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Pilot Project To Screen Rail Passenger Carry-Ons

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Pilot Project To Screen Rail Passenger Carry-Ons
Posted by RudyRockvilleMD on Monday, April 26, 2004 10:02 PM
Two weeks ago the Transportation Security Administration announced it would undertake a pilot program to screen railroad passenger carry-on's at the New Carrollton, MD suburban station. This station is a stop for all MARC trains and many Atrak trains; it is also the terminal of Metro's Orange Line.

The project will start sometime in May, and it could last for 2 -3 months. One of its purposes is to determine if it is posible to screen railroad passenger's carry-on luggage without delaying trains or without causing passengers to miss trains. They will also consider what technologies are applicable to screening railroad passenger carry-on's.

However, the announcement raised some questions;
1. Who will do the screening? Transportation Security Administration
personnel or contractors?
2. Will the screening devices be film-friendly?
3. Will passengers be entitiled to request and receive a hand inspection of
their belongings?

The New Carrollton Amtrak/MARC station is situated so access to its platform can be limited to ticketed passengers only, and nobody is allowed on the platform until a train is due. It also has an enclosed area for a waiting room and ticket sales where passengers could be screened without being exposed to the elements.

However, manyl Amtrak and commuter rail stations do not have enclosed areas or controlled access. Several Amtrak, and many commuter rail, stations are merely a platform with a bus stop-like shelter with no access control. Assuming the screening of rail passenger's carry-on's is mandated how are passengers to be screened at such stations?

Should the screening of passengers' belongings also be extended to chartered trains or fan-trip specials?

Comments on screening of railroad passengers' carry-on luggage would be interesting.
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Posted by Anonymous on Monday, April 26, 2004 10:38 PM
Are buses next?

I suppose to an extent it is appropriate, but where are they going to stop?

50 years down the line are we going to have to screen our bags before we enter a building of any kind? Is this world going to be like going from one maximum security prison to another on a daily basis?

It's too bad things have to be this way.
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Posted by Wdlgln005 on Monday, April 26, 2004 10:57 PM
1) TSA will monitor any contractors hired to do the job
2) If they use airline screeners, it will not be film-friendly. In an age of digital, this will soon be a moot point. Compact flash & other memory chips will go thru fine.
3) I don't see how any train station will have the space for any airline style screening system. Too many points of entry to the side of the train. What we will see is trained dogs on the platform sniffing for whatever.
4) The preferred device will have to be some type of portable unit to check boarding passengers. Every bag will have to be identified & no bag can be left unattented for long periods of time. I wonder if there is a way to enclose the overhead racks on a train, as people claim their seat but spend time in the diner or lounge car.
5) The whole purpose will be to try to find explosives.
6) This enterprise will end up being a waste of money. Some passengers may be detained & miss their train THe problem we are confronting is with suicide bombers that would kill themselves & endanger others on the train.
Glenn Woodle
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Posted by Mookie on Tuesday, April 27, 2004 5:56 AM
QUOTE: Originally posted by Wdlgln005

1) TSA will monitor any contractors hired to do the job
2) If they use airline screeners, it will not be film-friendly. In an age of digital, this will soon be a moot point. Compact flash & other memory chips will go thru fine.
3) I don't see how any train station will have the space for any airline style screening system. Too many points of entry to the side of the train. What we will see is trained dogs on the platform sniffing for whatever.
4) The preferred device will have to be some type of portable unit to check boarding passengers. Every bag will have to be identified & no bag can be left unattented for long periods of time. I wonder if there is a way to enclose the overhead racks on a train, as people claim their seat but spend time in the diner or lounge car.
5) The whole purpose will be to try to find explosives.
6) This enterprise will end up being a waste of money. Some passengers may be detained & miss their train THe problem we are confronting is with suicide bombers that would kill themselves & endanger others on the train.

I agree - any safeguards you take, a terrorist will find a way around them. Compare this to counterfeiting - they haven't invented a bill that will stop counterfeiting.
They don't have a security system that will stop a terrorist bent on making his mark - literally!

She who has no signature! cinscocom-tmw

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Posted by zardoz on Tuesday, April 27, 2004 9:46 AM
A good idea, but one doomed to be next to useless.

What I dread is when the terrorists start using car (and truck) bombs (think Oklahoma City). Absolutely no way (yet) of stopping those!

Stop one leak and another will develop.
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Posted by vsmith on Tuesday, April 27, 2004 9:50 AM
The Metro Link train stops here are little better than bus stops, just a ticket machine and a bench in some places. Any would be terrorist is going to pick the weakest point to get on, what good is all this stuff going to be unless its installed at every point of entry on the system? That means gates, ticket booth, security kiosk, at EVERY station. Who's going to foot the bill for that?

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Posted by RudyRockvilleMD on Tuesday, April 27, 2004 8:58 PM
Originally posted by macguy

Are buses next?

I understand Greyhound is already screening passengers' carry-on luggage here in their Washington, DC station.

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Posted by Mookie on Wednesday, April 28, 2004 6:17 AM
And do we all feel a lot safer?

She who has no signature! cinscocom-tmw

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Posted by Hugh Jampton on Wednesday, April 28, 2004 8:28 AM
When travelling on the Eurostar between London & Paris or Brussels I am already forced to put my bags through one of them airport x-ray machines and walk through one of those personal metal detector portals.
If they were to impliment this on a larger scale people would just have to get used to turning up an hour and a half before the train departs. Just like we had to get used to the increased security at airports.
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Posted by dharmon on Wednesday, April 28, 2004 9:54 AM
QUOTE: Originally posted by zardoz

A good idea, but one doomed to be next to useless.

What I dread is when the terrorists start using car (and truck) bombs (think Oklahoma City). Absolutely no way (yet) of stopping those!

Stop one leak and another will develop.


Well actually, there are means of mitigating those risks..it just depends on your threshold of inconvenience. If you prevent vehicles from parking in front of buildings..like many building have in place since OKC, the effective radius of the blast pattern is reduced to causing superficial damage and casualties....so why bother. Most public buildings...courts, city halls, federal buildings, etc already have this inplace with concrete barriers to keep vehilces away. There are other things but I presume you don't want to get into a lengthy force protection discussion.
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Posted by vsmith on Wednesday, April 28, 2004 10:06 AM
QUOTE: Originally posted by dharmon

QUOTE: Originally posted by zardoz

A good idea, but one doomed to be next to useless.

What I dread is when the terrorists start using car (and truck) bombs (think Oklahoma City). Absolutely no way (yet) of stopping those!

Stop one leak and another will develop.


Well actually, there are means of mitigating those risks..it just depends on your threshold of inconvenience. If you prevent vehicles from parking in front of buildings..like many building have in place since OKC, the effective radius of the blast pattern is reduced to causing superficial damage and casualties....so why bother. Most public buildings...courts, city halls, federal buildings, etc already have this inplace with concrete barriers to keep vehilces away. There are other things but I presume you don't want to get into a lengthy force protection discussion.


What about a truck bomb in the Holland Tunnel, or the Big Dig in Boston, or on any one of hundreds of large bridges around the US, That is scary! [V]

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Posted by dharmon on Wednesday, April 28, 2004 10:31 AM
QUOTE: Originally posted by vsmith

QUOTE: Originally posted by dharmon

QUOTE: Originally posted by zardoz

A good idea, but one doomed to be next to useless.

What I dread is when the terrorists start using car (and truck) bombs (think Oklahoma City). Absolutely no way (yet) of stopping those!

Stop one leak and another will develop.


Well actually, there are means of mitigating those risks..it just depends on your threshold of inconvenience. If you prevent vehicles from parking in front of buildings..like many building have in place since OKC, the effective radius of the blast pattern is reduced to causing superficial damage and casualties....so why bother. Most public buildings...courts, city halls, federal buildings, etc already have this inplace with concrete barriers to keep vehilces away. There are other things but I presume you don't want to get into a lengthy force protection discussion.


What about a truck bomb in the Holland Tunnel, or the Big Dig in Boston, or on any one of hundreds of large bridges around the US, That is scary! [V]


A little harder to defend against. Many tunnels do not allow trucks to go through anymore...not for protection against bombs per se, but against the possibility of a Hazmat accident. But then again..we're talking Boston and NYC here..two places that should be isloated from the rest of the country anyway and turned in to penal colonies.
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Posted by RudyRockvilleMD on Wednesday, April 28, 2004 10:25 PM
This is for Hugh Jampton. If I am not mistaken the Eurostar is presently the only railroad operation where passengers are screened, and it works because access to the trains is controlled. I don't know if conditions have changed since the March 11 bombing in Madrid, but my experience with trips on the Eurostar in 1996 and 1998 security screening was only taken seriously in England, and it was non-existent in both Brussels and Paris.

What's important is rail passenger carry-on luggage screening has to be consistent, and it has to be done at all staions all of the time to be effective.
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Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, April 28, 2004 11:12 PM
safety 1st. we live in a imoral world. evil people. so we need a defense system to make amtrak safer . i like to ride amtrak. a miracle nothing bad happening yet. i live in fla. and drug runners hual moocho drugs coke and smookie. the gov. knew its been going on for years. drugs are a terrorists friends. destroying this great country inside out. such a crazy society let me out. the religion of some of the terrorists believe when they suicide bomb something , when they die each will have 6 virgins and all the wine to drink in (their) heaven forever.what a lie.

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