Why my town is so stupid!

[Anonymous]

As some of you know, I live in the small town of Langenburg, Saskatchewan of about 1000 people. You may also have heard me say that on the CP line that goes through the trains are restricted to 10mph. Many people are rightfully upset that the trains go so slow and have been in contact with CP trying to do something about it. Like the others, I hope that they upgrade the tracks and bring the speeds up soon. But this time, they've gone WAAAAAY to far and in fact I really can't say that I'm proud to live in Langenburg! The town council wants the trains to stop blowing their horns! Yes, just stop! They actually had the nerve to contact CP and Transport Canada to ask if this would be possible! How very intelligent it must have made them look! The response was that such a thing would not be possible unless level crossings with gates were installed. We have three crossings in town (the tracks cut the town in half) and with less than 10 trains a day that go as slow as they do putting gates would be a waste of time and money. This story made the front page of our local paper and in it our mayor, intelligent fellow that he is (I'm using sarcasm there), is quoted as saying that "train whistles don't do anything except wake you up at 3:00 in the morning." The editor of the newspaper is a railfan and has model trains. I wish he'd write an editorial in saying how fooli***his really is.

[BaltACD]

The horn is the only wepon an Engineer has against the Brain Dead that are soon to be Real Dead at road crossings.

How powerless can an Engineer feel as 20000 tons moving at 40 MPH is bearing down up the Brain Dead individuals that persist in either trying the 'beat the train' (tie and you lose...big time) or stop on or too close to the crossing and are totally oblivious to anything transpireing around them - Like the oncoming train Horn Blaring, Headlight Bright, Ditch Lights Flashing and Bell Ringing. Welcome to the world of the soon to be DEAD!

[edblysard]

Well Mitchell,
Heres an idea...
You have a word processor, and I assume a printer?
You have the address for the editor of your local paper, and they have a "letter to the editors" section?

So, write...
You seem to have a very well honed ability to make sense with the written word, so help the editor out, and explain why not blowing the horn, and going real slow are a problem.

It just might be that the people in your town really dont understand why the horn is mostly for their protection, so explain it to them, in words they can understand.

Use your talent, ehh?

Ed[:D]

[Anonymous]

Well,

What a great way to create a rift between the town and the CPR. CPR was there first! The CPR PUT Langenburg on the map. I agree with you!

BUT, the CPR wishing to be good neigbors want's to work with Langenburg. Here' s my prediction of what the outcome will be:

-They'll do a 'research study' of noise pollution, costs $$$$-paid for by the town and maybe a little by Sask. Government

- If they decide to go whistle free (exemption to RULE 14), they will have to put up gates at the crossings, CPR may request the speed to be rasied to 30MPH.

[rrnut282]

A question, if I may. Do the trains go through town so slow because of a town ordinance (like my neck of the woods) or because of track conditions? If it's the former, the town has the power to "fix" the slow moving train problem themselves. If it's the latter, grin and bear it... Look on the bright side, at least they are talking instead of ignoring each other. Any improvement to the situation will require a working dialog between the town and CPR.

[Modelcar]

...Mitchell: Your plight sounds familiar. This town here of ours...[ about 75,000 pop.], has a 30 mph ordinance of through train traffic and as i've commented before, they are trying to quiet the train horns...and the way it looks it might be accomplished this year some time. Most if not all the crossings have lights and gates but one can drive around them...[they do not span the entire width of street]....30 mph seems pretty reasonable but the no horn blowing is just plain stupid in my opinion and I hope a lot of others. [8D]

[mudchicken]

Sask:

Do not feel like the Lone Ranger up there. There are plenty of towns down south of the border in the lower 48 that can rival your city fathers in creating "stupid zones". There are towns down here in multiple places that imposed 25-35 MPH speed restrictions through town (District Speed = 60) and then complain about blocked crossings account of slow moving trains(!!?) Write your letter as Ed says and carbon copies to Operation LifeSaver (http://www.operationlifesaver.ca/) in Toronto, your local Transport Canada and CTA offices, and the CP Chief Engineer Mike Roney in Calgary .

Politicians suddenly get cold feet when the public questions their presence of mind.

Bani***he mayor and town council to Manitoba (a short walk to the east, if they'll even consider taking them in...) and elect some folks with a little gray matter left between the ears....ehh?

Mudchicken
[banghead][banghead][X-)]

PS - These clowns will advocate traffic circles at the crossings next?

[Anonymous]

The solutions all come down to one thing -- money.

If the town decides they want to have the gate crossings installed at their expense, then the railraod would be happy to stop blowing their horns.

Depending on the size of your town it could really make a huge dent, they may not be able to afford it at all.

If you write a letter, you should propose that everyone who is against the sound of the trains blowing their whistles chip in to pay for the gates, or at least the gates that are closest to the most complainers.

At least now you can say the complainers have been thrown a bone.

[JoeKoh]

Even with the gates and flashers some people are still brain dead.Keep the horns.
stay safe
joe

[Anonymous]

If you don't want the horns then spend the money to eliminate the grade crossings!!!

[Kozzie]

QUOTE: Originally posted by JoeKoh

Even with the gates and flashers some people are still brain dead.Keep the horns.
stay safe
joe

I agree with JoeKoh.
Downunder we have had accidents at crossings even WITH lights and boom gates operating! The brain dead are everywhere!
All trains here in Queensland must sound horn at all crossings, lights and boomgates or not.
I ask all that complain about train horn noise:
"Did they move in to the area before the railroad?" I bet they didn't! It's the same mentality of those who move into a house close to an irport runway then porceed to complain about aircraft noise. What a joke...

Cheers

Kozzie

[Anonymous]

Hey Mitchell,
Ed's right, if you can educate the people as to why the train blows its horn at grade crossings they might see the light (if they don't get the point the "light" might be the last thing they see). Some of the "Brain Dead" are only "Brain Dormant" and with a little TLC they might wake up and understand how important it is.

Jeff

[Anonymous]

Down in Madison Wisconsin the city put a ban on railroads (WSOR) from using their horns within the city limits. The railroad complied . They would use their horns only if there was imminent DANGER . Now the car / train colisions have increased , Even with warning lights & gates at the crossings. So the bossman told them to start using your horns regardless of the citys so called ban. Now they want to issue citations to the railroad . Folks........ they use them for a REASON,........ WHAT NEXT,.......... The banning of emergency vehicle sirens, PS; We do know what your going through up yonder.

[Anonymous]

OH WOW, boy can I sympathize with you!

I live in a Small town of Hudson, M&O Subdivison, Little jerk-water town of about 5000 people, love it, take the train to school every morning. almost every morning.

The Train travels through a few Cities, Hudson, St. Lazare, Vaudreuil, before connecting with the main CPR track in Vaudreuil, Subdivision Vaudreuil.

Now the people who live in St.Lazare, are spoiled brats, that would actually, in written word wrote to the gazette and said they would like the RR track done away with all together.

Thats merely a crime in itself.

to the point, the want no whistles too. It's never going to happen because of the various laws we have in Quebec about Single Track, RR warning devices and whistling.

SO when this person wrote this article, about 15 Hudson people wrote to the editor, telling htme that their letter did a diservice to jsut about every person on the planet. The train was a nesesity and had been around for ages, if it isn't broken, leave it alone.

The very weird thing though, It's often the people who complain, who have no heritage, who know didaley Squat about their history who complain about the Trains. And to prove my point even further, the most Grumbling comes from the town of Vaudreuil, where a new development had just finished being built, byt the tracks, right behind it to be percise, and the people have jsut moved in 2 or 4 or 6 months ago. these houses are about a foot and a hlaf by two feet, spaced right together so you can see your neighbors bathroom.

Oh yes, charming

Here in hudson, were all old timers, houses are 60+ years old, and Everyone loves the train, you'll be beaten up if you pop the line "the train is so annoying because..."

Nobosy wants the Train whistles to stop, matter of fact osmeone wrote to the Editor, from Hudson, saying that he could rememebr when it was a Steam whistle.. and how that sounded, it was amazing to know that! even i learnt somehting..

FYI, the last steam Train to pass through Hudson was 1960.

Also FYI, There were more thne 30 trains a day on the single Track through hudson, mixed freight, and because Hudson is on the water, it used to serve as an ice factory, were ice was cut from the river, put into freezer RR cars and distributed to gouses wiht ice boxes, back in the day...

FYI again, The CPR Canadian used to travel through Hudson..

now there is only one train a day, in and out...it's sad, the line used to be a direct link to Ottawa, but that got ripped up and now it's nothing more then a dead end at rigaud.

so these people that complain, really know nothing about where their town came from, because frankly, it was most likely the RR that made the town, and that can be said about any town In Canada.

[Anonymous]

Oh, and jsut to back Ed up I use "letter to the Editor" feature probobly about 8 times a year or so.


it gets your message across..

But expect somehting back, cause i always get an evil letter back [:D]

[Mikeygaw]

well, what do you expect from politicians? they're about 100x worse than the standard brain dead...

[daveklepper]

You might want to visit the Association of American Railroads website and get all the information you can on highway railway crossing incidents and use this information in your letter(s) to the editor and ask whether the Mayor and others asking for no horn blowing want to be responsible for unfavorable changes in the most important statistics in this matter. Enough said! I would hate to be in the Mayor's shoes if an unfortunate incident occured shortly after horn blowing was stopped! Dave

[Anonymous]

I do know that Frisco cooperated with a small city who also had an ordinance again the railroad engine blowing their horn. There was a double track through this town. The engine would ring the bell while in town. If there was a train on the second track then the trains would use the horn. I don't have any info on grade crossing accidents with in this town. I actually think that since Frisco cooperated with them that there were few. Maybe some of the other guys might have more info about this situation.

[Anonymous]

Mine really is. I have THE WORLD"S SLOWEST POST OFFICE!!!!!!!!! I'm still waiting for the Model Railroader to get shipped to me. It's a small town of 800 that has a branch line there. Most of the roads in the area are currently being detoured because the main highway that we always use is getting detoured RIGHT AT OUR EXIT!!!!! Supposedly(sp), this will stay in effect for over a year. Some days I feel like living somewhere else.

[tree68]

You want to stop into the "Hit By Train" thread that's currently ongoing, as well as "Chilling Stories . . . . . collisions. ". More "color" for your well-reasoned argument.

[Anonymous]

There are a couple of approaches I would use here. Forget the letters to the editor- the public has formed their own opinion, don't confuse them with facts. Instead, you might go and talk to the industries being served by the railroad. Often they are asked for input into decisions like this...(being in the Deep South of the USA, their input also would include financial ah, considerations, to local politicians). If you can link a loss of timely delivery of their freight to safety issues, you could probably drum up some support.

In short, if you hit them in the pocketbook, their hearts and minds will surely follow...

Talk about dumb laws, though. The state of Alabama passed a law last year prohibiting grade crossings from being blocked more than 15 minutes. I am just a pore ol depty in rural Alabama, but my partners and I aren't sure the local traffic court is ready for us to chase down and cite an engineer of a 50 car plus freight to catch his license, registration, AND proof of insurance....

[zardoz]

I have a much better idea for ALL crossings.
*Eliminate all gates, flashers, & bells.
*Prohibit all whistling even in an emergency.
*Send letters to every house informing them of this decision, also stating that any lawsuit against the railroad for any damage or injury WILL NOT be heard.

This way, it becomes a free-for-all. Motorists will be forced to actually pay attention to what they are supposed to be doing. If they do not....then SPLAT.

Each accident should have photos taken and shown on the front page of the local paper.

Once the surviving drivers realize they cannot sue the railroad, and once they realize that THEY THEMSELVES are responsible for their actions, perhaps then there will be a change in the thinking of the population. But probably not.




Back in the "good old days" when I was operating, there was a popular pasttime in Chicago at night of deliberately stopping on the tracks in front of a moving train. You could tell it was deliberate because either the car would go over the crossing, see the train, stop and back up on to the tracks; or they would just stop on the tracks and give the train the finger. This was real popular on the Skokie line (all 10mph running). If you started blowing the whistle, they just sat there laughing and continuing the finger display.

What I soon discovered, was that when these idiots would stop on the tracks, I would wait just a bit, then I would go dark. Turn off all lights--headlights, number board, class, everything. Then wait a few more seconds then start with the whistle. In no time flat these idiots would chicken out and leave in a hurry. Worked every time.

[Mookie]

QUOTE: Originally posted by zardoz

I have a much better idea for ALL crossings.
*Eliminate all gates, flashers, & bells.
*Prohibit all whistling even in an emergency.
*Send letters to every house informing them of this decision, also stating that any lawsuit against the railroad for any damage or injury WILL NOT be heard.

This way, it becomes a free-for-all. Motorists will be forced to actually pay attention to what they are supposed to be doing. If they do not....then SPLAT.

Each accident should have photos taken and shown on the front page of the local paper.

Once the surviving drivers realize they cannot sue the railroad, and once they realize that THEY THEMSELVES are responsible for their actions, perhaps then there will be a change in the thinking of the population. But probably not.




Back in the "good old days" when I was operating, there was a popular pasttime in Chicago at night of deliberately stopping on the tracks in front of a moving train. You could tell it was deliberate because either the car would go over the crossing, see the train, stop and back up on to the tracks; or they would just stop on the tracks and give the train the finger. This was real popular on the Skokie line (all 10mph running). If you started blowing the whistle, they just sat there laughing and continuing the finger display.

What I soon discovered, was that when these idiots would stop on the tracks, I would wait just a bit, then I would go dark. Turn off all lights--headlights, number board, class, everything. Then wait a few more seconds then start with the whistle. In no time flat these idiots would chicken out and leave in a hurry. Worked every time.

There is just a small section of larceny in my mind that just loves this!

[Anonymous]

Thanks, for all of the responses, everyone! In response to the question asked about why the trains are all so slow, it's due to track condition. The speed restrictions came into effect sometime last year. CP doesen't seem to be in a really big hurry to upgrade the track and says it will get done probably in 2005 or 2006. I think that some of the crews occaisonally do go a bit faster than the 10mph limit, though. There's been a lot of resentment toward the railroad because of the slow speeds and that's obviously why the idea of no horns was thought of. Our fearless leader says he really feels that this is something that should be followed up on. As far as the town actually spending money on the project, they're way too cheap! There's enough projects in the town already that they're begging people to give money too. The thought of a letter to the paper did actually cross my mind. I'm not sure if I will, though. The editor of the paper is a pretty smart guy with a level head and has is own column where he will write his opinion, even if sometimes it isn't always what everyone agrees with. I wouldn't be surprised if he wrote in something about it.

[daveklepper]

I don't like that forget letter to the editor bit . I've always respected the position that the USA has an educated citizenry and that facts presented calmly and thoroughly can bring popular opinion around on important issues. People are concerned about the safety of their family and friends. That is why we are willing to put up with a lot of stuff that ten years ago would have produced riots at airports and at the entrances to public buildings . The USA is a democracy and although there are a lot of stupid things being done (like basic USA ground transportation policy), the USA, Canada too, would not work at all if the people were dumb. But still contacting industries after you get your facts and presentation together is an extremely good idea! Dave Klepper

[tree68]

As much as we'd like to think that we have an informed citizenry, it just isn't so. Case in point (not railroad, but...) is the new ambulance service we have in our area. Despite over two years of regular articles in a weekly paper, quite a few appearances in the daily paper, numerous TV news stories, placards in post offices and local businesses advertising a subscription programs, and a host of other items, many people just don't know we exist. All they know is that if they need an ambulance, they'll dial 9-1-1 and we'd damn well better show up, and soon. The name on the side of the rig is of no consequence.

On a railroad note - despite as many as 8 crossings a day, I rarely encounter a train at several crossings I pass frequently. The uninitiated could easily surmise that the line is no longer in use. In defense of the poor home buyer who discovers himself next to a "suddenly" active rail line, the realtor could very truthfully say that they've never seen a train on the tracks. Small consolation when one comes through at 2 am. Every Day.

Truth be known, about the only solution that would make a lot of people happy with regard to railroads would be to elevate the railroad (or sink it below ground level). Just don't be building anything that will detract from my view or otherwise interrupt my desired daily routine.

Along the lines of the Water Level Route (the CSX Chicago Line), the CSX Montreal Secondary appears to have been constructed in such a way as to minimize the number of grade crossings. They are far from having eliminated them, but it's still better than it could have been.

[corwinda]

QUOTE: Originally posted by erikthered
Talk about dumb laws, though. The state of Alabama passed a law last year prohibiting grade crossings from being blocked more than 15 minutes.

In Oregon it's 10 minutes. (And not a new law; either. Late 70s or early 80s I think.)

[Anonymous]

I did ambulance work in Phoenix, Arizona for a while. BNSF had a fairly heavy trafficed line paralleling Grand Avenue and terminating nearly in the center of Phoenix. One of our stations was located about two blocks away and we all dreaded rush hours- because the railroad was active, automotive traffic was active, and it seemed everybody was deaf to sirens... No matter when the call came, we could reasonably be assured that it would be "on the other side of Grand"... some real scary moments just getting there.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE:
What I soon discovered, was that when these idiots would stop on the tracks, I would wait just a bit, then I would go dark. Turn off all lights--headlights, number board, class, everything. Then wait a few more seconds then start with the whistle. In no time flat these idiots would chicken out and leave in a hurry. Worked every time.

[:D] I love it, beat them at their own game! [:D]

[HEdward]

Oy vey! I stopped by to see what the Railfans were talking about and it's POLITICS! Is there any message board on the internet that isn't full of messages decrying the lack of common sense among those in elective office?

Here in Danbury CT they haul their trash, refuse, garbage through the streets in open trucks past homes, shopping centers and eateries. Meanwhile, the Housatonic has lines heading out of town in every direction. Having worked in one of the local shopping centers, where the truckers parked, sometimes for 2-3 days in the hot summer sun, and filled the air with their foul stench, I know first hand how disgusting it is. The rail lines are not near any public areas and can move the cargo more efficeintly but they still use trucks. Why? Because politicians don't want to improve the quality of life, they just want to get re-elected without ever solving anything.