UP - NS Merger

[Anonymous]

There has been speculation about a possible UP + NS merger.

We all know that the NS logo has the head of a horse, which represents their "Thoroughbred Service."

Would that make the UP the other end of the horse? [;)] [:D]

[CShaveRR]

No, No, No, No, No, No, No!

That is definitely not what makes UP the horse's other end!

[Anonymous]

NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! I might as well not be a railfan if it's just UP and NS that runs through here. I see a lot of UP power around here and I AM AFRAID THAT THIS IS TRUE!!!!!!!! NOW UP IS BUYING THIS EVOLUTIONJUNK, NS MIGH BUY THIS EVOLUTION JUNK, AND ALL THEY DO NO IS MERGE WITH CN, AND,THAT"S IT, I'll SELL MY CAMERA AND I"LL NEVER RAILFAN AGAIN. UP's GONnA DO THIS COPYRIGHT JUNK, AND NS WILL BE COPYRIGHTED. I WILL HAVE A LOT OF NS EQUIPMENT ON MY LAYOUT AND IF I HAVE TO PAY MORE I"M GONNA FLIP AND LEaVE MODEL RAILROADING AS WELL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! THIS IS HORRIBLE EVEN THINKING ABOUT IT, AND IF IT HAPPENS, I'm OUTTA HERE!

[Anonymous]

OK, OK, I was stretching it a bit there. I wouldn't leave the hobby, but I would be VERY MAD!

[Anonymous]

Yikes.
Given the rather poor history of rail mergers in the past ten years I think you would see a lot of controversy over this one. Although the ICC no longer exists, I would expect to see some interest from the Department of Justice and probably the Securities and Exchange Commission as well.

If NS is seriously considering merger, would it not make more sense to merge with BNSF? Would it not make more sense for UP to try and eat up CSX?

[JoeKoh]

Uncle pete cant do a merger now.especially with all the service problems for all the new mega roads.just my two cents
stay safe
Joe

[rrnut282]

If NS hadn't spent so much on Conrail, they would have had enough cash on hand to buy UP and have money left over.

[Anonymous]

I believe the merger atmosphere will stay "standard quo", all the class 1's have their hands full with being ready for the up-tick in business if the US economy takes off...
For now, alliances between them are working very well, are cheap, and flexiable.
Wall Street doesn't want any mergers...

[Anonymous]

The SP-UP merger was bad enough. That would for sure cause a meltdown.

[Anonymous]

I wouldn't welcome this either .... but really, I just started the thread to poke a little fun at the UP about being closer to the "end" of the horse that carries the tail, than the head.

[Big_Boy_4005]

QUOTE: Originally posted by erikthered

Yikes.
Given the rather poor history of rail mergers in the past ten years I think you would see a lot of controversy over this one. Although the ICC no longer exists, I would expect to see some interest from the Department of Justice and probably the Securities and Exchange Commission as well.

If NS is seriously considering merger, would it not make more sense to merge with BNSF? Would it not make more sense for UP to try and eat up CSX?

This observation does make a lot more sense. I recently saw two CSX locos pulling a string of empty hoppers westbound on UP's ex C&NW Chicgao to Twin Cities line just east of St Paul.

[Anonymous]

I also keephearing of an NS-BNSF merger. I have heard more, too. I think NS will merge with someone soon.

[wcfan4ever]

It's bad enough that WC was "Merged" into CN. I hate seeing all these mergers. I just wi***hey would all stop. Leave railroading how it is. It almost seems as if someday, railfans will be taking pictures of just one railroad...if it does every happen, it would most likely be UP. I think the UP is big enough and it doesn't need any more regaurdless if you call it a merger or not.

[mudchicken]

[(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D][swg][swg]

[Anonymous]

THIS WILL HAPPEN IN OUR LIFETIME THEN BNSF WILL EAT CSX FOR LUNCH

[ironhorseman]

I need one of those smileys where the eyes roll but this will do--[sigh]

Here we go again. Another merger rumor. We need a seperate forum for rumors. What I would think would be a great idea is instead of talking about merger rumors would be if we could get someone to explain how the merger process takes place. What goes into it? How does a railroad decide who it's gonna merge will and what makes a railroad decide it want's to be merged? And how come instances one railroad swallows another (UP-SP) while others retain part of their identity (BN-SF)?? Or think about when all those railroads merged became the Burlington Northern? Chicago, Burlington and Quincy and the Great Northern were in there and look what the final name was. And look what colors BNSF is now.

What was the terms of the BNSF merger? Was Santa Fe on it's way to failure like I've heard? Did the BN help it by merging? Can I find any articles in Trains Magazine about this merger?

Maybe if we understood how a merger goes down would that curtail the rumors? Or maybe making rumors up is all the fun?

[Anonymous]

But about mergers--does anyone find anything wrong with CN going to the Gulf of Mexico [:)]????

-Daniel

[Anonymous]

Hate to add fuel to the rumor mill - my brother lives just a few blocks past the west end of UP's Proviso Yard in Elmhurst, IL - he mentioned last night that he has been seeing a lot more NS power on UP trains lately. I don't want to assume that this means an imminent merger, but it certainly makes you wonder...

[Anonymous]

QUOTE:
Hate to add fuel to the rumor mill - my brother lives just a few blocks past the west end of UP's Proviso Yard in Elmhurst, IL - he mentioned last night that he has been seeing a lot more NS power on UP trains lately. I don't want to assume that this means an imminent merger, but it certainly makes you wonder...

Chances are that means absolutely nothing.
RRs use foreign power all the time, in fact it's really quite common place.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by macguy

QUOTE:
Hate to add fuel to the rumor mill - my brother lives just a few blocks past the west end of UP's Proviso Yard in Elmhurst, IL - he mentioned last night that he has been seeing a lot more NS power on UP trains lately. I don't want to assume that this means an imminent merger, but it certainly makes you wonder...

Chances are that means absolutely nothing.
RRs use foreign power all the time, in fact it's really quite common place.

BNSF and NS pool power a lot also

[overall]

The conventional wisdom around here says that UP will get CSX and BNSF will get NS.
I see both UP and BNSF power here in Nashville. There is an occasional NS unit also. These are rare however.

George

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by overall

The conventional wisdom around here says that UP will get CSX and BNSF will get NS.
I see both UP and BNSF power here in Nashville. There is an occasional NS unit also. These are rare however.

George

"Burlington" has had a route direct into Birmingham (Alabama) for quite a few years now hasn't it?

[Anonymous]

Dude's we really gotta lighten up. [8D][8D][8D]

This was by no means a "serious rumor" albeit, can any rumor truly be serious?

I started this thread just making a joke about NS having a Horse Head logo and if they merged w/ UP- then UP could be the "horses behind" (though they do a pretty good job of that on their own already.) [:D]

[Anonymous]

Would that mean that all U.P.'s locos would be painted black and have a throughbred on the side . I just can't imagion a high nose loco in armour yellow .

[rrnut282]

FYI
the thundering herd of high-nosed diesels is starting to thin as NS culls the gene pool(roster).

[Anonymous]

Point well taken. However, from what I was told, there has been a noticeable increase in NS power over the last several weeks on the UP West Line here, as compared to the last 2-3 years (I have seen quite a bit of NS and CSX power on the UP ever since Conrail was carved up a few years ago, and before that point, Conrail power was very common west of Proviso - particularly on the Elkhart IN to North Platte run-through Conrail and the UP ran (and CNW up until 1995). Again, I agree that an increase does not by any means guarantee that UP and NS are even discussing a potential merger, but it would be interesting to learn the real reason behind the sudden increase in NS power on UP trains (perhaps railroads pay back horsepower hours in batches)??? Any ideas?

[Anonymous]

UP is having some major service problems. They're pretty short on power because network velocity is down several MPH. I'd suspect they're leasing short term power from elsewhere to help get them through it.

[espeefoamer]

The railroads are about as big as they can get .Another merger,and the road would collapse under its own weight.[:0]

[rrnut282]

Power plants usually buy coal on short term (1-2yrs) contracts. Every once in a while they will buy from another source to keep their preferred source honest on the price. Most likey what you are seeing is the result of coal coming from a different mine with run-throught power. Something similar happens with loose car-loads when two railroads get together and say, "if I run a full train from xxx to you at yyy by this time, and you run it on to zzz before such and such a time, we can undercut the other guys and make a ton of money. " If they make money they keep doing it, if say 6 months later, they aren't making enough, they'll stop. That is only one possible explanation for the ebbs and flows of locomotives you see.

[tree68]

The Wall Street Naives would probably think a UP-NS merger would be a match made in heaven - they could now run trains coast-to-coast and keep all the money. Of course, they wouldn't be running the trains, just keeping all the money. The poor suckers in the trenches would be expected to keep everything running. Can you say "melt-down"?