New York and Erie Railway brought into connection with Buffalo, by the completed extension of the Buffalo and Attica road to Hornellsville, and also by the opening of a second line of connecting rails, from Buffalo to Corning. Both of these lines became integral parts of the New York, Lake Erie and Western system, as it now exists.

1852. The Buffalo and Rochester Railroad, completed to Buffalo by the building of a direct line of rails between Buffalo and Batavia. Included the next year in the consolidation of the New York Central line.

1852. The Buffalo and State Line Railroad, linked with the chain of roads then in formation along the southern shore of Lake Erie, and thence to Chicago, which, after some years, were to be forged into the consolidated Lake Shore and Michigan Southern Railroad line.

1852. The Buffalo and Brantford. Extended a little later to Goderich, and name changed to Buffalo and Lake Huron in 1858. Leased in 1870 to the Grand Trunk Railway Company of Canada, of whose lines it forms the Buffalo terminus. Under the auspices of the Grand Trunk Company the Niagara River was bridged at Buffalo by the International Bridge Company, in 1874.

1853. Organization of the consolidated New York Central Railroad Company, owning and operating a continuous line from Buffalo to Albany.

1854. Establishment of a uniform gauge on the connected roads from Buffalo to Chicago, in the line known ultimately as the Lake Shore and M. S.

1869. Consolidation of the New York Central and the Hudson River railroad companies in the N. Y. C. and H. R. R. Company.

1869. Consolidation of several connected roads by the organization of the Lake Shore and Michigan Southern Company. Since 1898 the New York Central and Hudson River Railroad Company has held a majority of its capital stock and controlled the management of the road.

1870. The Buffalo Creek Railroad. From William Street to Peck Slip and other connections on the south side of Buffalo River. Leased to the Erie and the Lehigh Valley railroad companies in 1889.

1873. The Canada Southern Railway, from Buffalo to Amherstburg, on the Detroit River. In 1878 the ownership of the road underwent a change. For many years past it has been under lease to the Michigan Central Railroad Company and is known by the latter name.

1873. The Buffalo and Washington Railway. Built from Buffalo to Emporium, Pa., opening direct connection with the sources of anthracite coal supply, and a shortened route to Philadelphia and Washington. A little later the name was changed to Buffalo, New York and Philadelphia, and that name, in its turn, was extinguished by the absorption of the road in the great Pennsylvania Railroad system. For several years past it has been operated under contract as the Buffalo and Allegheny Valley Division of the Pennsylvania Railroad.

1875. The Buffalo and Jamestown. Reorganized in 1877 under a change of name, becoming the Buffalo and Southwestern Railroad. Leased to the Erie Railway Company in 1881, and now known as the Buffalo and Southwestern Division of the New York, Lake Erie and Western Railroad.

1882. The New York, Chicago and St. Louis (known commonly as the Nickel Plate), completed to Chicago. Reorganized, after a foreclosure sale, in 1887. Large parts of its capital stock owned by the Lake Shore and M. S. Company and by the Vanderbilt interest. The road is operated in connection with what is known as the Vanderbilt system.

1882. The New York, Lackawanna and Western. Chartered under this name for the extension of the Delaware, Lackawanna and Western from Binghamton to Buffalo. Opened for freight in 1882 and for passengers in 1885. Leased in 1882 to the Delaware, Lackawanna and Western Company and operated under its name.

1883. The Buffalo, Pittsburg and Western. Built from Buffalo to Brocton, connecting there with a road to Oil City and Franklin. Constructed in the interest of the Buffalo, New York and Philadelphia, with which it was soon consolidated; passing, finally, with the latter, into the Buffalo and Allegheny Valley Division of the Pennsylvania Railroad system.

1883. The Buffalo, Rochester and Pittsburg. Chartered to connect with the Rochester and Pittsburg road at Ashford, N. Y. The company consolidated with that of the latter in 1882. Opened to Buffalo in 1883, and acquired extensions the same year to Punxutawney, Pa. Acquired, also, the franchises of the East Buffalo Terminal Railroad Company, but has not used the rights obtained in William and Clinton Streets. From the crossing of Buffalo Creek the trains of the company come into the city over the tracks of the New York Central. In 1885 the road was sold on a foreclosure, and reorganized under the names of the Buffalo, Rochester and Pittsburg in New York, and the Pittsburg and State Line in Pennsylvania. The two companies were consolidated under the former name in 1887.

1884. The Lehigh Valley. During some years previously the Lehigh Valley Railroad had been delivering coal in its own cars at Buffalo by use of the tracks and engines of the Erie Railway from its junction with the latter. In 1884 it arranged to run its own coal trains on the tracks of the Erie. It had already, in 1882, acquired in Buffalo a right of way from the tracks of the Erie to a terminal of its own, at the corner of Scott and Washington Streets. In 1885 it acquired further rights of way to junctions with the Buffalo Creek Railroad and the New York, Chicago and St. Louis Railway. In 1890, by a consolidation of several subsidiary organizations, a corporation having the name of the Lehigh Valley Railway Company, distinct from the Lehigh Valley Railroad Company was formed, which opened a new line of rails to Buffalo in September, 1892. In 1891 the Lehigh Valley Railway Company had leased this line to the Lehigh Valley Railroad Company for 999 years. The organizations consolidated in the L. V. Ry. Co. were the Geneva and Sayre, the Geneva and Van Ettenville, the Buffalo and Geneva, and the Auburn and Ithaca. Long before the construction of its own line to Buffalo, while still reaching the city over the tracks of the Erie, the Lehigh Valley had begun immense terminal improvements, covering in all about five hundred acres of ground, as is indicated elsewhere in what is told of the development of the coal trade of Buffalo.

1884. The West Shore, chartered and built as the New York, West Shore and Chicago; its line from New York City following the western shore of the Hudson River nearly to Albany, and running thence westward across the State on a line contiguous to that of the New York Central throughout most of its length. Reorganized under the name of the West Shore Railroad Company, and leased for 475 years to the New York Central and Hudson River Railroad Company in 1885.

1897. The Toronto, Hamilton and Buffalo. Organized in 1892; opened through in 1897. Successor to Brant, Waterloo and Lake Erie Railway. The majority of stock owned by the New York Central and Hudson R. R. Co., but the road controlled jointly by the N. Y. C. and H. R. R., the Michigan Central and the Canadian Pacific railway companies.

1898. The Wabash. Under an operating agreement with the Grand Trunk Railway of Canada, the Wabash Railway Company extended its train service to Buffalo, using the tracks of the Grand Trunk from Detroit to Black Rock and from Welland Junction, Ontario, to Suspension Bridge.

1907. The Buffalo and Susquehanna Railroad extended from Wellsville, N. Y., to Buffalo.

[henry6]

[quote user="NKP guy"]

  It's hard to imagine that parts of early railroading lasted as long as they did, especially in New York.  . 

.

 [quote]

That is quite true yet today...lots of railroading past still exists in some form or another all over.  I have found it in the countryside, yes, but also in cities like Boston, New York and Philadelphia.  In fact it is one of the things most marvled over on my Ride With Me Henry trips.  Commuter train rides will show one all that is still there.

[henry6]

[quote user="NKP guy"]

  It's hard to imagine that parts of early railroading lasted as long as they did, especially in New York.  . 

.

 [quote]

That is quite true yet today...lots of railroading past still exists in some form or another all over.  I have found it in the countryside, yes, but also in cities like Boston, New York and Philadelphia.  In fact it is one of the things most marvled over on my Ride With Me Henry trips.  Commuter train rides will show one all that is still there.

[Modelcar]

...Awesome pic's of early building in NYC....Just about the best one could expect....{Thanks to "Mike" for sharing}.  Personally, I have an interest in seeing the views of the "Late Great Penn Station", and these are just about the best I've seen to locate it from wide shots from above.

Had the good fortune to pass thru and look around that great station back decades ago.

[Anonymous]

I continue to be impressed by the quality and quantity of the photographs at your fingertips!

Since I don't want to start a new thread, Mike, can I simply ask here if you have any photos of Exchange Street Station in Buffalo?  It's another place associated with President Lincoln, and although I pass by the Art Deco Buffalo Terminal frequently, I never get downtown. 

Thank you very much for the great photographs you post here.

[NKP guy]

I continue to be impressed by the quality and quantity of the photographs at your fingertips!

Since I don't want to start a new thread, Mike, can I simply ask here if you have any photos of Exchange Street Station in Buffalo?  It's another place associated with President Lincoln, and although I pass by the Art Deco Buffalo Terminal frequently, I never get downtown. 

Thank you very much for the great photographs you post here.

[wanswheel]

I think the construction to the left of ESB was of the Sears Roebuck Building at the southeast corner of 9th Ave. & W. 31st. St., which provided a nice view of Tower A until the Post Office Annex was built.

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e390/MikeMacDonald/NYPO-PRR.jpg

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e390/MikeMacDonald/9thAve.jpg

The New Yorker Hotel under construction in 1929, and from the Empire State in 1931 and 1951.

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e390/MikeMacDonald/8thAve.jpg

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e390/MikeMacDonald/PennsylvaniaStatler.jpg

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e390/MikeMacDonald/Penn1951.jpg

Here's a 1924 aerial view of the neighborhood, with the Midtown grid somewhat tilted off the usual north-south axis.  On the left there's a vertical white line through the New York Central yard and a footbridge straddling the intersection of 10th Ave. & W. 30th St.  Penn Station is in the lower right corner.

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e390/MikeMacDonald/NYCPenn.jpg

Probably the footbridge was high enough that a brakeman didn't have to duck. I doubt many pedestrians actually used it very often. Looking north on 10th at 30th, entrance to yard on the left, 30th St. Station to the right of the picture.

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e390/MikeMacDonald/HRR8.jpg

Same location, north on 10th at 30th, after the Morgan Post Office has replaced the 30th St. Station and a spur of the High Line has replaced the footbridge.

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e390/MikeMacDonald/HighLine.jpg

[NKP guy]

Mike,

The building (under construction) to the left of the "Empty State Building"; is that The New Yorker Hotel?

[Modelcar]

.....Those are outstanding historic photos of RR history.

Wonder why they figured that coach needed double trucks at each end of it.....?  Perhaps that made it ride better, more or less cut the "bumps" in half with the suspension setup.

[wanswheel]

Quentin, yes, the Empire State Building in 1930...

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e390/MikeMacDonald/ESB1930.jpg

Excerpt from A Train Ride for Mr. Lincoln by Marc B. Grayson

Lincoln was reported as "pale and worn" when they arrived in Albany at 2:20 P.M. Brought by carriage to the State Capitol, he was welcomed by Governor Edwin Morgan, then escorted to speak in the Assembly Chamber. Morgan entertained the Lincolns at dinner. While the President-Elect held his evening reception, Mrs. Lincoln received other guests, including the Reverend Henry Ward Beecher, "whose sermons Mrs. Lincoln reads every Sunday night. An invitation was extended to Mr. Beecher to ride in the special train, but as he goes West, he was obliged to decline." Lincoln rose early the next day, Tuesday, February 19th, "far from well," due to fatigue. The special train detoured north. Ice floes had destroyed railroad bridges across the Hudson River at Albany. The "train passed slowly through (villages), affording the crowds an opportunity to gratify their curiousity and give vent to their patriotic feelings."

At Troy, the President's party was transferred to a new train of the Hudson River Railroad. The car provided for the President was described as: "one of the handsomest, perhaps, ever run in this country. The decorations are blue, with silver stars, and the rich sofas, carpeting and luxurious chairs give to the car the appearance of an elegantly furnished salon." Lincoln spoke briefly at Hudson, Rhinebeck, Poughkeepsie, Fishkill, and Peekskill. At 3 P.M., the special train arrived at the new 30th Street depot in New York, the nation's largest city with a population exceeding eight hundred thousand. Thirty-five carriages brought the travelers down Fifth Avenue and Broadway to the Astor House. Thirteen hundred policemen held crowds under control. Among those seeing Lincoln for the first time was Walt Whitman, surprised at the excitment in the city.  At the hotel, Phineas T. Barnum tried to get Lincoln to visit his famous museum. The New York Daily Tribune wrote: "There is something irresistible about Barnum that wins its way through the most flinty-hearted, and opens the gates of courts and palaces, (and) Presidents' reception-rooms."

Next morning, Wednesday, February 20th, Lincoln had breakfast with thirty New York business leaders at the Fifth Avenue home of Henry Grinnell, director of the Illinois Central Railroad. Guests included John Jacob Astor, Jr., Hamilton Fish, James Gallatin, and Thurlow Weed. Lincoln was driven to City Hall to be officially welcomed by Democratic Mayor Fernando Wood, later a leading peace advocate during the war. In January, Wood had proposed New York be a free city because he believed "a dissolution of the Federal Union to be inevitable." That afternoon, Vice-President-Elect and Mrs. Hannibal Hamlin arrived by train, and met the Lincoln's for dinner. Afterwards, while the President-Elect attended an opera, Masked Ball, by Verdi at the Academy of Music, Mary Lincoln held a reception. The New York Dally Tribune described Mrs. Lincoln as: "a lady of about forty years of age, below medium height, of full form and face, dark hair and blue eyes. Her nose is rather retrousse, her lips thin and compressed, her manner and carriage graceful and pleasing. She is a lady who would be pronounced to be 'fine-looking', but not beautiful."

Early Thursday morning, February 21st, the President-Elect escorted by a New Jersey delegation, crossed by ferry-boat to Jersey City. On both shores ships in the harbors were covered with bunting and flags, cannon bursts were fired, and brass bands played patriotic music. Lincoln was welcomed by Attorney General William Dayton, New Jersey's leading Republican, soon to be appointed as Minister to France. By 9:00 A.M., Lincoln was on board his train, "especially fitted up for the occasion by the New Jersey Railroad Company." It began snowing as the train departed for the half-hour ride to Newark. In a heavy snowstorm, twenty five thousand people saw the President-Elect in Newark as he was driven by carriage between rail terminals to change for another train to reach the state capitol.

4-4-0 and President Lincoln's car

http://memory.loc.gov/service/pnp/ppmsca/08200/08257v.jpg

http://memory.loc.gov/service/pnp/cph/3g00000/3g01000/3g01800/3g01832v.jpg

[Modelcar]

.....Yes, beautiful pictures of early railroad structures & infrastructure.

And I certainly do see the "Late Great Penn Station", in the background.  And.....the photos must be 1930.....I believe I'm correct to observe the Empire State Building in the background under construction.  It was finished in 1931.

[NKP guy]

What great photos!  Thanks so much for posting them, wanswheel.  It's hard to imagine that parts of early railroading lasted as long as they did, especially in New York.  This station and its scale, etc. remind me of the 1865 Union Depot in Cleveland. 

These photos make it easy to imagine Lincoln using this depot.  Thanks, too, for the illustration of his funeral train.

 

 

 

[Anonymous]

Great pictures, Mike.  I especially like the next to last post; what fantastic trackwork, switches within switches. 

No wonder Vanderbilt wanted, nay - needed a station or terminal befitting the NYC!

[wanswheel]

Long distance trains until 1871, and local trains to Spuyten Duyvil for many years.  It remained a milk depot until 1931, when demolished to build the Morgan Parcel Post Office.

 Looking northeast from 10th Ave. & W. 29th St., Penn Station in the distance.

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e390/MikeMacDonald/HRR7.jpg   ESB

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e390/MikeMacDonald/HRR2.jpg

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e390/MikeMacDonald/HRR3.jpg    

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e390/MikeMacDonald/HRR4.jpg

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e390/MikeMacDonald/HRRmap.jpg    map

[Anonymous]

Yes, we need Mike.  But 30th WAS a major station. In the June 1870 Travelers Guide it was the terminus of the New York Central and Hudson River Railroad with Cornelius Vanderbilt as President.

Over on the east side, the New York and Harlem station was at 26th St., and C. Vanderbilt was president of that line, also. This was the line that went up through White Plains and Chatham 4 Corners.  I'd bet Mike would have pictures of that station, too.

Art

[henry6]

Time for Wanswheel to show up!  I beleive he posted such a picture at one time...it was on the west side of Manhatten and pre dates the first Grand Central Terminal by quite a few years.

[NKP guy]

   I read recently about President Lincoln using the Hudson River Railroad to reach its station in Manhattan "at 30th Street."  I can't find a picture of it anywhere.  I know it wasn't a major station and didn't last long, but can anyone post a drawing or photo of it?