After watching You Tube, I am questioning where the manned helper districts are in the US and Canada? I also assume that the manner helpers are engineer only and each designated helper has a remote uncoupler box in the cab. Are they cut off on the fly?
Thank you,
Ed Burns
I don't think there are any regular manned helper districts left in Canada. Trains do stall on grades on both CN and CP, but this is not planned for and trains either double the hill or get pushed by the next train behind them.
CN's largest (only?) helper district is Steelton Hill near Duluth, and I believe HelperLink is used there.
Greetings from Alberta
-an Articulate Malcontent
When CSX was operating manned helpers on my territory - the Helper Crew consisted of a Engineer and a Brakeman. The Brakeman WAS NOT pay rated as a Conductor and there would be penalty 'Time Slips' submitted when Helper Crews were used in a manner that would normally be staffed by a Engineer & Conductor.
Where possible, CSX used 'Helper Link' technology. Helper Link would allow the helper engine consist to be connected to the train's trainline without physically connecting the air hoses - the proper air test would be peformed to insure the proper operation of the Helper Link. Use of the Helper Link permitted the helper to cut off on the fly under CSX Rules - if the Helper Link was not used the train would have to have stopped and had the anglecocks closed on both the train and the helper as well as reconnecting the EOT the train had before the helper was attached.
I believe DPU operation has been implemented through the Helper Districts that previously had manned helpers.
When a train stalls on line of road - the engine consist from another train will be used as the emergency helper to move the train to the top of the grade, to continue if it has sufficient working power, or to a point where the train can be held to wait for the additional power required to more the train to desination.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
In November of 2016 UPRR #844[complete with its H.E. maint cars] helped push a 11,620 ton freight over Archer Hill and into Cheyenne,Wy. after it had stalled out with 3 H.E. units on the freight.
See link @ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RU9uEwSGp9M
NP Eddie I also assume that the manner helpers are engineer only and each designated helper has a remote uncoupler box in the cab. Are they cut off on the fly?
No such thing as "remote uncoupler box".
But if the helpers are not directly connected to the train line (air brakes) of the rest of the train, the helper conductor could work the [manual and mechanical] uncoupling lever from the steps of the locomotive to uncouple (exactly how you uncouple normally from ANYTHING else) and they could separate even "on the fly." However, if the air brake hoses are connected up and the valves not closed off, the entire train would instantly go into emergency as soon as the air hoses disconnect.
Chris van der Heide
My Algoma Central Railway Modeling Blog
cv_acrNo such thing as "remote uncoupler box".
I have seen, however, air operated pin lifters on switchers...
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
I'm pretty sure some versions of helperlink had remote uncouplers.
It's been fun. But it isn't much fun anymore. Signing off for now.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any
Al Krug's site has a story on Helper Link ... but it looks like that has gone down again
All the talk about Helper Link or remote uncoupling is mute if they have to cut the helpers into the train. I doubt it happens very much anymore, but I have read where it has been done.
Jeff
Found it ...
http://krugtales.50megs.com/rrpictale/helperlink/helperlink.htm
When manned helper operations go awry!
https://dotlibrary.specialcollection.net/Document?db=DOT-RAILROAD&query=(select+1898)
A free registration is required for site.
The HS Curve could be the busiest of the manned helpers locations in North America. Please let us know if someone has any location they feel uses more.
alphasThe HS Curve could be the busiest of the manned helpers locations in North America. Please let us know if someone has any location they feel uses more.
During the time of my employment, CSX relied exclusively on manned helpers - with the idea that assigning power to helper districts decreased the number of locomotives required to operate the network. The thought being that if one applied DPU power to trains from orign to destination to cover their ability to conquer the ruling grade(s) of the trip you would be 'wasting' power on the higher portion of mileage on the run that did not require the 'extra' power.
Since I retired it appears that CSX has gone DPU on most if not all trains that at one time required a manned helper and it has also gone DPU on many trains that had never required a helper - done to allow the Engineer to use 'better' train handling techniques.
NS was a laggard on using AC locomotives, they may also be a laggard in continuing to use manned helpers - I have no direct knowledge of NS policies so I could be mistaken.
Horse Shoe is a special case compared to, say, B&O which had far more protracted grades. The PRR, following the original canal-with-planes model, intentionally laid the railroad out to have minimum grade either side of a steep and short central section, the idea being to work the additional power forward and back continuously (or as on the original setup, to use stationary-engine power) just on that section either for helping or snapping.
Using DPU (or an autonomous setup for helpers) would be a likely waste of capital for the relatively slight distance and time, and short binding-on time and intelligent release that a manned helper crew provides safely over Horse Shoe. The situation is slightly more complicated if the helpers provide increased dynamic downhill, but not radically so.
The situation is very different with a protracted grade, or multiple grades or performance 'checks' in a route. Then having the additional peak hp and train-handling options exceeds the gain of a short manned turn.
OvermodHorse Shoe is a special case compared to, say, B&O which had far more protracted grades. The PRR, following the original canal-with-planes model, intentionally laid the railroad out to have minimum grade either side of a steep and short central section, the idea being to work the additional power forward and back continuously (or as on the original setup, to use stationary-engine power) just on that section either for helping or snapping. Using DPU (or an autonomous setup for helpers) would be a likely waste of capital for the relatively slight distance and time, and short binding-on time and intelligent release that a manned helper crew provides safely over Horse Shoe. The situation is slightly more complicated if the helpers provide increased dynamic downhill, but not radically so. The situation is very different with a protracted grade, or multiple grades or performance 'checks' in a route. Then having the additional peak hp and train-handling options exceeds the gain of a short manned turn.
While many only look at helpers as being required to get trains up grades - the reality is that in many cases trains that were able to climb the grades on their own, for a variety of reasons, need helpers to assist them with braking power in getting trains down the grades safely.
CSX has been using DPU's on the I-95 corridor trains, in both directions - a route where the Howard Street Tunnel/Baltimore Belt Line is the ruling grade between Miami and Selkirk. As I said CSX, these days, is using DPU to improve train handling and reduce in train buff and draft forces.
NS within the past year has had two 'stringline' derailments with their trains on Horseshoe Curve - excessive trailing tonnage behind 'light' empty, long, high center of gravity, center beam flat cars. Yes, CSX also had a similar derailment on the Baltimore Belt Line last Summer for the same reason on a train that was operating 'single'.
I was at the Horseshoe Curve last year. As far as I could tell all the helpers in both directions (several East bounds had helpers on their end) were still manned and obviously those running light were manned.
In Hamilton Ontario, CP regularly runs manned helpers to assist northbound trains up the Waterdown hill between Hamilton and Guelph Junction. The helpers are uncoupled while on the move just beyond Waterdown. They are just the local yard job based at Kinnear Yard which are called up for a push as required. A push is required at least once on most days.
wasdIn Hamilton Ontario, CP regularly runs manned helpers to assist northbound trains up the Waterdown hill between Hamilton and Guelph Junction. The helpers are uncoupled while on the move just beyond Waterdown. They are just the local yard job based at Kinnear Yard which are called up for a push as required. A push is required at least once on most days.
Since it seems that Canadian railroads play fast and loose with practices that are in place to insure safe brake performance - I suspect the Kinnear Yard Engine in shoving the trains it does, just couples to the rear of the train to be shove and does not couple the air into the trainline and thus they can uncouple on the fly.
BaltACDSince it seems that Canadian railroads play fast and loose with practices that are in place to insure safe brake performance
....have you met my friend Mr. PSR? One of the first casualties was the car inspector. So fast and loose isn't just a Canadian trait anymore.
zugmann BaltACD Since it seems that Canadian railroads play fast and loose with practices that are in place to insure safe brake performance ....have you met my friend Mr. PSR? One of the first casualties was the car inspector. So fast and loose isn't just a Canadian trait anymore.
BaltACD Since it seems that Canadian railroads play fast and loose with practices that are in place to insure safe brake performance
Fortunately I retired before PSR hit my carrier. My comment was occasioned by the number of TSN reports I have read about the many derailments occasioned by multiple forms of brake failure - both employee practices and maintenance procedures.
Even before PSR employees looked for the 'short cut'; in many cases not realizing the disasterous position that short cut was placing themselves in.
The BNSF uses manned helpers on th Pikes Peak subdivision between Denver and Pueblo on long and heavy trains to get overth divide. Denver is at 5000 ft, the top of the divide is at 7980 feet, 50 miles south of Denver, Then down to Pueblo at 4600 feet. in 60.1 miles.
Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account.