Operations vs No operations

[Jetrock]

Hawks05: Even two switches is enough for a little bit of operation, as long as you have a plan to work from.

Here are some track plans for point-to-point 4x8 layouts that only require a couple of switches:

http://www.thortrains.net/poorhob.html

You can start out with the two-turnout version and expand it as shown later on as you get more track and other components.

Here's another 4x8 point-to-point plan--it requires a couple more switches but could easily be simplified and expanded later:

http://www.thortrains.net/4holay1.html

Or, if you have room for a 4x8 you may have room to cut that 4x8 in half into two 2x8 sheets, and have an 8x10 L-shaped "along the wall" point-to-point layout. Ideally you could get another couple of switches to provide a runaround track, then just stick a switch at each end to serve industries and you're ready to operate. Eventually you can add more switches to represent a small yard and add more industries. You really don't need much to have operation on a layout--it just requires some thought.

www.carendt.com has layouts that makes a 4x8 seem huge, some with only one or two switches, that often feature quite a bit of operation.

If you want something REALLY simple, take those two switches, grab a small piece of lumber (1x4 feet should be plenty) and make yourself an Inglenook Switching Puzzle mini layout. It's small enough to detail the heck out of on a budget, and you can always tack it onto a larger layout later. Plus it's small enough to sit unobtrusively in a bedroom.

If I can operate in 16 square feet, you certainly should be able to operate in 32!

[wpsteve]

When I was designing my Western Pacific layout one of the considerations was the Dispatcher and enough sidings to make it so we could move lots of trains and still have local switching. I have 4 yards that have industries to work. Then there are the long haul trains that do some work along the way. We also have peddlers that go out and work along the way.
We have 15 guys come by on every other Thursday night and I feel this is when the real fun begins [:D]
When I first built the layout I had a track I could install to run round and round but found I never used it, so it's gone..
I travel to op sessions through out the country and really enjoy this part of the hobby as a few others have stated....
If your ever in Central California give me a call, we have two operations railroads up he in Sonora !

[Hawks05]

i'd like to get a yard on my 4x8 but i don't have the money for switches and don't know where to start. i have 2 switches. one is just a straight section off the front of the layout. the other is at the end of the front that wraps around to almost another full circle.

i hate continuous run. thats why i hope my friend starts working on his layout so i can help with that and then when he starts laying down track we can do some operating. his room is huge by my standards and its going to be double level. i can't wait till its finally up and running.

for now i'm stuck with continuous running until i figure out a track plan with a yard in it for a 4x8. when i get my own place, or married, whatever i'm going to have a huge layout for sure where i can operate.

[Jetrock]

Nonsense! One can operate up a storm on a 4x8 trackplan without covering the surface with track...you don't need to add a LOT of switching, just a couple sidings and a yard are really all you need.

Heck, I don't have ROOM for a 4x8, and I can operate...

[railman]

operations are nice, but for 4 by 8's you can't criticise those with just continuious running...really all you have room for. Throw in too much switching, and you've got nothing but track, and that doesn't look really good either.

[bcammack]

Those hooks are supposed to appear as brake hoses on the prototype, no? Snagging couplers can be rectified with a pair of adjustment pliers available from Micro Mark.

[robengland]

Operations is #1 for me, but I feel I still want to have a loop somewhere for all those non-mr visitors who just want to "see the trains going"

As for snagging couplers, cut the hooks off. They aren't prototypic anyway (ever seen a prototype magnetic uncoupler?). Uncouple manually - now you are operating :-)

[JeremyB]

Hey JOHN

what point did I miss? you dont have to flip out It was a simple question

[johncolley]

jeremyB, you missed the point! Tacking on a caboose and bringing a road engine from service to hook up to your train IS OPERATING! So take it a little further, pump up the air, do a brake test, ease open the throttle and crawl out onto the main for a departure on time! Man! You is operating! Now if you like to let it run some miles, doing laps, that can be more enjoyment, too! Happy Railroading is what it's all about. Don't get caught up in the us or them thing, enjoy it all!

[Jetrock]

Okay, so I got my little "shoo-fly" module in place--one thing about operation, it makes track and car problems leap out like sore thumbs!

Before I built my yard I only used a half-dozen cars on my switching layout--my best runners. But with the yard built and capacity quadrupled and then some, I dragged everything out of boxes and put it on the layout. I took the time to change over to metal wheels and Kadees but didn't "tune" any of the new cars--and sure enough, those are the ones that derailed and otherwise caused grief. Also, my industrial district, which has been sitting largely neglected in the garage all summer while I built a diorama and the yard, showed a few new track problems where cardboard street surfaces had shifted in car-derailing fashion.

So it's off to the car shop with three-quarters of the rolling stock, and then a session of street resurfacing to get the in-street track up to spec. I'm seriously considering ordering some giant sheets of styrene in order to replace the more temperature-sensitive (and humidity-sensitive) cardboard of my streets.

Biggest bugaboo: low-hanging couplers snagging the edges of street surfaces between the rails. The resurfacing crew may have to lower the street level to allow a bit more rails to poke above the streets--which would simplify track cleaning and avoid a snag or three.

[Anonymous]

I admit it is rather fun and relaxing to see your trains run in circles, but after a while, it can get dull.

I have very limited experience operating, but what operating I've done was a lot of fun. A bit stressful at first, but I got the hang of it quickly, and had more fun. It would be something I'd like to get in to again, if only I could find a layout crew to run with.

Alvie.

[Jetrock]

Well, personally I kind of turned up my nose at the Cat Mountain & Santa Fe too, but then I like a pretty layout--but I insist on one that I can switch until the cows come home! This book on operation did explain in a way I could understand why some model railroaders would like that, though.

I figure that the folks who made the brouhaha can go have a dust-up with the guys who made a brouhaha over Dave Frary's last layout article. If we can stop them from killing each other they might end up with a humdinger of a club layout.

Braced for operation! After a bit of consideration, rather than build the two six-foot sections in between my current layout modules, I figured that it would be easy enough to make a quickie two-foot adapter piece to connect the two modules now (a six-foot yard and a six-foot passing track/industrial/interchange area.) By this weekend I expect to try out my first set of wheel reports. I have spent a few odd hours either making & breaking up trains in the yard or switching back & forth on the street--but due to the lack of connection, I couldn't move trains from one to the other! I figure I can forgive 2 feet of bare MDF with track nailed to it, which will eventually be replaced by 12 more feet of industrial district...

BRAKIE: At least on the ones I've seen, small layouts almost invariably push operations to the foreground, with the possible exception of "pizza-box" loop-only layouts. Big layouts put more focus on construction, and running can almost be an afterhought, although one hopes that someone who builds a big layout likes to operate it too!

With a shelf layout you can't just sit back and watch the trains run--so of course operation is the answer to "what do you do with it?"

[bcammack]

Jetrock, that's a good observation. I wonder if all the folks who made such a bruhah over Dave Barrow's latest iteration of his Cat Mountain & Santa Fe in last year's Layout Planning annual understand what you do about operations?

[BRAKIE]

Guys In a nut shell..I will not build a layout of any size without operation being the center of the design.Even my 2 industrial switching layouts is design for prototypical operation...[:D] No friends one does not need a large layout for operation.

[Jetrock]

I picked up Tony Koester's "Realistic Model Railroad Operation" and got some good insights into operation. One analogy made a lot of sense--if one is playing chess, one becomes so involved in the game that it doesn't make much difference whether the pieces are hand-carved works of art or cheap plastic. Thinking of operations as a game, with its own challenges and interest, can play its own part in creating the illusion that we are all seeking to generate with our pikes.

This explains, to me, why some operations folks aren't that interested in superdetailing and scenery. Coming from the wargaming/roleplaying game world, I know a lot of games could be pretty engrossing with just cardboard counters on a paper map--one's mind provided the scenery--but I do know that miniatures wargaming was enhanced greatly by good paintjobs and scenery. An army of miniatures looks much more imposing and impressive when painted and set on terrain with buildings and scenery than an unpainted army set on a tabletop!

[Anonymous]

I mainly like to see them run 98% of the time!

[darth9x9]

Ever since I had a taste of the operations bug, I am hooked!

[Anonymous]

I will have a loop for continuse run, but because the layout will be small, operations will be used to make things interesting.

[n2mopac]

I have to say that I enjoy a good, realisitc operating session. It is both a challenge and good wholesome fun. But I also enjoy sometimes just turning the things on and watching them go by. After all, that is what I do with the prototype.
Ron

[DSchmitt]

Operations isn't restricted to just switching.

It includes meets between trains going in opposite directions, a slower train taking a siding to clear the way for a faster train, routing trains through a junction, even stopping a passenger train at a station.

[Anonymous]

I like seeing how many cars various engines can pull up my steepest grades. I just keep hooking 'em up until it can't pull no more! It's amazing how hot an engine can get!

I also enjoy running trains wide open to see if they can make turns.

Great Fun![^]

[ClinchValleySD40]

I can't imagine a layout without operations. I'm sure there are those that just like to watch trains run.

I just spent a fantastic four days in Chicago with a few buddies and we had a blast. We operated on four great layouts and enjoyed the friendship of all we ran across. Model railroaders for the most part are really great people and very enjoyable to be around.

As someone has said, operations can be as simple as you want it to be. And you'll really love sharing the hobby with fellow modelers.

[cwclark]

I like both...watching them run as i operate..that's why i'm building my layout so that 4 trains can run all the time and my switching won't interfere with the mainline trains...I did this by building long sidings so i can work the cars onto spurs off the siding without having to stop or foul the mainline trains ....Chuck[:D]

[jfugate]

The Layout Design Special Interest Group of the NMRA has some definitions they have adopted around this topic that I find helpful.

They suggest you define if you are a "railfan" or an "engineer".

If you are a railfan, just watching trains run is the most fun for you. You can sit in a single location and watch trains roll by for a long time and really enjoy it. The more trains the better.

On the other hand, if you are an "engineer" you prefer to focus on just one train and follow its progress. You want it to have a starting point, a purpose, and a specific destination. Just watching trains run is an aimless pursuit for you.

None of us are purists -- we all like either pursuit somewhat, but we all have a preference. You preference speaks volumes on what type of layout design you prefer.

The railfan tends to like scenic vistas and lots of activity, so a walkaround design is less desireable. Multideck designs destroy the scenic vistas for a railfan. But the engineer prefers a walkaround design where the train goes from point A to point B. Multideck designs are fine because you only focus on one train at a time anyway.

My own preference is for the engineer. I like to focus on one train and follow it around the layout. Hence, I am very satisfied with the multideck walkaround design on my HO Siskiyou Line. I will lapse into railfan mode briefly when I'm waiting in the hole or something during an op session, but I prefer the engineer most of the time.

[on30francisco]

I mostly enjoy watching the trains run through the towns, over trestles and bridges, and through other scenic areas. I also like to make up trains in the yard and spot cars by industries.

[Jetrock]

QUOTE: Originally posted by rsn48


A guy with a 4 by 8 is less likely to have ops sessions than the guy with a larger layout. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, I'm just saying on a percentage basis, a lot less.

Maybe the 4 by 8 in particular--but for someone who doesn't even have room for a 4 by 8, like, say, my 6'x18" layout, just running the trains around is impossible! They don't call them "switching layouts" for nothing. Admittedly, most of my operation is "off the cuff" (I kind of decide at random where each car in the consist should go when I get ready to run, but will start a card-order system Real Soon Now) but every time I turn on the power, except to test-run an engine, it's an operating session. My only real alternative to switching operations is just scooting the train back and forth...

QUOTE:
<br>Also, the guy in the hobby for a long time has seen the trains go round and round many times over, and so he is more open to another way of running.

Okay, this is true--but one might also argue that the guy with the big layout may find it easier to let the trains run--since he has the room to let the trains go through all those panoramic vistas! Having visited layouts large and small, just watching things run is more fun when they're running on a big layout.

[vsmith]

QUOTE: Originally posted by dehusman

"Operations" is what a railroad does. Not having any operations is like restoring a classic car, but never driving it, just starting it up and letting it idle.

Dave H.

Unfortunately there are ALOT of restorers that do just that, The cars just gather dust. On the other hand there are the nutjobs that race thier vintage cars at places like Laguna Seca. I was so shocked the first time seeing a vintage 1929 Bugatti 35 being driven flat out around the track.

My layout is a mix of both ideas. It has two small yards at either end and a loop between, with sidings off the loop. If I wanted to I could run a switching operation at the north yard. run down a couple of loops while I get a soda out of the fridge, do a switching job at a siding, run a couple more loops while I change the TV channel, then do switch again at the south yard. then turn around and do it again or just let the trains roll around in a loop. My main interest is in the modeling not so much the layout itself. So having fun is more important.

[Anonymous]

I like both.

Alex in the sooner state

[dehusman]

"Operations" is what a railroad does. Not having any operations is like restoring a classic car, but never driving it, just starting it up and letting it idle.

Dave H.