Sore Subject Matter

[Rick Gates]

Glen sounds as though he is inteligent, enlightened, experienced, and articulate enough that he should be in charge. [^]

[Anonymous]

Well Glenn, best of luck to you, whatever path you decide upon.

In A VERY real way, the one I feel sorry for is your foreman. For whatever reason, he has chosen to cut him self off from a part of life that will only cost him, in the long run. Though it sounds cliche`, I do have a number of friends who are black, and your foreman will never have any. By the same token, there are a number of white folks who have proven to me I have less than no use for. It causes me to laugh, in a sad way when I see various "systems" my fellow whites have devised over the years to perpetuate their prefered methods of cutting them selves short from a full lifetime experiance. I know some very good people that those in said systems will never get to know.

By the same token, and I need to say this to preserve full honesty, not every black man out there claiming greviance with the white man, is doing so with the most noble of intentions, there are scoundrels everywhere. There are some out there manipulating the whilte mans ability to bear guilt over "past eras" for their own gain, and one doesn't have to run into too many of those, to start building contempt. And bitterness (both, or should I say "either" way) is a funny animal. it puts people in unrealistic positions, all the way around.

I don't know you, nor your foreman, nor the exact specifics, but I'd go as far as to say, that any foreman would have to have a hole in his head to not be delighted with any employee who manages to show up sober, on time and ready to work, regularly , and performs the duties assigned to him with proficiency....He could, afterall, have far greater problems to have to deal with

[Anonymous]

Thank you once again for sending these emails in responce. I don't mean to come off like wimp or a punk on this matter. I for one, don't like the use of certain words now that I'm trying to change my life for the better. I've grown up around alot of racism in my life and at some point you really get tired of it. We all have, generally, the same body parts, but just in different packaging. When we eventually pass from this life, the Earth isn't going to care. It will just keep turning until that time it will not. So once again, thank you
to all that believe that a person is measured by their character and nothing else. BLESSINGS BE UPON YOU ALL!!! Keep on railroading!!!!!!!


Glenn
A R E A L RAILROADER...A T R U E AMERICAN!!!

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by wabash1

and i was told by a lawyer that you can tape phone conversations also with out that annoying beep. the only exception is that only one of the parties involved in the taping must know about it. . meaning i can tape my phone conversation with anyone who calls me. and i dont haft to inform them about it.

That's fightenly true, And even further liberalized when it comes to the workplace.

An employer may tape any phonecall, or monitor any e-mail made sent or received by it's employees if the equipment belongs to or is provided by the employer.

[wabash1]

and i was told by a lawyer that you can tape phone conversations also with out that annoying beep. the only exception is that only one of the parties involved in the taping must know about it. . meaning i can tape my phone conversation with anyone who calls me. and i dont haft to inform them about it.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Rick Gates

Glenn, Many states have laws against recording conversations unless all are notified in advance. For example: Linda whats-her-name taped Monica Lewinski's private confession about Bill Clinton. She lived in Maryland and was criminally charged for the recording. So, that may not be good advice. In any event, Larry had the best start.....document everything. Times, people, witnesses, place, curcumstances, etc. When ready, send copies to your union and insist that they be filed simultaneously with your state's Equal Employment and Opportunity Commission. You may also get some good and free advice from your local American Civil Liberties office. I say start with your union because that is the next step and most have clauses that require you exhaust actions through them before you go filing legal cases. Even if you don't get satifaction through any of this.....you should have a new found respect of your co-workers and bosses. Hope the best for you brother.

A concept known as 'Reasonable expectation of Privacy' is the key here. If the boss calls you into his office, he has reasonable expectation of privacy, but you don't. Out in a semi public work area, where multiple employees occupy or pass through in doing their regular job, or in a company lunch room, or restroom, neither of you do. Similarly, if the employee is taking the boss to lunch in his personal (employee) car, the employee has reasonable expectation of privacy, the boss doesn't.

Make that same trip in a company owned car, neither has reasonable expectation of privacy, just like the lunch room.

And at the diner they go to, neither has "REP" because it's a public place

it varies state to state, so it wouldn''t hurt to consult a lawyer PRIOR to using a tape made in such a way, but that doesn't preclude the employee from making the recording, then seeing if it's "good to go"

[Rick Gates]

Glenn, Many states have laws against recording conversations unless all are notified in advance. For example: Linda whats-her-name taped Monica Lewinski's private confession about Bill Clinton. She lived in Maryland and was criminally charged for the recording. So, that may not be good advice. In any event, Larry had the best start.....document everything. Times, people, witnesses, place, curcumstances, etc. When ready, send copies to your union and insist that they be filed simultaneously with your state's Equal Employment and Opportunity Commission. You may also get some good and free advice from your local American Civil Liberties office. I say start with your union because that is the next step and most have clauses that require you exhaust actions through them before you go filing legal cases. Even if you don't get satifaction through any of this.....you should have a new found respect of your co-workers and bosses. Hope the best for you brother.

[Anonymous]

The Diversity Depatment?

Thats like CP's "I got hit by a freight train" department

[wabash1]

antoniofp45
this is the way i am i dont sugar coat anything or beat around the bush. this seem to make some like me and others want to hurt me. I have never liked this political correct crap. when it is so much easier to say what is on your mind with regular words. The only thing i do try and do is use tact when saying something. but i have seemed to misplaced that in the last few years.

CBQ

This guy likes his job and just wants to get along with others. sometimes this is hard to do depending on where you work. and it seems like he is wanting a little respect from his bosses. ( my opinion) and he would like to have the racial remarks to stop. he is looking for someone to show or tell him how to accompli***his. the railroads paint this big picture on how we are going to work together and if anyone steps out of line he will be repreminded. but in this case the others are rewarded with promotions and the occasional laugh from getting at him with a joke. yes most people have learned to deal with it and moved on and others still strive to be the best and win respect. not a bad thing but in most cases a lost cause. and while he is under this pressure he has to take care of passengers needs with a phoney smile. I apllaude him for doing the best he can under these conditions. If he is a utu guy he might think of switching unions and letting them help him move thru the ranks and put pressure on the carrier to correct the problems.

[Anonymous]

The Diversity Dept. sounds like CSX's PR Dept. (Wait, As Far as I know they don't have one).
Of course a guy will lie to save his skin, thats why courts bring in witnesses! Racism is still a problem all over this country. I have heard arguments between neghbors in my community where the 'N' word was applied. Don't let him get to you! As for the recording thing, dosn't hurt to try. Could allways get one of those pocket size cassette recorders they sell for children I guess.
And remember the sunday school song children sing:
"Jesus loves the little children, all the children of the world, RED BROWN YELLOW BLACK AND WHITE, their all precious in his sight............" we are all people, and we are all the same, its just hard to find people who look the same! (If we all looked the same, you wouldn't be able to tell who identical twins were!)

[CBQ_Guy]

Diversity Department?!

What's next, I'm having a bad hair day department?

Boo Hoo. Some people are jerks and some, probably most aren't, but no one is perfect. Past generations seemed to have figured that out...and adapted. Sorry, but it just isn't a perfect world. Many need to learn that and move on.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by gfjwashdc

Good morning to everyone[:)]. I have a subject matter that can't go away and it still bothers me to this day...racism in the workplace(America)[V]. I don't know if any of you recall me posting a message relating to this a few months ago, but here's an update. In December, I and four of my coworkers(two black & two white) filed complaints against the foreman(who's white) that works on our shift. We filed them with our "Diversity Department", at which time we all got responces from the department informing us that they are investigating our complaints. As you recall, this is the same foreman which I've had a previous encounter with before, where my job was(still is) in jepardy[:(!]. Well, as of last month we all got notices in the mail from this department stating that they cannot find any wrong doing on the foreman's or the manager's part. The complaints put in by the white coworkers even state that the foreman has used the 'n' word when referring to me or the other black workers. One of them was threatened by him for palling around with us. Yet, the "Diversity Department's" method of investigation, was to ask the foreman directly if he said any such things[:o)]. Well, of course his answer is going to be 'NO!'...dimwits[:o)]. Plus, the manager(who was also mentioned in our complaints) denied that such actions exist and that we all are misjudging what he's saying[:(!]! I don't know about any of you, but if someone said something derogetory(especially in anger) directly or indirectly about me, there's no misjudging squat[:(!]! I respect
everyone who is part of the human race[^]. If I don't like and have no respect for you, it's probably I don't like 'YOU'...your personality. Everything else is irrelavent
to me. I remember some years ago, I was have a conversation with this older worker who lives up in Front Royal, Virginia. The older man was white, and he was talking about this other black fellow who lives in the town, but he used the word 'colored'. Well, he stopped for a moment and said to me, "I hope you weren't offended." After I chuckled for a bit, which I think he didn't like that, I replied with a smile, "Dude, we're ALL colored." Thus, we continued our conversation[;)]. I know for some of us, it's hard to change centuries of 'engrained' thinking and upbringing[V]. Just think about this everyone, if our sun was to suddenly disintergrate, WE'LL ALL BE DEAD[V]!! Then those petty things that we hold dear, such as greed, vanity, racism, etc., will not matter much anymore, because we will all just be ash floating around in that never ending void of space[:(]. Well, sorry to dumb all of you out this early in the morning, but I just wanted to vent, I apologize[|)]. For those of you that have a 'Diversity Department' or similar at your railroad, trust me when I tell you this...IT'S A JOKE[xx(]!! I know the one here at Amtrak could care less.



Glenn
A R E A L RAILROADER...A T R U E AMERICAN!!!!
Stay sane in an insane world! ! !

Glen, aren't you a better man than him? (Think about it) I understand your position, but if some low life called me "***" or "Pollack" (I'm mixed)[:D] I don't know that there is any hard and fast rule that says I have to take that as an insult.

What I'm saying is, it only bothers you cause you let it.

If I were in your shoes, I laugh in the guys face and say "You call me *** and expect me to help you?" (It'll bother him, but he won't DARE make a big deal of it, whats he gonna tell his boss?) get my drift? And I'll bet he stops.

Or, if you don't like that idea, buy one of thise small tape recorders that look like pens, record his little "act", then play it for his boss.

You probably won't be able to use the recording in court, but my guess is you won't need to go there.. [;)]

[AntonioFP45]

Wabash1

What you stated is very deep and well put! Personally, I like the fact that you didn't sugar coat it with "Political Correctness" hogwash;you kept it "REAL"!

I work for a school system where IMHO the liberal mentality seems dominant. While I enjoy my job, the PC just turns my stomach [V] and I regularly shock some of the "PC" people with straight doses of reality as you just wrote.[swg][4:-)] Don't change.

Glenn, don't be discouraged as I've been where you're at in the transit industry, years back. Keep a clear head and a personal log book. Document incidents, but don't let them see that it's getting to you.

God Bless and help you, guy![tup]

[wabash1]

this is a sore subject. I dont know if i can be of help but my view on the matter is this. As you said we are all colored. i happen to be colored white. this problem wont ever go away unless people dont let it bother them. when i use the term *** i dont have a basic color for it. to me it is any one who is trying to hurt rob or cheat me and it could be white , tan red or black. i have no color prefrence. ( i do like blue) when talking or making friends. Several years ago it was brought to my attention about military life. in that you make bonds with the people yo are with, and if you was in combat you were a team. if you come up on a site where there was blood. could you tell where that blood come from. ( black man white man indian mexican?) in other words blood is blood it has no skin color. we all put are pants on one leg at a time. This statement only affirmed my belief and i dont have a problem with racism. there is good and bad in every race. as for your problem go above local managment and file the report with the replies from the investigators. there is the aclu ( I take it you are black) naacp. The only advice i can give you is that when playing hard ball with the railroads its their game bats and balls you must have endurance cause they will change the rules at anytime to fit their needs. if you with stand the junk they throw at you. you will win. just keep great records of events and things they do to you and you can win.

[Anonymous]

Glenn-

Get a good lawyer.

LC

[Anonymous]

Report it to company HQ

DOGGY

[ironhorseman]

Call Dateline or 20/20 or 60 minutes. Get your videos and tape recorders and go under cover, if that's what it's gonna take. Of course your boss will lie when asked directly. His job is on the line.

Double standards are still everywhere. Women can yell sexual harassment in any work place and the managment/supervisiors HAVE to take her word for it as if it's true. The man is automatically guilty, no trial, no questioning, that's it, case closed, no contest. But when a man complains or contradicts about anything a woman said they won't hear it becasue men are always wrong or lying. Happened to a friend of mine. He took displinary action because the "business" didn't want to be dragged through a legal battle. For protection I'm not going to name any names or which work place it was.

[JoeKoh]

Glenn
i hope that more people can be open minded about others.maybe someday.
stay safe
joe

[cherokee woman]

Glenn,

Hope everything works out for you and your friends. That "boss" sounds like a real sob, and the "diversity department" sounds like it has nothing a**&^%$#s in it.

[jeaton]

Sorry to hear about that outcome. Unfortunately, use of the word "moron" instead of "boss" would probably cause major problems. I'm just one, but I hope that character is always my guide.

[tree68]

You can always take it upstairs.

Document, document, document.

[Anonymous]

Good morning to everyone[:)]. I have a subject matter that can't go away and it still bothers me to this day...racism in the workplace(America)[V]. I don't know if any of you recall me posting a message relating to this a few months ago, but here's an update. In December, I and four of my coworkers(two black & two white) filed complaints against the foreman(who's white) that works on our shift. We filed them with our "Diversity Department", at which time we all got responces from the department informing us that they are investigating our complaints. As you recall, this is the same foreman which I've had a previous encounter with before, where my job was(still is) in jepardy[:(!]. Well, as of last month we all got notices in the mail from this department stating that they cannot find any wrong doing on the foreman's or the manager's part. The complaints put in by the white coworkers even state that the foreman has used the 'n' word when referring to me or the other black workers. One of them was threatened by him for palling around with us. Yet, the "Diversity Department's" method of investigation, was to ask the foreman directly if he said any such things[:o)]. Well, of course his answer is going to be 'NO!'...dimwits[:o)]. Plus, the manager(who was also mentioned in our complaints) denied that such actions exist and that we all are misjudging what he's saying[:(!]! I don't know about any of you, but if someone said something derogetory(especially in anger) directly or indirectly about me, there's no misjudging squat[:(!]! I respect
everyone who is part of the human race[^]. If I don't like and have no respect for you, it's probably I don't like 'YOU'...your personality. Everything else is irrelavent
to me. I remember some years ago, I was have a conversation with this older worker who lives up in Front Royal, Virginia. The older man was white, and he was talking about this other black fellow who lives in the town, but he used the word 'colored'. Well, he stopped for a moment and said to me, "I hope you weren't offended." After I chuckled for a bit, which I think he didn't like that, I replied with a smile, "Dude, we're ALL colored." Thus, we continued our conversation[;)]. I know for some of us, it's hard to change centuries of 'engrained' thinking and upbringing[V]. Just think about this everyone, if our sun was to suddenly disintergrate, WE'LL ALL BE DEAD[V]!! Then those petty things that we hold dear, such as greed, vanity, racism, etc., will not matter much anymore, because we will all just be ash floating around in that never ending void of space[:(]. Well, sorry to dumb all of you out this early in the morning, but I just wanted to vent, I apologize[|)]. For those of you that have a 'Diversity Department' or similar at your railroad, trust me when I tell you this...IT'S A JOKE[xx(]!! I know the one here at Amtrak could care less.



Glenn
A R E A L RAILROADER...A T R U E AMERICAN!!!!
Stay sane in an insane world! ! !