"California Building 220 MPH High-Speed Train from San Francisco to LA"

[joe-daddy]

A quick look at the stock prices of railroads vs airlines and one can see what Wall street believes is ultimately viable.  As fuel prices continue to climb, and they surely will, projects like this one are a part of what must change in America for survival.  Impossible you say, look at the money going into lite rail almost everywhere. 

And build a nuclear plant to power it while they are at it!  Zero fossil and no CO2.  A green solution if there ever was one. . . 

 

Coffee at Dennys if earth is not turning in 2 years.  

Just my highly opined 2 cents here 

 Joe Daddy

[Phoebe Vet]

These arguments always remind me of that book I read as a child:

"The Little Engine that Couldn't"

"I think I can't, I think I can't"

 

[alphas]

Oops.  Make that countries, not counties.  Just a slight difference.

[alphas]

Unless CA can get the federal government to supply most of the money, which could be a possibility given the size of CA's delegation, no way the state can aford it.   And I'm glad to see that someone finally mentioned that the French (and many other counties people hold up as examples) don't have to worry about the environmentalists like we do in the USA.   I've wonder if they could have even built a transcontinental railroad across the USA if they had to work with the same environmental restrictions as the country has now (and I'll be shocked if there aren't even more starting in 2009).

[Anonymous]

Comment. Hi speed rail has been talked bout in Calif for many years.

I remember in 1990 during forum in Sacramento some of the discussion.

One comment I remember was Mr Vranich (?) talking about TGV. The comment I remember the most was the fact that France does not have Enviromental Impact Reports(that can be attacked in court).

      I think Calif has gotten past much of the complaints. KQED had on there forum(radio) show a discussion a couple of weeks ago. I was impressed that Calif has finally tried to get this to the voters.    Quinton(?) Kopp (former SF Supervisor, Ca State Senator, and currently a Superior Court Judge in San Mateo County) is one of the better spokes persons on this.

     Forgive me for my inaccuracies on this as I'd not paid it much attention in the last 15 years.  and was very surprised just how far along this has gotten.

Thx IGN

[ndbprr]

Once again we have another topic that is just plain wrong.  Election year pandering to the common man for his vote and nothing based in reality.  Wishful thinking will not see this built and the article say's very plainly that the electorate will vote on the proposal to fund a bond effort to study it not build it.  I wish there was a way to collect money from people who think because a state or federal official or agency proposes something in an election year it will happen.  We are still waiting for the third airport in Chicago thirty years after it was proposed.  By the time that gets built airplanes will have been replaced with something else and this will follow the airport.  I don't want to be on atrain that goes 220 mph that parallels the San Andreaas fault and there is no way they will solve that problem.

[Tulyar15]

Strange, but the French have the fastest train in the world 380 mph and they build the biggest airplane. So how can they get it done and we can't? 

This is a good idea and needs our support.

Just my

Joe 

 

 

I'd be very wary about drawing comparisons with the French. They may have the fastest trains on their high speed lines but the rest of their network is very poor - typicallty only two trains a day. As for planes, the A380 may be assembled in France but the wings and engines are made in Britain! How long the French will be able to carry on subsisiding their railways, and for that matter other public services, remains to be seen given the parlous state of the French economy. I think the Spanish railways will shortly eclipse the French. Now there's a country that gets on and does things.

[blue streak 1]

joe-daddy:

If you think getting aircraft built is indicates French where with all forget it. I have flown Airbus products and nicknome like disposable airplanes, when they break they break very hard and for a long time, Had one that the same problem happened every day even though airbus rep said it was fixed. Fiffie (french dog) and now the A-380 is in service they are 2 1/2 years late on deliverys. Give me a boeing any day although the B-787 has some the same problems meeting delivery as the ?A=380.

[Dakguy201]

The quote used as the topic of this thread is the headline of a magazine article.  The article itself does not say "building" it uses the phrase "begun implementation".

In short, there is no dirt being moved anywhere.  At best, trees are being cut to provide paper on which studies will be printed.  

[tatans]

Sure, and the same between Calgary and Edmonton( this rumor was started in (1935) estimates today to construct this line are between $ 790 million and a more realistic $925 billion(cdn) with construction starting in 2205.

[al-in-chgo]

Having ridden the Acela four times, this is something way past due.  I'd much rather see our governments spending money building 300 mph train service all across our nation than to see us run empty buses and light rail that is only used 3 hours a day. 

With the Acela you can go from downtown NYC to Baltimore or Washington DC in about the same time you spend getting from your hotel to the door of your airplane.

Yes there is red tape, but nothing happens quickly anymore.

Strange, but the French have the fastest train in the world 380 mph and they build the biggest airplane. So how can they get it done and we can't? 

This is a good idea and needs our support.

Just my

Joe 

 

 

Not only the fastest train and biggest (commercial) airplane, but also the safest nukes, [I have been told],most thorough pre-natal care and most free time off from work -- at least, so far. Arguably the best-nourished and probably the best food.  When I visited there, I was all primed and ready to hate the place, but it grew on me.  

The French got these things because they lobbied for them and got the central government to make them priorities.  The U.S. has different priorities at the tippy-top but I can't say any of them lest I morph into "Politics."  

 

[al-in-chgo]

BTW I don't want to come off as an old toad, but are this guy's credentials to be found?

Consulting Engineer?  Professor?  Economist?  RR Specialist?  Railroader?  Politician?  Futurologist?  Gadfly?  Flunked out of community college? 

A really great visual presentation even if the paradigm is "book" rather than desktop publishing.

But a good job of word processing does not necessarily an expert make. 

[al-in-chgo]

Let's see...the guvernator is trying to figure out how to close a huge (15-20 Billion dollars) gap between revenue and budget, nobody in either party likes his proposed strategies, and all of the budget-using constituencies are already screaming about cutbacks that still leave them way ahead of two years ago.

I don't think we need a triple-A map to see how far this is going to go. 

Right.  Basically what Gov. Schwarzenegger did was defer the deficit with more debt, but in all fairness I don't know what else he could have done. 

 

[Mailman56701]

Having ridden the Acela four times, this is something way past due.  I'd much rather see our governments spending money building 300 mph train service all across our nation than to see us run empty buses and light rail that is only used 3 hours a day. 

With the Acela you can go from downtown NYC to Baltimore or Washington DC in about the same time you spend getting from your hotel to the door of your airplane.

Yes there is red tape, but nothing happens quickly anymore.

Strange, but the French have the fastest train in the world 380 mph and they build the biggest airplane. So how can they get it done and we can't? 

This is a good idea and needs our support.

Just my

Joe 

 

 

  They also have a double-digit *sales* tax rate, let alone income tax rates, etc.

  How do they do it ?  Thats how.  Its not rocket science. 

  At the same time, they, like almost every other European country, are seriously wondering how all their social services are going to be paid in the not so distant future, due to low/declining birth rates.

[joe-daddy]

Having ridden the Acela four times, this is something way past due.  I'd much rather see our governments spending money building 300 mph train service all across our nation than to see us run empty buses and light rail that is only used 3 hours a day. 

With the Acela you can go from downtown NYC to Baltimore or Washington DC in about the same time you spend getting from your hotel to the door of your airplane.

Yes there is red tape, but nothing happens quickly anymore.

Strange, but the French have the fastest train in the world 380 mph and they build the biggest airplane. So how can they get it done and we can't? 

This is a good idea and needs our support.

Just my

Joe 

 

 

[blue streak 1]

MagLev: I'll believe that option when it finally proves itself.

[Mailman56701]

  Hear that sound ?  Its the thundering sound of lawyers lining up to be the first to file suit if this thing ever crashes/derails.

[gregretro]

Have to agree with the naysayers...  I don't see this happening any time soon.  It's been on the table for years - and CHSRA doesn't have a clear route yet, I don't know how they supposedly have environmental impact sign-off.

I'm definitely not sold on maglev - the astronomical cost is barely worth the speed increase, imho.

I'm also not sold on an elevated route over 99 - the last thing you want in the event of an accident is a train plunging into auto/truck traffic.  It does certainly make sense from a r.o.w. aspect - except for the fact that you still have to have the elevated line clear the many overpasses on the route, and still be earthquake-proof.  Even more $$$.

I think it's going to be talked about for many many many many years... and may perhaps break ground before I die, as gas hits $15 a gallon maybe.

Of course you know who's fighting against it the hardest - the airline lobbyists.

[YoHo1975]

Funny how wet it's been in the Central Valley given that SoCal Blew through last year's total rainfall in like a week an dhad a seriously wet first quarter.

I don't think Oregon's hurting for water either given some of the devistation. 

[passengerfan]

The two largest groups fighting for high speed rail in the state of confusion better known as California can't even get together on a route. One route wants to go over Pacheco Pass the other over Altamont Pass. The latter promises a larger population to choose from the former a more direct route. A third group wants to use a coastal route and the group I favor wants to use magnetic levitation and operate elevated above HWY 99 from Sacramento to Bakersfield then I-5 from their to Los Angeles and San Diego. For the Bay area their would be one route from San Francisco to San Jose then over Pacheco Pass and cross the valley to connect with HWY 99 route just above Fresno. The other route would connect the east bay cities with the HWY 99 route at Modesto. All of this train route would be elevated above already existing highways whose right of way we already own. The Mag-lev trains would operate at 270 miles to 300 hundred miles per hour.  Cost for the two systems because the mag-lev route would already use existing right of way would be about the same. One proposal suggests that the mag-lev route be built all the way to Redding above I-5 north of Sacramento.

I will believe it when I see the ground being broken. With the state already having a budget shortfall of 5 billion I don't see anything in my crystal ball yet.

The temperature here in Stockton today is presently 103 degrees. This has broken an all time record for this date and tomorrow is supposed to be even hotter. The Fire warning has gone to red alert the earliest this has ever happened in the state. We had the driest February, March and April on record in the San Joaquin Valley. Needless to say I am staying in the air conditioned Apartment on this day and probably for the next few. I just had two lovely young ladies from the city at my door asking if my A/C was working properly and was I cool enough. First time I can ever remember that happening or maybe I was just dreaming.

Al - in - Stockton 

[ChuckCobleigh]

My understanding was that with the current budget Snafu, this topic of DOA for at least the next couple years.

Pity, but the current route does kinda defy the logical thought process.

Probably true.  The budget SNAFU will live on forever, unfortunately, unless we citizens can find a way to cut up the big credit card that is Sacramento. 

[vsmith]

My understanding was that with the current budget Snafu, this topic of DOA for at least the next couple years.

Pity, but the current route does kinda defy the logical thought process.

[tree68]

How is the prison guards union weighing in on it?  I hear they run the state...

Maybe some cars with shackles?

[ChuckCobleigh]

Let's see...the guvernator is trying to figure out how to close a huge (15-20 Billion dollars) gap between revenue and budget, nobody in either party likes his proposed strategies, and all of the budget-using constituencies are already screaming about cutbacks that still leave them way ahead of two years ago.

I don't think we need a triple-A map to see how far this is going to go. 

[al-in-chgo]

As Squiggy said to Lennie on the old "Laverne and Shirley" TV show: "I'll see it when I believe it."   - a.s.

 

 

[YoHo1975]

Considering the biggest California Passenger Rail riders organization is *** at them over the route they've chosen, I wouldn't feel as confident about things yet.

It's a bad thing when your most vocal and active system users think the commission messed up. 

[Railway Man]

Serves a lot - we hope.

Feeds thousands of consultants.

[blue streak 1]

Well if this is true I would have given it about a 5% chance of passing three months ago. Now with all California regular gas over $4.00 if it stays there through the november elections a 50% chance. Southern CA will probably pass it but the northern areas and San Jouquine area I don't know. You CA posters need to let us know. Of course CALTRAIN's proposal to electrify SFO - SJC might skew the results.

[oltmannd]

http://gas2.org/2008/05/13/california-building-220-mph-high-speed-train-from-san-francisco-to-la/

Page says it was published May 13th in Trains.

(I found it via http://reddit.com/)

Here's the directions:

Dump one package "instant high speed rail line"

into a large pressure cooker.

Add $9B lettuce

and

copius amounts of palm grease 

mix thoroughly.

Cook on high heat for a decade. 

Serves a lot - we hope.