My wife bought me the Athearn HO scale Amtrak California EMD F59PH for Christmas. It's great. Heavy engine, not too fast, but one of the strongest engines I have. I didn't get any passenger cars to go with it, so I had it pulling frieght trains for a bit just to play with it.
I've posted here before about looking for the Phase V superliners, and finding that the only ones made were overland brass, and I don't have $1200 to pay for toys. So what's a guy to do?
I called con-cor, and ordered two undecorated sleepers. They arrived quickly, and for being as old as they were, they were in pretty decent shape. I would have like to have ordered the Walthers, but my train budget for the year (2007) is already nearly shot. I paid 1/4 for the concors as I would have for the Walthers, and that includes the concor shipping.
I have very easy access to seeing the Amtrak California cars live. I live less than a mile from the line, and we have at least 4 trains a day that I see go by. So taking my live pictures of the prototype train, I was able to do the models. I had to sacrafice a set of doors, as the Phase V have two double doors on each side, and all the cars I had access to only had a single door per car. I need to get the decal sheets that have upper and lower case letters, (I've only been able to find the uppercase), and the cars will be finished.
and for those of you who haven't seen them, this is the prototype. Credit to Matthew Mealer for the photograph.
Nice job.
See Superliners in the right paint are an OK substitute for real California cars. I wonder why Walthers hasn't tried a Superliner coach painted in Amtrak California, or Surfliner colors? They have the exclusive right with Amtrak for certain paint schemes, so Walthers would likely be the one to do it...I think this is why the planned Con-Cor Superliners painted in Surfliner colors never made it. Although it makes me wonder about the Athearn AmCal, Surfliner, and Cascades painted locos as well as the Atlas AmCal locos.
I'm surprised we haven't seen phase IVb Superliners from Walthers yet. They are really dragging their feet with this exclusive license. I know of a few companies that would gladly release decals if it wasn't for this license.
Again, nice job and your Northern California HO layout residents must be happy to have such a fine looking commuter train.
For decals you might want to try Union Station Products. They currently offer HO California Car kits and I believe they come with appropriate decals.
Matt from Anaheim, CA and Bayfield, COClick Here for my model train photo website
Southwest Chief wrote: See Superliners in the right paint are an OK substitute for real California cars. I wonder why Walthers hasn't tried a Superliner coach painted in Amtrak California, or Surfliner colors? They have the exclusive right with Amtrak for certain paint schemes, so Walthers would likely be the one to do it...I think this is why the planned Con-Cor Superliners painted in Surfliner colors never made it. Although it makes me wonder about the Athearn AmCal, Surfliner, and Cascades painted locos as well as the Atlas AmCal locos.I
I
Regional bias. Most manufacturers are located in the East or Midwest and don't think it's worth their time to make passenger cars from "Out West." Which is why you see Acela models but no Caltrak, Surfliner or Cascades cars.
Maybe Athearn (based in California) should make a stab at it!
That looks like a cab control car that might be remotely using the engine on the rear as a power unit. It has enough stuff that a driver might actually run the train properly backwards.
I think the trucks are a dirty grey/Black they dont appear blue in that particular photograph.
I think that this is a fine example of a project where someone made do very well without spending 1200 dollars for a copy of one brass car. Who knows? there might actually be a seed of a new company on Ebay cranking out these cars using Con Cor Undecs as raw material.
Regarding licenses, I was part of a video game testing where they had to remove a Military Humvee from the product and built a virtual look alike to work around Licensing requirements. A little bit of a uproar over that. I dont see the need to license stuff that we use everyday ala Union Pacific. That is probably one reason those wonderful Mack Trucks are 20 dollars apeice instead of 10.
Nataraj wrote:Athearn did! Caltrain, coaster, WEST coast express, metrolink, rail runner, and sounder are a few west coast trains they did. Except, not amtrak califonria (cascades, surfliner, san jouqins, capitol corridor).
Those are the Bombardier Coaches, not the non-Superliner Amtrak bilevels.
Metro Red Line wrote: Nataraj wrote:Athearn did! Caltrain, coaster, WEST coast express, metrolink, rail runner, and sounder are a few west coast trains they did. Except, not amtrak califonria (cascades, surfliner, san jouqins, capitol corridor). Those are the Bombardier Coaches, not the non-Superliner Amtrak bilevels.
The Bombardier coaches have the opposite problem. You can get the ACE train (Altamont Commuter Express) Coaches, in Athearn RTR sets, but you can't get the ACE train f40ph in ACE paint.
Safety Valve wrote:That looks like a cab control car that might be remotely using the engine on the rear as a power unit. It has enough stuff that a driver might actually run the train properly backwards.I think the trucks are a dirty grey/Black they dont appear blue in that particular photograph.
Yep, control cab. California cars have MU run through capability so the Cab Car controls will operate the trailing loco in push pull mode.
You are also right about the truck color. However they were originally delivered in dark purple blue. They just got dirty over time and some have been replaced with non purple trucks as well. These cars are getting old quickly, as they are run in rough stop and go commuter service every day.
Note to modelers, in my area (Southern California) the Surfliner cars are looking real dirty on the outside. The stainless steel portion, if not recently cleaned, has a dull tan tint. Superliners typically also display this color if not washed. So be sure to weather your Amtrak equipment appropriately.
As a side note on the MU run through. How can Superliners be used on these push pull trains? I'm not aware of any MU specific plugs on Superliners. However I'm wondering if the Communication ports would provide MU capabilities? They use the same size cable.
Santa Fe wrote:Coll looking Cars ya got there Davy,Although yours look different then the Pic Soutwest Chief Posted.Did you get the Correct ones cause the ones ya got don't have 2 Doors on teh Side.I am not putting you down or etc just noticed the difference in yours. Good Luck too ya.
uh, you missed something in the first post.....
"I had to sacrafice a set of doors, as the Phase V have two double doors on each side, and all the cars I had access to only had a single door per car. "
I know the doors are missing. Union Station is the only people that make non-brass amtrak Cali. cars. I wasn't going to pay $40 a car for this set. Concor and Walthers only make Phase 1-4 cars. Amtrak Cali is Phase V. My set residents will just have to cram through one door. Fortunately for them, there are only 6 current residents on my set, and 3 of them are heading to the golf course!!
Thanks for the compliments all.
dayv wrote: Santa Fe wrote:Coll looking Cars ya got there Davy,Although yours look different then the Pic Soutwest Chief Posted.Did you get the Correct ones cause the ones ya got don't have 2 Doors on teh Side.I am not putting you down or etc just noticed the difference in yours. Good Luck too ya.uh, you missed something in the first post....."I had to sacrafice a set of doors, as the Phase V have two double doors on each side, and all the cars I had access to only had a single door per car. "I know the doors are missing. Union Station is the only people that make non-brass amtrak Cali. cars. I wasn't going to pay $40 a car for this set. Concor and Walthers only make Phase 1-4 cars. Amtrak Cali is Phase V. My set residents will just have to cram through one door. Fortunately for them, there are only 6 current residents on my set, and 3 of them are heading to the golf course!! Thanks for the compliments all.
Amtrak California is NOT Phase V, neither is Surfliner. The Phase V scheme is the "wave" Scheme found on the AMD-103's.
Sean
dirtyd79 wrote:Great pics all you need now is the decals. Do the Concor superliner cars have an interior in them so you can put in some HO scale passengers?
The cars have really dark tinted windows, I don't think you would be able to see anything inside.
Amtrak California is NOT Phase V, neither is Surfliner. The Phase V scheme is the "wave" Scheme found on the AMD-103's.Sean
I was mis-informed. Thank you for clarifying.
dayv wrote: Metro Red Line wrote: Nataraj wrote:Athearn did! Caltrain, coaster, WEST coast express, metrolink, rail runner, and sounder are a few west coast trains they did. Except, not amtrak califonria (cascades, surfliner, san jouqins, capitol corridor). Those are the Bombardier Coaches, not the non-Superliner Amtrak bilevels. The Bombardier coaches have the opposite problem. You can get the ACE train (Altamont Commuter Express) Coaches, in Athearn RTR sets, but you can't get the ACE train f40ph in ACE paint.
If you live in the ACE corridor, then sabotage the F40s when they're not in use during the weekends. This will make ACE buy F59PHIs and likewise Athearn will make them...problem solved :)
Metro Red Line wrote: dayv wrote: Metro Red Line wrote: Nataraj wrote:Athearn did! Caltrain, coaster, WEST coast express, metrolink, rail runner, and sounder are a few west coast trains they did. Except, not amtrak califonria (cascades, surfliner, san jouqins, capitol corridor). Those are the Bombardier Coaches, not the non-Superliner Amtrak bilevels. The Bombardier coaches have the opposite problem. You can get the ACE train (Altamont Commuter Express) Coaches, in Athearn RTR sets, but you can't get the ACE train f40ph in ACE paint. If you live in the ACE corridor, then sabotage the F40s when they're not in use during the weekends. This will make ACE buy F59PHIs and likewise Athearn will make them...problem solved :)
I think maybe just writing Athearn or Atlas and asking them to produce that model, or buying an undecorated and painting it might be a better, safer, and much more legal solution.
Metro Red Line wrote: If you live in the ACE corridor, then sabotage the F40s when they're not in use during the weekends. This will make ACE buy F59PHIs and likewise Athearn will make them...problem solved :)
Not quite. F59PHIs are no longer being manufactured. So ACE, after obtaining appropriate remedies after the sabotage, would have to get one of the MPI commuter locomotives such as the MP36. And we all know no one is making this loco in HO scale...perhaps a brass version is coming soon if not already released...but wasn't a main purpose of this post to show that most people can't afford brass
Hope you didn't think I was talking about the Athearn version...this is still being produced.
But real F59PHI's have ceased production since around 2000 or so. Something to do with crashworthiness and emission standards that took effect in 2000. Hasn't anyone noticed why all the commuter companies are now going with the MPI ugly ducklings and not the classier looking F59PHI?
But what doesn't make sense to me is the MPI locos use EMD prime movers. So I would imagine EMD could redesign the F59PHI to comply with crashworthiness standards and use the newer "cleaner" prime movers. They just need a good solid contract, and I don't see that coming any time soon with all the new orders going with MPI.
Southwest Chief wrote:But what doesn't make sense to me is the MPI locos use EMD prime movers. So I would imagine EMD could redesign the F59PHI to comply with crashworthiness standards and use the newer "cleaner" prime movers. They just need a good solid contract, and I don't see that coming any time soon with all the new orders going with MPI.
I don't quite understand the crashworthiness thing. If anything needs crashworhtiness standards in commuter trains it's the cab cars!
Hello all.
Sorry if I was wrong to 'resurrect' this old thread, but I was Google-ing around and could not find a better one on this site. (Using the search above I could not get it to work right...)
Anyhow, I am new to this site and also just getting into the model railroad hobby. My wife has purchased me an Atlas HO Amtrak California Dash-8. I have not been able to locate any cars that seem to have been made for these trains and was wondering if any of you have any updated information on them since this 2007 date?
Thanks.
Ya those were discontinued a long time ago.
But you're in luck, Walthers is coming out with a new dome car. Not sure when its realeased.
read about it here: http://atlasrescueforum.proboards.com/thread/1485
Michael
CEO- Mile-HI-RailroadPrototype: D&RGW Moffat Line 1989
irishgreek Hello all. Sorry if I was wrong to 'resurrect' this old thread, but I was Google-ing around and could not find a better one on this site. (Using the search above I could not get it to work right...) Anyhow, I am new to this site and also just getting into the model railroad hobby. My wife has purchased me an Atlas HO Amtrak California Dash-8. I have not been able to locate any cars that seem to have been made for these trains and was wondering if any of you have any updated information on them since this 2007 date? Thanks.
It is out of stock right now but there is this car....
http://www.walthers.com/exec/productinfo/932-16166
One option would be to get any Superliner car and repaint and reletter it.
The Dash 8s are used on the Capitol Corridor, Sacramento-Oakland San Jose, not the San Luis Obispo - LA - San Diego Corridor where the surfliner cars are used.
However, there are standard Superliner coaches used in the "Amtrak California" colours on Capitol Corridor trains, so a standard Walthers Superliner coach could be painted in the colours seen on the modified Con Cor car illustrated earlier in the thread.
I don't post photos to the web, but if you need one send me a message and I'll e-mail you a photo.
Both Surfliner and Capitol Corridor trains often include a standard Superliner car in standard Phase V colours, so you could just use a couple of those while you search for or repaint other cars.
I've only seen one such car in each train, either repainted or not, and trains are usually at least four cars, so even stretching the point there should be at least three repaints and one standard car for the train to look much like the prototype.
Maybe I should send the photo to Walthers and ask them to make a Superliner coach in Capitol Corridor colours too. They might not even know they exist, being located a long way from Sacramento.
Peter
HO scale kits are available from Union Station Products. Complete kits that even include decals.
Amtrak California Coach
Amtrak California Coach Baggage
Amtrak California Cab Car
Amtrak California Decals
And this is the Walthers car you could use (although discontinued and out of stock):
Amtrak California Superliner
But if you don't want a commuter train, you could model Amtrak's Coast Starlight. It can occasionally be seen with a Dash 8 like yours. Sometimes the lead loco, like the photo below (note the mismatched phase IV AC unit):
Matt, Peter and Michael,
Thanks so much for your replies. Really appreciate the information! Those Walters' Superliners look really nice, except for the single door... But the paintwork is so sweet!
BTW, have any of you done one of those Union Station kits? Would like to know how good they are before I dish over $100 on any of them.
Thanks for the great pic with the Dash8 too!
John
John,
I have the Walthers Union Station kit. Its worth every penny of that $100. Fairly easy to build, and has some nice thick and sturdy plastic.
Michael,
Thanks for the reply, but to clarify, I meant the Union Stations Products Amtrak kits. Sorry if I was not clear.
But, your Union Station kit does look pretty awesome! Is that supposed to be a particular station? I.e. Chicago, LA, etc?
While I have never bought or built the Union Station Products kit for the Amtrak California cars, I have heard that they do not match the Superliner cars. They are based off the El Capitan cars rather than the Superliner series. I think the difference is in car height and the roundness of the roof.
But, if you had a solid consist of the Union Station Products kit, you would never know. I'm still holding out hope that Walthers will release these eventually but you never know.
http://www.haworthengineering.com/
~Excellency in the Details ~
Just wanted to join in with my 2nd set of Union Station Amtrak Cali cars. This is the Surfliner Business class car, prior to decals. On the first 5 I had used the Hi-Level core kits and yes the roofs are wrong (the height of the sides is right). On the Surfliner cars I used 5 old Con-Cor Superliner bodies and they turned out much better. I saved money by buying the sides and decals only, although I splurged on the Palace interiors. Since I started these for 5 years ago I've met Antonio FP45 and discovered AlcladII of which I used Brushed Aluminum and Smoke window tinting on these kits (Model Master French Blue, also).
Mine doesn't move.......it's at the station!!!