Amtrak's New Penn Station and Tunnels

[MerrilyWeRollAlong]

Finally a plan that makes sense.  No more ARC Tunnel to nowhere.  The expanded station would be under the block between 30th and 31st Streets with 7 new tracks to go with the existing 21 tracks.  If they can squeeze in one more track, then the Chattanooga Choo Choo could actually leave on Track 29

Artist rendition of New Portal Bridges

 Overview of Project

 Penn Station with new additions. 

[henry6]

Yes, this plan makes more sense.  But after almost a century of wrangling, positioning, fighting, yawing and jawing...all that stuff had to come first!  Too bad...the American System Of Mass Debate takes time, energy, makes noise, but prolongs the inevitable....or this could have been accomplished decades ago!

[Paul_D_North_Jr]

"You can always count on Americans to do the right thing—after they’ve tried everything else." - Sir Winston S. Churchill, at: http://jpetrie.myweb.uga.edu/bulldog.html 

[oltmannd]

Paul_D_North_Jr

"You can always count on Americans to do the right thing—after they’ve tried everything else." - Sir Winston S. Churchill, at: http://jpetrie.myweb.uga.edu/bulldog.html 

This arrangement does make more sense.  How did the ARC ever get as far as it did?

[Paul_D_North_Jr]

Agree - lots of good points to this.  I like the look of those bridges, too, and as a 'tied arch' they'll be pretty much immune to the poor subsurface soils and bearing conditions likely to be encountered there. 

ARC probably got as far as it did because of the perceived need, and a dearth of active proposals to fix it (which 'vacuum' is - as we all know - abhorred by power).  Another interesting question is whether NJT's ARC project was or became a proverbial 'sacrificial lamb' for this one - the ritual killing of the allegedly too-expensive project, and the corresponding required and necessary amount of political theater, bleating, and posturing has now had time to occur and be adequately seen.  With that inn place as 'political cover', now we can get on with the real business at hand . . .  "Paging Mr. Machiavelli, paging Mr. Machiavelli - Call for you on line 'T' for Trenton, sir" . . .   

- Paul North.

[Modelcar]

Wow.....Sure looks impressive.  Are we finally going to see this latest version of "Moynihan's" dream of improvements for this area of a super and impressive NYC Station.....come to reality.....?? 

Hope it is, and if so, will be fitting to Him.

[blue streak 1]

There are several problems I see with the new tunnel plan.

1. First at least it will all be in one station.

2. Additional costs vs the old ARC plan. Should get Christy really upset.

3. No way to pay for the carrying charges except maybe put in a $10 - $15 surcharge on all tickets (AMTRAK, NJ TRANSIT, PATH) to/from Manhattan. (not too likely)

4. The new Penn South station tracks show a capacity of 12 car EMU trains. That does not really help for train capacity for either AMTRAK's present 14 car limit at NYP or NJ Transit trains to various terminals. Longer trains are a must during rush hours according to various projections both AMTRAK and NJ Transit.

5. No future platform extensions shown east of Penn South or present NYP tracks 1-4 and the dead end stub of track 5.

6. No planning is shown for when the new New York City water tunnel is complete to allow for the eventual expansion north to GCT and east for additional tunnel(s) under the  east river.

7. There is no predestrian tunnel shown from PATH's 33rd street station to the new Penn south and as well to NYP. That will be very important in case either or both the old North River tunnels are closed for some reason for an extended length of time. At least then their could be some way for thru passengers to continue. ie AMTRAK BOS - NYP; walk to PATH ; PATH to Newark Penn station then AMTRAK again. Very bad? Yes but at least some way to continue a trip.

8. No indication of the loading guage (clearances of the route for maybe future full bi-level cars)?