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Somebody's in very deep do-do

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Posted by n012944 on Wednesday, January 20, 2016 6:49 PM

ricktrains4824

While we do know that the Amtrak train struck a company vehicle, what we do not know is which one was where it should not have been... Either the BNSF welder crew was not supposed to be that close, or the DS had the Amtrak train in the wrong spot.

 

Or the welder had a Form B/707/whatever the BNSF calls an employee in charge work authority and the Amtrak crew blew it. 

An "expensive model collector"

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Posted by jeffhergert on Wednesday, January 20, 2016 7:03 PM

On the UP, MOW/Signal can get a "Foul Time Permit" that just covers the control point within CTC or at a manual interlocking.  Does BNSF use them too?

Jeff 

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Posted by mudchicken on Wednesday, January 20, 2016 7:18 PM

jeffhergert

On the UP, MOW/Signal can get a "Foul Time Permit" that just covers the control point within CTC or at a manual interlocking.  Does BNSF use them too?

Jeff 

 

Depends on which territory. In general, I'd say no.

In old Santa Fe parlance, you'd be asking for time in the "detector section" in the CTC plant. It's been a long time since I've heard that request on BNSF in the places I've been.

 

Mudchicken Nothing is worth taking the risk of losing a life over. Come home tonight in the same condition that you left home this morning in. Safety begins with ME.... cinscocom-west
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Posted by ricktrains4824 on Thursday, January 21, 2016 11:01 AM

n012944

 

 
ricktrains4824

While we do know that the Amtrak train struck a company vehicle, what we do not know is which one was where it should not have been... Either the BNSF welder crew was not supposed to be that close, or the DS had the Amtrak train in the wrong spot.

 

 

 

Or the welder had a Form B/707/whatever the BNSF calls an employee in charge work authority and the Amtrak crew blew it. 

 

Within a CTC interlocking, while possible that the Amtrak just blew through the work zone without permission of worker in charge, it seems, at least to me, that the DS in charge of said interlocking would have to have had the Amtrak in the wrong spot/on the wrong line. With Amtrak being priority on all lines, would not the DS in charge of the interlocking not try to mov the Amtrak to an adjacent line to get around the work zone with as little delay as possible?

Or the DS simply forgot the welder crew had that portion blocked.... If they were given permission.

And in relation to the humor of the truck being made of a certain style frame..... My apologies. Sometimes humor is hard to pick up on in writing.....

Ricky W.

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Posted by BaltACD on Thursday, January 21, 2016 11:44 AM

ricktrains4824
n012944
ricktrains4824

While we do know that the Amtrak train struck a company vehicle, what we do not know is which one was where it should not have been... Either the BNSF welder crew was not supposed to be that close, or the DS had the Amtrak train in the wrong spot.

Or the welder had a Form B/707/whatever the BNSF calls an employee in charge work authority and the Amtrak crew blew it.

Within a CTC interlocking, while possible that the Amtrak just blew through the work zone without permission of worker in charge, it seems, at least to me, that the DS in charge of said interlocking would have to have had the Amtrak in the wrong spot/on the wrong line. With Amtrak being priority on all lines, would not the DS in charge of the interlocking not try to mov the Amtrak to an adjacent line to get around the work zone with as little delay as possible?

Or the DS simply forgot the welder crew had that portion blocked.... If they were given permission.

And in relation to the humor of the truck being made of a certain style frame..... My apologies. Sometimes humor is hard to pick up on in writing.....

On my carrier, it is cusomary for Work Authorities to be in effect on all tracks within the working limits.  Trains must STOP at the entering limit IF they have not received permission to pass through the limits from the employee in charge of the work area.

Dispatchers line routes through the work area, unless the employee in charge specifically asks for track blocking on specific track(s).  It doesn't matter if the work area is within interlocking limits or not.  When the employee in charge asks for track blocking, the dispatcher initiates the appropriate blocking software in the CADS system and he will not be able to line signals to the track(s) that have been blocked until software is initiated to release the blocking.  Any Dispatcher that does not apply appropriate blocking in such instances is a fool and deserves to be a former dispatcher.

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Posted by schlimm on Thursday, January 21, 2016 8:45 PM

This may seem common sense obvious, but unless they were working on the track, why park the truck so near the track?  That would avoid all the paperwork.

C&NW, CA&E, MILW, CGW and IC fan

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Posted by tree68 on Thursday, January 21, 2016 9:34 PM

schlimm
This may seem common sense obvious, but unless they were working on the track, why park the truck so near the track?

This may well be the $64,000 question....

LarryWhistling
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Posted by Euclid on Thursday, January 21, 2016 9:42 PM
Do we know that the truck was parked when it was hit?  Is it possible that the truck was being maneuvered in the process of parking or leaving, and accidentally moved into the foul zone just as the train showed up? 
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Posted by BaltACD on Thursday, January 21, 2016 9:55 PM

Euclid
Do we know that the truck was parked when it was hit?  Is it possible that the truck was being maneuvered in the process of parking or leaving, and accidentally moved into the foul zone just as the train showed up?

We don't know and it is doubtful that we ever will since there were no fatalities and thus no NTSB or FRA investigation that will be made public.

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Posted by Euclid on Thursday, January 21, 2016 9:59 PM

BaltACD
 
Euclid
Do we know that the truck was parked when it was hit?  Is it possible that the truck was being maneuvered in the process of parking or leaving, and accidentally moved into the foul zone just as the train showed up?

 

We don't know and it is doubtful that we ever will since there were no fatalities and thus no NTSB or FRA investigation that will be made public.

 

I can see what you mean.  About the only way that any word could get out would be by word of mouth by people close to the accident.  I was just thinking that the easy first impression was that the truck was parked too close to the track.  But it may not have happened that way at all. 

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Posted by CShaveRR on Friday, January 22, 2016 12:05 PM

I saw a picture somewhere that showed the truck on two of the tracks, with debris over all three.  I can't find it in any of my usual places now.  Of course, that was the aftermath--I don't have any idea where the truck was before the collision, nor do I know which track the train was using.

Carl

Railroader Emeritus (practiced railroading for 46 years--and in 2010 I finally got it right!)

CAACSCOCOM--I don't want to behave improperly, so I just won't behave at all. (SM)

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