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When did it become illegal to take pictures of trains..

  • Well this is new to me, I was out taking pictures of freight cars yesterday, I was stop by someone who worked I believe for the UPRR even tho he never ID himself as a employee. He drove a white ford truck, he called me over and asked me what was I doing, so i walk to his driver side. I said "I'm just taking pictures of trains." He said "well you can't do that." I asked "why?" He said "Because its illegal to take pictures of trains." I said "what?! Who said this?" He goes to say "The Union Pacific railroad! ", "You are not allow to take pictures of the Union Pacific railroad it's illegal." he goes on and says "you want me to call the special agent?! In a threatening way...I'm said " I didn't do anything wrong I'm just taking pictures" he then goes on and say "why are you so interested in the railcar because it has graffiti?" He goes on and says " I bet you and your buddies did that." At this time he's looking at his phone as if he was calling someone. And says "I'll just have the specials agent sort this all out." I tell him "nope I don't even do that stuff, i tell him "I'm just taking pictures because I modelrailroad" he says "I don't care get out of here!"..I say alrite and leave..

    Hense at this time no trains were running. They were done for the day, I was taking my picture from the bank of the road and I wasn't on railroad property. I'm 39 years old and to assume I'm a "graffiti artist" was rude and very unprofessional. Maybe it's because of my skin color he assume I was up to no good.. All I had in my hand was a point and shoot camera; no markers,or spray paint..

    I guess your guilty of anything now a days...
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  • That clown definitely overstepped his authority. People like that are a genuine pain in the butt! #1, You're on public property. #2, he as an employee has no business harassing you. I've been in the same situation as you describe. I let the guy go ahead and the cops on me and when they got there and the situation was explained he got the heat. If you're unaware of the photographers rights here's a site that explains them.

    Running Bear, Sundown, Louisiana
              Joined June, 2004

    Dr. Frankendiesel aka Scott Running Bear
    Space Mouse for president!
    15 year veteran fire fighter
    Collector of Apple //e's
    Running Bear Enterprises
    History Channel Club life member.
    beatus homo qui invenit sapientiam


  • I would strongly recommend that if someone threatens to call the police, that you, respectfully, ask them to please do so, and if they don't, then do so yourself.  It is never wrong to ask for assistance from the police.  If you were doing something illegal, you need assistance in understanding what it was and as long as you were doing so unintentionally and not out of malice, the police will be nice about it and explain the law to you and probably not harass you beyond telling you to not do it again.  If you were not in error, then the bully will learn something too!

    Semper Vaporo

    Pkgs.

  • You say this individual never offered identification.  You should have requested it.

    Was his pickup marked with any identification?  The reason I ask is, at least half the pickups in Nevada are white, so, in and of itself, the color white means nothing.  OTOH, all the UP vehicles I have seen here have the UP shield on the door.

    If he had offered some kind of valid identification (WAY beyond a driver's license) the next question would have been for him to cite the chapter and verse of the law in question.  And, by the way, snap his ugly mug while you're at it.  (You can do that with your phone while calling 911.)

    I know for a fact that lots of people position themselves along the (public road side) flight line fence of my friendly, neighborhood Air Force Base and snap all kinds of photos of Sam's latest and greatest flying machines.  I've yet to hear of a security sweep to stop them.  Or are F-22s less critical to American security than some random freight cars?

    Chuck, MSgt(ret) USAF

  • The person probably thought you were a spy. Laugh  Self appointed protectors of national security have been around a long time.  In the 1970's I was taking pictures of a Armored Personnel Carrier on a flat bed trailer.  A busybody  told me I was breaking the law.

     The APC was uncovered on a civilian trailer, parked on the main street of town,  and was a type that had not been in service since the early 1960's.

    I tried to sell my two cents worth, but no one would give me a plug nickel for it.

    I don't have a leg to stand on.

  • Thank you Mr Wimberly for the advice and link, I'm much more informed now, also to you semper I'll keep in mind what everyone has suggested..and thanks again

    After this whole incounter with this guy I decided to check the UPRR website lastnite..UPCARES (it's a bit confusing) (You would have to read it) well more like a disclaimer-they know there's millions of rail fans in the U.S. who love trains and taking pictures of them is part of the hobby, and most of us are more aware the dangers of being too close to the tracks. The majority of ppl being killed are the ones who have no knowledge of trains or railcars etc etc..






  • Chuck, First of all thank you for your service in the USAF..

    The white truck in question had no identification it was a UPRR service truck, no UP shield or nor did he flash any ID to me(next time I know to ask)..when he first called me over I thought he was just a nosey pedestrian..it caught me off guard when he started accusing me of being a vandal when I've been taking photos at this location and others in the area since 08 off and on.. And no one ever complained about me.. I did have a cop stop me and ask me what I was doing and I told him I model trains and I'm taking reference photos to model the rust patterns and weather it and share them on a weathering website, I showed him a few pictures and he very good wrk, talked alittle and off he went..
  • DSchmitt

    The person probably thought you were a spy. Laugh  Self appointed protectors of national security have been around a long time.  In the 1970's I was taking pictures of a Armored Personnel Carrier on a flat bed trailer.  A busybody  told me I was breaking the law.

     The APC was uncovered on a civilian trailer, parked on the main street of town,  and was a type that had not been in service since the early 1960's.

    I got the same kind of riot act read to me back in the late 80's while taking photos of an M114 APC recon vehicle. This individual, a sergeant who was apparently working there, acted like it was some kind of national secret! It was a MUSEUM DISPLAY, kids climbing all over it, wide open to the public. The kicker? They were retired in 1973. I went to the officer in charge at the museum, pointed the guy out to him and he went over and told him to take his opinion and stick it up has butt.

    Running Bear, Sundown, Louisiana
              Joined June, 2004

    Dr. Frankendiesel aka Scott Running Bear
    Space Mouse for president!
    15 year veteran fire fighter
    Collector of Apple //e's
    Running Bear Enterprises
    History Channel Club life member.
    beatus homo qui invenit sapientiam


  • Hi, it's a bizarre story.  I'm a new railroad fan.  In fact, I don't know anything about them but I want to start.  About two weeks ago, I sent an email to Canadian National railroad company (I live in Canada).  In my email, I just asked if they had a railroad map of my region so I could watch the trains and take pictures.  The lady answered me by asking my adress so she will be able to post me the map.  And at the end of her email, she just told me to not stay on private property or too close too rails to prevent accident.

    That's all.  She never told me I can't take pictures of trains.

  • I wonder if your interrogator believes that autoracks are really used to transport FEMA prisoners? There are such people, and among them are those who believe that Amtrak's car repair shop at Beech Grove is a prison camp.

    Johnny

  • The little guy on a bicycle, and the little guy on foot with a camera and reaching glass around his neck have to know the rules as well as those who try to shove them around.

    "Command your lane!"  In my province, a bicycle can use the road the same way as an automobile, but that person must also use the road the same way a vehicle driver does...obeying traffic laws.  I once had a driver in a pickup come up behind me while I was stopped at a red light waiting to turn left at the intersection.  He drawled out his open window, "I sure hope I don't run over you."  What he uttered constituted an assault and a threat under the law, but I figured he would understand me better if I just pointed out the local RCMP detachment, right around the corner, and invited him to complain to them about my behaviour.  I cycled away with, "You'll learn something."  Of course, I knew he wouldn't bother, and that if he did, he probably wouldn't accept what he was told.

    Similarly, unless there is a posted prohibition based on law, say on a chain link fence between you and your target, and you are on public ground, you cannot be compelled to refrain from either your stance or your activity.  I would have continued my activity and mumbled, "Yeah, let's see if we can get you some learnin' today.  Call them over."  Anyone who attempts to coerce or to physically force you to give up your rights is outside his/her authority, and you are not compelled to obey.

    Crandell

  • jeffrey-wimberly

    DSchmitt

    I got the same kind of riot act read to me back in the late 80's while taking photos of an M114 APC recon vehicle. This individual, a sergeant who was apparently working there, acted like it was some kind of national secret! It was a MUSEUM DISPLAY, kids climbing all over it, wide open to the public. The kicker? They were retired in 1973. I went to the officer in charge at the museum, pointed the guy out to him and he went over and told him to take his opinion and stick it up has butt.

    Many decades ago I took a picture of a ZSU 23-4 that was parked outside. It had been parked someplace it should not have been.  After I had the picture developed it was a pretty spectacular photo. The Sgt Maj in charge had told me that the commander liked photos of equipment and I had a photo printed and mounted for him(the commander) . Where I was at had a really good photo lab that we could use.

          Anyway about 2 months later a memo came out about photography on post about watching subject matter.  I went back to the Sgt Maj and asked was there any problem with my photos, he looked puzzled and I told him about the memo. He looked at it and laughed and said my photography was not a problem.  I found out later when the memo was initialed by the commander that my photo was on his wall.

          On the subject of RR photography.  On numerous occasions I have been approached by the RR or local police. On the whole they(the police) just wanted to know what I was doing and after I identified myself I was left alone.  The rule take only pictures leave only footprints. Be polite. If you are on public property taking pictures there is no law or rule against this. Police are trained about rules and about the limits of their authority. Exceeding that authority can put the officer in a world of hurt. One nice thing about democracy is idiots with a badge and a gun usually tend to lose the badge before doing any damage.

            The other comment is this some years back a picture of a MoW crew was published were most of the crew was not wearing hard hats, safety glasses or gloves. Some had sneakers on(not boots). The head of safety saw the picture. The supervisor of the crew was called on the carpet. Anyway can you imagine the opinion of MoW crews about photographers after that.

           Rgds IGN

  • The way things are happening with this government today.I don't what to believe. wonder if any one else has had similar experiences

  • There are rules about Amtrak pictures at stations and certain areas.

    Normally, if you are not on railroad property, it is legal to take pictures.

    CZ

  • "The other comment is this some years back a picture of a MoW crew was published were most of the crew was not wearing hard hats, safety glasses or gloves. Some had sneakers on(not boots). The head of safety saw the picture. The supervisor of the crew was called on the carpet. Anyway can you imagine the opinion of MoW crews about photographers after that.

           Rgds IGN"

    This reminds me of the time, almost fifty years ago, when I stopped to watch an IC gang laying ribbon rail. I took a picture of some of men who, at that moment, were not being really industrious. One on the men asked me what I was going to do with the picture, and I told him that it was for my personal collection; he seemed relieved. The picture has never left my possesion.

     

    Johnny