DC or DCC???

[vw-bug]

What is your experience with DCC? I'm just know trying to learn all about and I must stay the learning curve is incredable. I have only used Digitrax and it still seems to be the most preferred from what I hear in my parts.[:)][:D][8D]

[Anonymous]

DC works for me. It will take me a little bit longer to get to HO Heaven, but once I get there I won't need it.

You should swing by the HO www.atlasrr.com forum. The same question generated over 200 replies and 4,500 readers.

[Anonymous]

Since I am in the construction stage of my HO layout, I opted for DCC and purchased a Digitrax Empire Builder. I am very pleased with it to this point and have not missed the "read" of CV values since my programming consists of address and the three voltaqes (start,mid,top). I can understand the position of a modeler who is content with DC and has many locos to equip with decoders, however the benefits of DCC have to be experienced to be realized. I operate solo, have a small layout (10x12) and like switching operations. DCC makes switching and passing and runarounds a breeze and don't forget multiple lashups.

Bill

[BRAKIE]

I use both..I use DC at the club and DCC on my home layout.I found both systems works rather well and I am just as happy using DC as I am using DCC. On my new switching layout I really have no need for DCC.I will use it because I already have it and because 6 of my units is sound equipped...If wasn't for that I could not justify the added costs of DCC on my 30" by 11'6" layout..

[Anonymous]

Jason, this topic has been "done to death" on many MRR forums, including several times each here, and at Atlas.
Results will be the same old, same old...majority of responders are pro-DCC....majority in the hobby are DC.
There's no 'correct' choice...unless you ask a DCC Evangelist.
regards
Mike

[BentnoseWillie]

QUOTE: There's no 'correct' choice...unless you ask a DCC Evangelist.

Not even then...there are different brands of DCC too... [:O)]

I agree with Mike's assessment that a large portion of modellers online seem to be using DCC, but that this is a small subset of the hobby, in which DCC users are a minority.

I will add that DCC has made command control more popular in a big hurry. While I had never seen or heard of a layout operated with analog command control in my region (Nova Scotia/Prince Edward Island/Southern New Brunswick), I now know of around fifty DCC users out of 200-300 model railroaders. From zero to 16% in less than a decade - not bad.

I think single cab DC remains the soundest choice for beginners. Once you get into more sophisticated operation, special lighting effects, and so on, DCC may start to make more sense - or it may not, depending on your own situation. I found that for what I wanted, DCC made the most sense, and left me with the additional option of sound. If I'd already had the equipment for walkaround control using DC, I'd likely have done that instead. Instead, I went with an Atlas DCC system with a Lenz XPA cordless-telephone throttle, think it's just great. [:)]

I hope that wasn't too evangelical...[8)]

[eastcoast]

I am a frequent customer of MRC tech II ( DC ).
DCC is not in my future any time soon. Good stuff,
just not for me.

[AntonioFP45]

Originally I felt that it was "too technical" for me. But after reading literature, info on this forum and talking to modelers that switched to it, I happily climbed onboard. [;)]

I was very skeptical at first but three factors that slowly "hooked" me:

[1] Quality sound decoders from Soundtraxx, particularly the DSD and DSX series. Installed properly the sounds to me are beautiful and crystal clear.

[2] It's flexible and not proprietary. You can have an NCE or Lenz system and install TCS, Digitrax, and other competitors decoders in your locomotives. Witnessed a very cool demonstration from a "no pressure" TCS rep at a train show.

[3] Components have continued to become cheaper as time goes by and more modelers try it and/or switch to it. [swg]

I'm going with the Digitrax Zephyr system. Some locomotives will receive sound while the rest will use either Digitrax or TCS decoders. At a train show I went to recently one vendor was selling new decoders for 11 dollars! We've come a long way in just a few years! [:D][8D][;)][8)][4:-)][C=:-)][C):-)][swg][tup]

Peace!

[hminky]

Everyone says DCC is complicated. Is it more complicated than cab control wiring. Yech! It takes less time to figure out DCC than wire for Cab control. I wired for DCC including the DCC control bus on a 4x8 layout in about 2 hours, I have a webpage showing how I did it. Say the same for cab control. Most of the complications of DCC are not needed by most people, speed tables, resetting cv's, etc.
Just a thought
Harold
http://www.pacificcoastairlinerr.com

[rrinker]

Well, technically, DCC is a LOT more complicated. It's just that all those bits of hardware that go into the command stations, boosters, and decoders are essentially 'black boxes' that you really don't have to understand to be able to use the technology. The HARD part is getting people to think in those terms. They see words like "microcontroller" and "computer" and think "oh no, too complicated for me" when in truth, it really doesn't matter. There is no need to understand the nitty gritty of the DCC protocol to be able to make use of it.
There is some over-simplification sometimes as well. Unless you have the most basic loop, it will take more than just 2 wires to the track Even my test loop on a 4x8 needed more than the two sets of feeders I had in it. But at least you don't need all the block toggles and assorted wiring.
The club I belonged to had DC power (this was before the NMRA DCC standard was ratified), and since very few rotary switches can handle full train power reliably, each rotary for each block was connected to a bank or relays that switched the cab power to the track. So we had DC cab busses for each cab (4 at the time), relay power, and switch machine power. Each panel has a snake of wires to a nearby board where the relays were mounted. All VERY complex. Yes, it was like building blocks, 4 IDENTICAL circuits at each spot, but wow! One panel controlling 3 blocks in a 2x16 section of the layout probably had more wiring than my entire 8x12 home layout will have using DCC.

[Anonymous]

Question: Why do you need more than one set of feeder wires with DCC, if it's all one circuit (program track excepted)?

[n2mopac]

I'm just making my first plunge into DCC for my own layout (I've operated on seveal others with DCC) and I think I am going to give MRC's new Prodigy Advance a try. I know their previous DCC products have been less than what I wanted, but this one sounds like it will do what I want.
Ron

[Anonymous]

I am still in DC and have no plans to go to DCC. No need to for me.

[AntonioFP45]

QUOTE: Originally posted by yankeejwb

Question: Why do you need more than one set of feeder wires with DCC, if it's all one circuit (program track excepted)?

Yankee,

Hopefully Joe Fugate or one of the electronically oriented guys will chime in. From what I understand feeders help assure that you are getting a strong, steady 12 volts minimum on your rails throughout the layout. Just as in regular DC rail joints, grime, or poor connections can hamper good electrical pickup the further away you get from the power source. Models like the Walther's passenger cars equipped with lights can flicker over these areas.

Many modelers with regular DC layouts also solder feeders to their rails. It's extra work but it pays off when you see your locomotives running around without hesitation or headlight flicker.

Hope this helps!

[rrinker]

Yes, absolutely correct Antonio

The problem is voltage drop int he rails, caused by two things. For one thing, the effective wire guage of HO and smaller track is not very great, thus there is a voltage drop from 'wire' resistence. Then, there is the issue of rail joiners, unless you solder EVERY rail joint, which is a topic for another thread. I personally wouldn;t do this, there would be no room for any expansion and contraction if every joint was solid.

It seems G scalers don't have this problem too much, as the rail is very large, and there are clamp fittings that are used at the joints to make a tight current path.

[AntonioFP45]

QUOTE: Originally posted by rrinker

Yes, absolutely correct Antonio

The problem is voltage drop int he rails, caused by two things. For one thing, the effective wire guage of HO and smaller track is not very great, thus there is a voltage drop from 'wire' resistence. Then, there is the issue of rail joiners, unless you solder EVERY rail joint, which is a topic for another thread. I personally wouldn;t do this, there would be no room for any expansion and contraction if every joint was solid.

It seems G scalers don't have this problem too much, as the rail is very large, and there are clamp fittings that are used at the joints to make a tight current path.

Thanks Rrinker. Question: Do you know if is helpful to use the expensive wire that's supposedly on the market. If I'm not mistaken, the silver content is supposed to be higher than a typical wire and helps conduct "juice" with less resistence. I've seen some expensive fancy looking wiring that Extreme Stereo hobby fans use in their car and home systems.

Just wondering if these types of items would make a significant difference.

[rrinker]

I suppose it would, but I don't know that it would be worth the extra cost. The idea is to find a REASONABLE amount of loss per foot, and unless you have runs of wiring going more than 50 feet, regular #12 wire is plenty sufficient. There's always #10 if you need a longer run. Both are available in large spools at most any home improvement store. At some point I think it becomes much more effective to use multiple boosters and distribute them near where the power is needed - chances are if you have a layout that's over 50 feet long, it's not for ONE person to operate just ONE locomotive at a time, and you need more than 5 amps of power anyway.
Even on a smaller layout, it's usually best to locate the booster in the middle somewhere - for example, on the 8x12 I am building, if I put the booster at one 'end' (well, the layout is rectangular, so there is no end but you get the idea) and ran wires all along under the track to connect feeders to, I would need 40 feet of wire. If I run wires in BOTH directions with the booster in the 'middle', each wiring run is only 20 feet. That is, the furthest away something that draws power from the booster would be is 20 feet, vs 40 feet the other way. Less distance, less voltage drop for the same size wire.

--Randy

[Anonymous]

I am currently running a small HO 4x8, though it has 3 "main" lines, reversing section and sidings for industries and engine services. Very busy to say the least. I chose DCC without hesitation because all tracks are interconnected and in this way any train can run on any line in any direction. DC with block control would have been a total nightmare and would have severely limited my operational capabilities. At present I am using an MRC Command 2000 with a walkaround and though the system is very limited, for this size layout without sound in any locos, it serves just fine. I have AA, ABB and ABBA lashups and 3 steam locos and one lone F7A all of which can and sometimes do run at the same time. So IMHO DCC is the best thing in model railroading realism.

[Anonymous]

i have DC but me and my dad are going to swicth to DCC because we have a huge layout with many reasons it would be great.

[Anonymous]

i have DC but me and my dad are going to swicth to DCC because we have a huge layout with many reasons it would be great.

[AntonioFP45]

Rrinker,

I appreciate the info on booster placement! I definetly can use it. My layout will be an "around the wall" type approximately 20 ft. total length. My first HO layout was an electrical "train wreck" so I want to do what I can to ensure maximum electrical contact.

Thanks!

Peace with an E7 in Run 8!

[rexhea]

Antonio,
I have about a 70 foot run not including branches for my buss. I use 12 gauge solid conductor copper wire which has a DC resistance of 2 ohms per 1000 ft. and is rated at 23 amps current. This translates to 0.14 ohms resistance for the end of 70 feet or a voltage drop of 0.7 volts for 10 loco's drawing 5 amps. Now, this will vary a little since the DCC signal is not straight DC, but a bi-polar signal.

The point is that you can get plenty of "juice" to any point in your layout without a booster. Every connection on the track (joiners) will add to the total resistance and drop more voltage. The key thing is to have feeders every 6-9 feet to insure the track itself is getting the power evenly from the buss. Some will put them every 3 foot section of flex.

Boosters have a very important role in a layout, but unless your running at the capacity of your command station or have special needs such as powering a loop or wiring power districts , (IMHO) I can't see the need.

Note Antonio: I have just found out that the BLI Southern E7's I have ordered will be delayed by months[:(][:(][:(!][:(!]

[ClinchValleySD40]

NCE DCC. Once you try DCC, you'll never go back.

Poll is a bit out of whack. There is no more System One being made and NCE was left off the list.

[AntonioFP45]

Thank you Rex.

I'm keeping info like yours in a note folder for when I construct my layout (hopefully soon!)