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Work Begins on New NJT Rail Tunnel under Hudson River to NYC

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Posted by henry6 on Wednesday, June 10, 2009 3:18 PM

Oh, most definitely there will be new tunnels, bigger tunnels, someday.  It is unfortunate that no one is looking 20 or 30 or 50 years into the future and build at today's prices a system that will be out dated by the day they are opened!  There is a very short sightedness on the east side of the North River in not working with NJT to make something which can be more effective and more effective for a longer period of time.

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Posted by Paul_D_North_Jr on Wednesday, June 10, 2009 2:58 PM

A moment's thought led to this (OK, it was only for a moment, so don't take this as the "last word"):  Someday the Amtrak (PRR) tunnels will be replaced with larger and more modern ones.  For sure that won't be done by merely enlarging the existing bores - can't be done practically (at least not by any current method that I know of) - and the long-term huge disruption by taking either one out of service to replace it in-kind would not be acceptable.

So the replacements will be bored new, and with that realization comes the freedom to go someplace different - lower, alongside, headed to a different place, etc. - that would be more advantageous.  With current high-rise/ deep escalator and elevator technology, that might be workable.  After all, self-propelled people are far more flexible in "going with the flow" to where they need to go, and have a much smaller curvature standard and better grade-climbing capability than any train, right ? 

- Paul North.

"This Fascinating Railroad Business" (title of 1943 book by Robert Selph Henry of the AAR)
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Posted by aegrotatio on Wednesday, June 10, 2009 2:10 PM

 I gave some more thought to this tunnel and its exclusion of Amtrak.  The tunnel and station have provisions for a deep Amtrak tunnel to be built for service to a deep Amtrak platform.  There are provisions as well for a deep track to connect with Grand Central Terminal.

Any shallower and you get into huge trouble with structures, Water Tunnel One, subways, and geology.  I came around to NJT's thinking for the ARC tunnel.  There will be new tracks, tunnels, and proper modern platforms.  Using any part of today's North River Tunnel platforms at NYP is a mistake for commuter operations.

 

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Posted by jchnhtfd on Wednesday, June 10, 2009 7:36 AM

Correct on the water tunnel. It's dead on line with the planned new tunnels -- and is really really fragile! Can't say I blame the good folks at the water department for not wanting anyone to mess anywhere near it. When the new deep one is done and in service, then maybe. Who would have thought that New York was dependent on one and only one tunnel for its water supply?! But it is...
Jamie
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Posted by Paul_D_North_Jr on Wednesday, June 10, 2009 4:41 AM

Someplace recently I read an article or post that said there's a fairly new subway line just beyond the currently proposed terminal for the NJT tunnels.  Beyond that is the NYC water system's only supply tunnel from the Catskills - a replacement has been under construction for mnay years, and will be done in like 10 more years, but in the meantime NJT wasn't permitted to even do test borings in the vicinity.  Supposedly after the new water tunnel is done and in service, the old one will be taken out of service for inspection and maintenance, and then NJT can proceed with its investigation and design to extend its line further east.

Also, somewhere on the Newark Star-Ledger web site is an artist's rendering of the like 3-level interchange between the NJT line and the other levels at Penn Station (NY Penn).

- Paul North.

"This Fascinating Railroad Business" (title of 1943 book by Robert Selph Henry of the AAR)
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Posted by henry6 on Tuesday, June 9, 2009 8:01 PM

For a moment let me be a WA railfan, foamer, whatever.  Why not under the East River to the LIRR's LIC yards and be able to send trains on to Jamaica.  Regional Railroading.  That's the future in NY and other cities!

RIDEWITHMEHENRY is the name for our almost monthly day of riding trains and transit in either the NYCity or Philadelphia areas including all commuter lines, Amtrak, subways, light rail and trolleys, bus and ferries when warranted. No fees, just let us know you want to join the ride and pay your fares. Ask to be on our email list or find us on FB as RIDEWITHMEHENRY (all caps) to get descriptions of each outing.

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Posted by CShaveRR on Tuesday, June 9, 2009 7:58 PM
I heard Joe Biden thought it was an automobile tunnel. Well, it isn't Amtrak, right?

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/06/09/biden-mistakenly-claims-hudson-tunnel-accomodate-cars/

Carl

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Posted by jchnhtfd on Tuesday, June 9, 2009 6:55 PM

Well... it's a good start, so far as it goes! I have to admit that I'm among the lot which thinks that it should connect through, either to Grand Central and the new tunnel from there under the East River (it's not that far, dang it!) or to Sunnyside... but, half a loaf is better than no loaf, wot?
Jamie
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Work Begins on New NJT Rail Tunnel under Hudson River to NYC
Posted by Paul_D_North_Jr on Tuesday, June 9, 2009 12:42 PM

From the Newark Star-Ledger's article: 

http://www.nj.com/news/ledger/jersey/index.ssf?/base/news-14/1244520417178230.xml&coll=1

Well, kind of - mainly the new overpass for Tonnelle Ave. (existing) over the new tracks and tunnel site.

Schedule:  8 years until completion of the tunnel.  Anybody want to reserve seats on the 1st train through it ?

The article seems to be a pretty good summary of the project and of the concerns of its critics, for as short as it is.

- PDN.

"This Fascinating Railroad Business" (title of 1943 book by Robert Selph Henry of the AAR)

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