Well it appears from some rumblings, NS has cut over 100 positions as of yesterday. Hearing everything from Shops to HQ. I imagine details will be coming out next week.. It's going to be a rough ride for Shaw and gang these next few months.. These cuts were announced almost 2 months ago.
Once again, these activist investors are out for the quick buck. Loot the treasury and run.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
https://www.smart-union.org/oberman-calls-out-up-bnsf-for-cutting-jobs-when-they-should-focus-on-growth/
The freight market remains soft.. likely why there are some layoffs.
So much for Shaw's promise to not throw away institutional knowledge at every dip in the economy. The vampires win again.
rrnut282So much for Shaw's promise to not throw away institutional knowledge at every dip in the economy. The vampires win again.
In part it remains to be seen - if NS (or other carriers) get to cutting T&E positions - recovery with a shipping upturn will result in gridlock for the carriers that don't have a crew base that can support the traffic.
There are elements of the employee base that can be cut - MofW, MofE, Supervision and the carrier can still function (although as PC demonstrated considering those cuts as permanent result in a company that is falling apart in every concievable way). If that employee base is restored in the near term, the company can respond to a increase in traffic.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
Not much left to throw away after the last tangle with the PSR fangirls/fanbois.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.
Wasnt Shaw, it was BoD that decided to go sip the O.R. kool-aid.
Ed
NS has become operationally undisciplined, and our COO choice will sort it all out.
Sure, Jan....
I believe much of the eastern duopoly's current dynamics goes back to the way the Conrail dismemberment shook out. NS "won" the merger by getting turn key lanes that had already been modernized, and the meshed network benefits were rapidly realized. CSX got a mountain of capital spend over a couple of decades before they could cash in on the golden triangle.
Lo and behold, CSX is now seeing the end of that daylighted tunnel, and has gained some pricing power, which has wrong footed NS.
I don't think this was written in stone, but was a reasonable likelyhood on comparison of the two networks a decade ago; and some of it is just dumb luck - if that snake oil salesman hadn't croaked before he set his fangs, NS would likely be in a better market position.
Anyhow, as the proverb goes, we'll see...
OWTXNS has become operationally undisciplined, and our COO choice will sort it all out. Sure, Jan.... I believe much of the eastern duopoly's current dynamics goes back to the way the Conrail dismemberment shook out. NS "won" the merger by getting turn key lanes that had already been modernized, and the meshed network benefits were rapidly realized. CSX got a mountain of capital spend over a couple of decades before they could cash in on the golden triangle. Lo and behold, CSX is now seeing the end of that daylighted tunnel, and has gained some pricing power, which has wrong footed NS. I don't think this was written in stone, but was a reasonable likelyhood on comparison of the two networks a decade ago; and some of it is just dumb luck - if that snake oil salesman hadn't croaked before he set his fangs, NS would likely be in a better market position. Anyhow, as the proverb goes, we'll see...
For those wanting to cut rail employment to the bone - remember the national unemployment rate is 3.8% - at least when I was taking Econ 101 in college - 4% was considered Full Employment. Cutting rail employees will have them going into other areas of employment to support their families.
At one time, Railroads would have 75-90% return to duty of furloughed employees - in the 21st Century that return to duty number has been on the order of 10-15% answering the call and coming back to work for the carriers. Whatever efforts the carriers put into training those that didn't return when called was just wasted money and manpower. Cutting manpower is easy and can happen instantly - restoring manpower to the pre cut levels and beyond is a lengthy procedure.
Back when I was working, there was the Harriman Award presented to the various classes of carriers for their Safety Records - NS was a repeated winner of the award. As I recall, in 2014 or 2015, when CSX was about to win the award, it was disbanded - for whatever reason.
BaltACDthat return to duty number has been on the order of 10-15% answering the call and coming back to work for the carriers. Whatever efforts the carriers put into training those that didn't return when called was just wasted money and manpower.
This seems so obvious. It costs a lot to train new employees--and the railroads then just toss that cost away by layoffs.
When is it going to dawn on RR management that young people today, like it or not, are different than we were in their attitudes toward school and work? Have you read the articles about the large drop in attendance figures for schools nationwide since the pandemic? We already know millenials have a reputation, deserved or not, for not having anything like the work ethic of boomers and previous generations. Combine these two qualities (?) and it's obvious railroads are going to have Hell's own time finding suitably responsible employees in the necessary numbers. Increased pay alone won't do the trick. When interested applicants learn about the job's hours and responsibilities they're going to be increasingly discouraged, I think, and seek employment elsewhere. And this is on top of the effect is has on many marriages.
Bottom line: The day of hiring & laying off workers as it was some years ago is over. Railroad management doesn't seem able or willing to read the handwriting on the wall right now--but they will.
NKP guy BaltACD that return to duty number has been on the order of 10-15% answering the call and coming back to work for the carriers. Whatever efforts the carriers put into training those that didn't return when called was just wasted money and manpower. This seems so obvious. It costs a lot to train new employees--and the railroads then just toss that cost away by layoffs. When is it going to dawn on RR management that young people today, like it or not, are different than we were in their attitudes toward school and work? Have you read the articles about the large drop in attendance figures for schools nationwide since the pandemic? We already know millenials have a reputation, deserved or not, for not having anything like the work ethic of boomers and previous generations. Combine these two qualities (?) and it's obvious railroads are going to have Hell's own time finding suitably responsible employees in the necessary numbers. Increased pay alone won't do the trick. When interested applicants learn about the job's hours and responsibilities they're going to be increasingly discouraged, I think, and seek employment elsewhere. And this is on top of the effect is has on many marriages. Bottom line: The day of hiring & laying off workers as it was some years ago is over. Railroad management doesn't seem able or willing to read the handwriting on the wall right now--but they will.
BaltACD that return to duty number has been on the order of 10-15% answering the call and coming back to work for the carriers. Whatever efforts the carriers put into training those that didn't return when called was just wasted money and manpower.
Keeping 'trained and qualified' workers on the payroll during a business lull is the anathema to the PSR Cadre. PSR demands the nose be cut off since the mouth can do all that is necessary - eat, communicate and breath. The nose is redundant.
Any railroad management that tries to retain T&E personnel in a downturn in traffic is severely criticized by the PSR 'activist' investors - they want the money TODAY - with any kind of luck they will move their investment to some other company before it comes time for the company they played their 'activist' games upon to be catatonically grid lock when business picks up and there are no longer employees working and able to handle it.
Young people today have more options than earlier generations did. A generation or two ago getting a job at a railroad was hard.. you had to know someone who works there already to get in usually, and if not you really had to be at the right place at the right time. Now they and everyone else is looking for people.. tables have turned..
Shortsightedness in terms of layoffs, retention and hiring has plagued many corprations besides railroads for many years, sadly. And this stupiditylong preceded PSR.
charlie hebdoAnd this stupiditylong preceded PSR.
PSR pushed a lot of people with decent seniority out the door. Guys with 5-10-20 years walked out.
zugmann charlie hebdo And this stupiditylong preceded PSR. PSR pushed a lot of people with decent seniority out the door. Guys with 5-10-20 years walked out.
charlie hebdo And this stupiditylong preceded PSR.
That's one of the telling things about the current situation. It used to be rare for someone who has 5 to 10 years (or more) to willingly leave. A couple I know went to railroads with more favorable and stable working conditions. Most I know who have left went to non-railroad jobs.
Concerning furloughs, that has almost always been a fact of life on the railroad. I think what's changed is how much quicker they are to furlough and slow to call back. Also years ago they hired people out of high school or just a year or two out. Mostly single men who could better weather a furlough during the slack times. Those furloughs, as one gained seniority, would get shorter in time and within 5 or so years one could pretty much hold on year round. Only a major downturn would mean getting furloughed.
Now they prefer people with a few years of either work experience (preferably in outdoor/all weather type jobs) or school. People, slightly older with families because they are viewed as more reliable also were sought after. People like this can't take the furloughs as well. Especially when they seem to come more haphazard then in years past.
Trains had an article many years ago that included how the progression of a train crewman's career would go. In the days of full crews and then of the reduced and finally two man crews.
Jeff
Have grip bag - will travel. A change of district or railroad is likely in a career arc. Airbnb-ification of rental housing shifts that cost benefit, and the allure of many crew bases is lost on modern applicants.
NKP guy We already know millenials have a reputation, deserved or not, for not having anything like the work ethic of boomers and previous generations. Combine these two qualities (?) and it's obvious railroads are going to have Hell's own time finding suitably responsible employees in the necessary numbers.
We're past millenials and are now into hiring Generation Z. And honestly? Many of these younger guys are some of the best RRers we have, esp. given how little actual training the RR wants to give them.
I don't know whether they will stick around. The pay isn't as great as it used to be (and I don't think pay will ultimately be the deciding factor). If PSR comes back into play again and cuts jobs, I don't think they'll be too keen on waiting out a furlough, chasing work, or having to work jobs they don't like (road v. yard v. local).
OWTX A change of district or railroad is likely in a career arc.
Ah, the boomer railroader.
zugmann NKP guy We already know millenials have a reputation, deserved or not, for not having anything like the work ethic of boomers and previous generations. Combine these two qualities (?) and it's obvious railroads are going to have Hell's own time finding suitably responsible employees in the necessary numbers. We're past millenials and are now into hiring Generation Z. And honestly? Many of these younger guys are some of the best RRers we have, esp. given how little actual training the RR wants to give them. I don't know whether they will stick around. The pay isn't as great as it used to be (and I don't think pay will ultimately be the deciding factor). If PSR comes back into play again and cuts jobs, I don't think they'll be too keen on waiting out a furlough, chasing work, or having to work jobs they don't like (road v. yard v. local).
A lot depends on the institutional memory of PSR - do those pushing PSR remember the chaos and lost revenue opportunities that happened the previous time that they pared the organization's work force to the bone and thus created the corporate inability to satisfy their customers demands for service.
I fear those infected with PSR and its mantra, have a shorter memory span than 1/2 the business cycle and will continue to make the same bad choices until there are no railroads left.
zugmannMany of these younger guys are some of the best RRers we have
That's good news and an encouraging thing to read.
Ditto. It's pretty lame to hear my generation (Boomers) whining about what slackers the younger generation is. How soon we forget!
I heard we had a couple of new guys quit within the last couple of days. They had one year in. They received their last sign-on bonus payment and pulled the pin.
charlie hebdo Ditto. It's pretty lame to hear my generation (Boomers) whining about what slackers the younger generation is. How soon we forget!
lol, and the "Greatest Generation" said the Boomers were lazy and lacked their work ethic. 'Twas ever thus, probably since the beginning of time.
Psychotlol, and the "Greatest Generation" said the Boomers were lazy and lacked their work ethic. 'Twas ever thus, probably since the beginning of time.
For sure.
My dad (b.1919, "Greatest Generation") held his father's generation in awe, as I did and do. One of dad's buddies told me (c.1986) he once heard my great-grandfather (b.1864) tell my grandfather (b.1887) "You know what's wrong with your generation? You're weak. You're weak here (pointing to his bicep), and you're weak here (pointing to his temple)." I burst out laughing in disbelief when he told me that.
I tried to keep that anecdote in mind as I taught high school and was tempted to think the same thing at times; I guess it's human nature.
Every generation that is 'in power' views all the following generations as weak and inadequate - despite the fact that the 'in power' generation was the teacher of the generations they feature as weak and inadequate.
NKP guy Psychot lol, and the "Greatest Generation" said the Boomers were lazy and lacked their work ethic. 'Twas ever thus, probably since the beginning of time. For sure. My dad (b.1919, "Greatest Generation") held his father's generation in awe, as I did and do. One of dad's buddies told me (c.1986) he once heard my great-grandfather (b.1864) tell my grandfather (b.1887) "You know what's wrong with your generation? You're weak. You're weak here (pointing to his bicep), and you're weak here (pointing to his temple)." I burst out laughing in disbelief when he told me that. I tried to keep that anecdote in mind as I taught high school and was tempted to think the same thing at times; I guess it's human nature.
Psychot lol, and the "Greatest Generation" said the Boomers were lazy and lacked their work ethic. 'Twas ever thus, probably since the beginning of time.
The current generation appears to be less fit than previous generations.. but that includes older people too. Slim and well toned used to come naturally... now it has to be worked for in a gym because modern everyday living nolonger provides it.
NKP: retired (20 yr) HS instructor also. It's much worse in school nowadaze. BUT I always wondered, what view MY teachers had when I was in school.
As a crew carrier, many T&E commented these managers can't run a model train, much less a real RR.
I tried to instill (Physics) students, when you get your PE license and are the BOSS on a job, MAKE sure you pay attention to the ole man who is supervising workers. He knows/seen things you have never heard of. Same for military. Boot louie needs to listen to 1st Sgt. endmrw0411241141
UlrichThe current generation appears to be less fit than previous generations.. but that includes older people too. Slim and well toned used to come naturally... now it has to be worked for in a gym because modern everyday living nolonger provides it.
Many youths today sport a physique that would have been, in my day, and to use a current term, "fat shamed." It seems to be the new normal...
Just as an aside, the US Army is now sending many of its recruits too something like "Pre-Basic Training." They were rejecting many recruits because those recruits were less fit than desired. But they couldn't get enough people who met the standards of physical fitness. So they've now set up a system to get young people in shape for basic traiining.
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