What do I need to Start?

[Hawks05]

yesterday i went over to a friends house to help him get set up for some fantasy basketball stuff. his dad asked if i'd like to look at something so i said sure. i knew he was into model railroading and all of that but the last time i saw his collection was probably 6-7 years ago when i was maybe 10-11 years old. so he shows me the laundry room with some stuff. i was like this can't be all. so we go to the next room and walk/crawl in under the tracks and i look up and i'm just in awe of what i saw. this inspired me to come home and dig out my train set that i got when i was a young kid. i'm 17 now and i think this hobby would be something really cool to get into. i have like train pieces and like 10 pieces of track which are mostly curved pieces. i have the engine, a grain car, a tanker car, and a caboose.

i'd like to get into the Burlington Northern or Wisconsin Central since i live in Western Wisconsin.

have a few questions thought.

1) How should I tell my parents I want to start? We don't have a lot of spare room in our house at all so I don't know where i'd set stuff up. there is a little room next to my bedroom but that is filled with stuff that I would need to move and the floor is slopes down because they didn't put anything under it to make it flat back in the 30s.
2) What should I get to start out with? Like what cars, what type of track, what books, etc... would I need.
3) How much space would I need and what kind of layout would be good to start with? I'd say I have enough room to start a 4x8 foot layout but I don't know what i'd need to set it up?

Thanks for any help you can give me.

oh ya i'd like to use the HO scale models.

[Anonymous]

Others will answer this thread, but I have a suggestion. The two most important aspects of having a model Railroad is space available and scale. If the space you have available is limited, you might want to give N scale a look over - you can get a heck of a lot more in, in a smaller space.

Because you are 17 and slowly getting to that important moment when you leave home for good, a smaller layout will be a good thing - something that is portable, you can complete in a reasonable amount of time, and will be an invaluable teaching tool as you continue on into the hobby in your adult years.

Most newbies want continuous running, but if you are willing to sacrifice that, you could have a very interesting switching layout in your bedroom that is "L" shaped and goes down two walls.

If you want HO but realize N scale would be better for your space, go into very contemporary N scale equipment, such as todays large engines and rolling stock found on rail roads out there you can see, such as BNSF (today's version of BN); check out the SD90's in N at your local hobby shop. I showed a guy an N scale centre beam car (carries wood products) from a contemporary road (BC Rail) and compared its length to an HO 40 foot freight car - the lengths were almost identical. Contemporary N scale equipment is larger than N scale equipment from an earlier era.

The hobby is expensive, but remember there are birthday's and Christmas, so ask for what you need on those occasions from your parents and relatives.

For your parents, get a copy of Model Railroader and look for some smaller layouts in the mag - show them it can be an interesting and lifetime hobby and that there is stuff out there for guys with not a lot of space.

No one in the hobby, except for maybe Bill Gates, goes out and buys everything at once. So first you buy the wood for your layout, then some or all of the track and turnouts you need, then a power pack to run your engines, then an engine or two and some rolling stock; then maybe some scenery stuff, then some structures - this all spread out over time. Engines make a great present.

Print this reply out and show it to your parents.

To the parents:
Model Railroading is a great hobby for a teen. Your son will learn about economics, geography, politics, engineering (of structures and terrain), and transportation systems. He will learn about electricity, wood working, developing an artistic eye working with paints, chalks, and "washes." He will learn skills that will suit him in other aspects of his life other than model railroading.

But more importantly, he will enter into a hobby that will reduce a lot of external stress in his lifetime. Model railroading is really owning your own private Disney Land with trains as its theme park.

[preceng]

Can't add much to Rick's comments, other than for you to take your time and READ READ READ. When your just getting started, the more you learn, the more you find out you don't know. Don't let this overwhelm you. You will find that much like life, overcomming the seemingly overwhelming challanges are the most rewarding.

Start slow. Get a couple books that cover building a model RR from start to finish. These generally provide a wealth of info about all aspects of the hobby. Then you can get more detailed books on say electronics, or weathering techniques. I still read all of my books.

[Hawks05]

thanks for all of the help. could you suggest any websites maybe that have catalogs that i can send for and browse through. i like that idea of having something in my room but i don't have hardly any room in there. here's the thing. i used to have my room downstairs because i was scared to go upstairs because of the attic. my room was tiny then so when i was like 13 i moved upstairs. we had a ton of stuff up there. so we had to clear everything out and we don't have a lot of room. i have book shelves with stuff on it that i don't really need but if i move it i won't be able to really have a 4 wide layout since i only have like 4 feet to the wall.

i will print that out and show it to my parents so they hopefully change their minds. its just like when i wanted to get a car which i finally got 2 weeks ago after having my license for almost a year. i would pretty much get into fights about how it would be useful and i will learn responsibility and how to manage money.

what would be some good types of track to get? like size and name brand
what would be a good company to get engines and rolling stock from?
what would be good to build a layout out of?

[Anonymous]

Atlas Flex is relatively inexpensive and decent quality. Their turnouts are pretty good, too.

Athearn makes pretty good stuff - and not too expensive. Both locos and rolling stock. Some of their newer "Genesis" line is more expensive, but for starters, you could do well with the cheaper stuff.

Athearn sells basic train sets now, too.

Stay away from some of the cheaper brands. I won't mention names here, but Athearn is decent.

There are several books that have small switching layouts. You can build something small, hone your skills, and move onto something bigger later.

Perhaps after proving to you parents that you plan on sticking with the hobby, they would make some allowances for you to find some more room for a layout.

Rob

[Anonymous]

You might want to look into "modules". These are typically 24"x48" and are joined together to form a layout. If the track height and the entry/exit points are the same in all modules, they can be switched around for variety. Moreover they are very portable, which means when you move out into the Big Bad World you don't have to abandon your layout #8212; you can take it with you and reconfigure it to suit your new space.

There are also modular layout clubs in many communities, where members build to the same specifications and can combine their modules at operating sessions and displays. This might be an excellent place to start learning, by seeing what others have done and asking how they did it. Read lots of books and magazines. Check out local libraries. There's a huge body of information on the Internet, too.

And have fun with it. Don't feel you have to do everything as well as the "lifers" do. They have decades of experience and practice, and someday you'll be there too. Don't be put off by "experts" who think they know more about your railroad than you do. It is YOUR railroad. YOU are the expert. As long as you enjoy what you are doing, it is PERFECT.

It is a great hobby, and one you can enjoy for the rest of your life.

[eastcoast]

hey there
I totally agree with all these others. You are young enough to make these choices yourself and having the parents help is great,may I suggest that you stay no bigger than something that can slide under the bed or can attach to the walls without legs?
A module is excellent to start because there as SO many thingsd to learn and practice makes perfect. You can expand on this module into the college years and beyond. Pick up the MRmag and see what others are doing and get some inspiration and yes read read read and learn all you can!!!
I started at 13 and never looked back. My parents were VERY supportive,and I feel yours will be too.

[Anonymous]

I would generally agree with all the stuff above, including READ READ READ, to which I would add PLAN PLAN, and then BUILD - in those proportions...! I would also second (or third) the modular suggestion. I have a 4x8 sheet of plywood in my basement. Once I put any scenery on it higher than about 3", I will not be able to get it out again.

One other suggestion I have is if you like the HO equipment, but have limited space, you might want to try narrow gauge - especially if during the READ READ READ phase you discover that you might like turn of the (20th) century logging or mining instead of WC or BN. The advantage of narrow guage is that you can usually fit a larger scale (HO) into the space of a smaller one (N) because the narrow gauge HO equipment runs on N scale track.

Good luck!

Andrew

[Hawks05]

thanks for all of the help. i really appreciate it. hopefully my parents change their minds. i'll see if i can switch with someone at work and go to the nearest mall and get some magazines on saturday and start reading. i think this would be a really cool hobby to get into.

if you have anymore comments please feel free to leave them.

Thanks again.

[Anonymous]

Try the kalmbach.com website and go to the model railroader section and click the catalog section. In the catalog Kalmbach offers many books for beginners to learn the basic skills and knowledge needed to get into the hobby such as: Basic Model Railroading and HO Scale Model Railroading among others. Getting Started in the Hobby Getting Started in the Hobby Also the video Building Your First Model Railroad is a great tool to teach you how to build a first layout. These can be purchased on the kalmbach website, at most hobby shops, amazon.com or 1stplacehobbies.com. Good luck and enjoy this most fabulous hobby. You might want to get a part time job though, if you are like me I always wanted to get more items than my parents would go for!

[Anonymous]

You don't need to lay out a lot of money to get going, although the basic reference books will be helpful at any point. Try the library, the internet, the local hobby shop (mine has a "back issues bin" where old magazines can be had for 50cents). Much of the information is repeated over and over - for example Model Railroader will periodically do "back to basics" - there are soldering articles from the 40s, 50s, 60s, 70s and so on. Soldering hasn't changed that much - you don't really need the newest book to tell you how to do it. The only exception is DCC, which is new, and still changing somewhat, at least in terms of price and what features are available.

I have gotten a lot of good information using these sources, and can then save my money to buy the materials, locos, track, whatever that I need to turn my plans into a real layout. For $15 to $20 I can either have two to three new magazines, or 5 old ones, plus a new piece of rolling stock.

Andrew

[Jetrock]

One way to get your parents on your side would be to get them involved. If your parents have any interests or hobbies that parallel model railroading (electronics, dollhouse making, art, woodworking, history, etcetera) ask them for advice about how to do X, Y or Z. Believe me, 17 year olds who ask their parents for advice about *anything* is as rare as a three-headed cow, and 17 year olds who want their parents involved in their interests and activities even rarer. The fact that you are seeking their approval speaks volumes about your own maturity, and it seems like it would be easier to convince your parents that you want to get into model railroading than, oh say, getting a Mohawk haircut or facial tattoos (though, having had a blue Mohawk myself at one time myself, they aren't necessarily incompatible.)

There are other side benefits of getting your parents involved--if you get them "hooked", you may discover they will buy things on their own "to run on the kid's layout" just as many of us adult hobbyists justify getting stuff so we can "break it in" for kids or nephews. And, more importantly, shared activities will build a bond that will last a lifetime. My dad got me into model railroading as a kid, and even though I abandoned it while in college and my twenties, when I got back into it, my dad and I got to share that sense of closeness and shared purpose again. Even if you don't appreciate that now, it is a sure bet that your parents will.

Oh yeah--if you are looking for cheap trains, save up any Christmas money you get and hit the hobby shops in January when they're selling off excess Christmas train sets at discounted prices.

[Anonymous]

Well you have a good source in your friend to start with. You can tap them for some basic info.

I just started with a bachmann hogwarts set and launched from there, along with some dollar store houses. I hated the snow on them so I repainted the snow green to look like moss.

another thing is to poke around and see if you can find info at the library (as others said) or maybe a bunch of old model train magazines, and eventually a subscription to something like model railroader. walther catalog comes out once a year for about 20 dollars and can give you tons of ideas, even if you don't buy the models... you might come up with a way to make them on your own.

space was a big thing for me too. Like others said think about what you can do. modular is great, or you might just try to set up say a lenght of several strait tracks with switches along a wall that challenge your ability to transfer and switch the cars. N is about half of HO scale, and while I enjoy HO scale better too you can fit a decent N scale layout on an old door

good luck with things. Don't get discouraged, it's a hobby that takes time. You can see from my set up (in my sig link) that our churches set up isn't much more than some track on a green tablecloth with dollar store houses right now. as it builds it's kind of exciting watching it grow though!

[Anonymous]

Before getting too far into the hobby, I would advise you to visit a model railroad open house or a train show to get some ideas of what is possible. With the approach of Christmas and cold weather, there will be a lot of shows in the next couple of months.

You might also investigate joining a model railroad club. Talk to the members and get their opinions about the best way to approach starting a layout. Some will be helpful and some may not, but if you talk to enough model railroaders you will learn a lot from their experience. Some are very partisan about the scale they model, but you should make your choice based on your skill level and what you think _you_ will enjoy.

Start small and take your time. One of the biggest mistakes beginners make is to take on too much layout at once and then ending up feeling like they never accomplish anything. One other piece of unsolicited advice: the goal of a layout should not be how much track you can cram into a given space. In the real world, things like houses, buildings, fields, trees and water predominate. Railroads are but a small part of the overall scene and should not overwhelm it.

Also, prototype railroads try to keep things simple so that they run smoothly. Follow their example. Too much track, especially in small spaces with cramped curvature leads to operating problems that steal the fun out of model railroading.

[Anonymous]

I would advise you to buy a Walthers catalog. There is just about everything you want in there from models to how-to books and tapes. Plan well for you may think you have allotted enough space, but once you start to build, the space dwindles rapidly. Most of all, the object of the excercise is to have fun. Good luck.

[Anonymous]

Hey,
I was 13 and I was so excitted by what Atlas had for track plans. But do you want to run a train around or switch cars? I liked the building process at 13 'cause I was running trains around in circles since I was 8. So building was on my list. You get a lot of hints in 9- railroads you can build by Atlas. Since i was a beginner it was the best. You have to remember that "rome wasn't built in one day" so take your time and get someone to give you a hand. Its fun and I'm 44 now and 2 boys of my own 14 & 17 and we are starting one layout of our own. I got a 4 x 8 premade layout that we will fix up. I have no inside room but I have to tarp it outside. But I'll make a pull away roof suggested by my wife. I hope this helps.
Jim

[Hawks05]

i'm more into building like straight pieces of track that curve and somewhat look life like. but if i don't have a lot of space i'll resort to circles. i mean it is better than nothing.

oh yeah one more question to add to the list. what is the CSX Railroad. i was sitting in English class today and my school is by the railroad tracks. so i was sitting there then i heard the low rumble sound of the train coming. so i kind of looked out the window for 3 minutes to watch the train go past. i was a CSX train. there were also some cars from the Wisconsin Central Railroad to that i saw. then as i was leaving class another one came through but i didn't get to see what kind that was. good thing i wasn't called on to answer a question.

is this a sign that i'm getting hooked on RR?

thanks

saturday hopefully i'll be able to find a hobby shop somewhere within 50 miles. i live in a little town of about 2200 people. we have no hobby shop anywhere near this town. the nearest "major" shopping places is 50 miles east or 45 miles west. or i could go to the Mall of America but i don't drive in the cities at all.

Help me make a list of what to get if i go shopping saturday. i know i need to look for 1-2 magazines and a hobby shop or 2 to buy stuff to start with. also i need to look for wood to build a layout with.

Thanks.

[Hawks05]

i put together a list of all the CSX cars i think i'd need. i hope i don't spend all this time and come to find out i can't start. that would really suck. i'm trying to figure out the Flex track. i think i want to start with Code 100 but i can't find the pricing for some of it. i would want to get enough for a 4x8 foot layout probably. if you could help me with the track issue and what i may need for that.

what are Dummy locomotives. are those like the 2nd or 3rd behind the main loco?

one more thing. how many cars do you think would be good for that size layout if i tried to put 2 sets or track on it? i have 13 for the CSX and now i'm trying to get about 10-12 for Wisconsin Central.

Thanks

Jim

[Jetrock]

Dummy locomotives, in model railroading, are ones that don't have a motor--they are there to represent MU'd locomotives (Multuple Units--several engines pulling the same train) but often it's not practical to run two "real" engines together since one will inevitably go faster than the other and either pull the two apart or cause a derailment. There are locomotives without cabs, called "calves" (the one with the cab is the "cow") that function the same way.

Code 100 track is usually the cheapest and most common type, it's fine to start with. Atlas is typically the cheapest brand. What do you need to figure out about flextrack? Stick to Snap-Track if it's easier for you to work with, but it has its own limitations, especially if you like gradual curves.

Try a Yahoo Yellow Pages search for hobby shops in Appleton or Green Bay (so far as I know, the closest cities to you) and check some out the next time you're that way.

If you are building a 4x8 foot layout, there are *thousands* of track plans out there. You can even do some track planning on your computer (check out www.atlasrr.com to download their free track-planning software!) which will let you play with designs before you start.

One hint--if you're building a 4x8, make sure that you can either have access to either side of it or can put it on wheels so you can roll it out from the wall to work on the far side (or pick up that derailed train, which will, inevitably, derail on the far side of the room most often.)

As to how many cars you should have--first, establish a track plan. Figure out how much space there will be for cars in all industrial sidings and yard tracks. That total is how many cars you *should* have--though, if you're like most model railroaders, before long you'll end up with more rolling stock than you can fit on the entire layout, several times over...

[Hawks05]

ok. cause i had that i needed like 2 loco's for the train. now i just need to get dummies.

i live about 40-45 minutes east of the Twin Cities or about 50 miles west of Eau Claire. i found one in downtown Eau Claire by the train yards. i have a idea where it is since i got my car out that way. i found one in Rice Lake as well. come this spring though i'll be going to Appleton/Green Bay for bowling tournaments so i'll be able to get that way.

i think i have enough room in the spare room for a 4x8 layout. not to sure. i have to measure tonight again.

i'd like to get Flex Track since it would be easier to work with but Snap track would be the easiest i'm guessing. i want to have tight curves so to speak because of the space that i have.

[eastcoast]

hawks05
hey eastcoast here,[:)]
CSX is a huge class 1 railroad that bought out virtually every east coast railroad into one huge company. Just to start , Chessie System and Seaboard are in that mess.
I will research this all the way for you.CSX includes in full;
chesapeake & ohio, Baltimore & ohio , Atlantic coast line, Seaboard air line, Louisville & Nashville, 42% of Conrail. My source for this is the Rutledge Historical Atlas of American RR. Need More? Just ask.[:D]

ken_ecr

[Anonymous]

If you drive near the Twin Cities, there's Hub Hobby off of Hwy 36 and Rice St. in Little Canada, or Becker's Model Railroad Supply in New Brighton, 2166 Silver Lake Road, [phone]. (Recommended).

Gary

[Hawks05]

how far is New Brighten from Hudson, Wisconsin. i may go up to Woodbury on saturday. still trying to decide which way to go, west or east. i've found 2 hobby shops in Eau Claire and i've found 2-3 in Woodbury.

[Hawks05]

so pretty much CSX doesn't have anything to do with the midwest. thats cool. maybe i'll stick to the burlington northern,milwaukee road, and wisconsin central.

[Anonymous]

Hawks05,
Last night, you mentioned having tight curves. Think about sticking to 4-axle locomotives and shorter cars. I like the 40 foot boxcars. The shorter locos and cars stay on the tight curves much better, in my experience.

[Anonymous]

I'm not sure how far New Brighton is from Hudson, but it's north of Minneapolis and St. Paul on 694, west of I-35W. You can check the website for Becker's http://members.aol.com/wcbecker/ and e-mail him, or check out mapquest for a good route.

Gary

[Anonymous]

Hello,

First off I would like to welcome you to the great hobby of model railraoding. It sure is a blast. I have been doing it activly and continuously since the age of 4. This active interest has allowed me to become a craftsman level modeler at the mere age of 21! :)

I would like to say that all the advise you have recieved so far is top notch. You would not go awry by following it.

I have gotten several people into the hobby, I find once their layout is built that many of them end up with two powered locomotives and between 10-15 cars divided between two local trains and the indistries on the layout. I run a model railroad custom painting, and design business (http://w3.trib.com/~mrljim) and will be happy to adivise you in any thing you need help in. (I do not reccomend directly employing my company's services as they are intended for the older modeler wanting customised modeles made for them and the service is quite expensive)

Atlas is a good company to use for track.

This may seem counter to some of the advice other people may give. However I would take the money now and invest in a Digitrax Zephyr DCC control system. The unit is very easy to set up and get you started on the cutting edge of modern model train control, and Digitrax brand is design to expand with your model railroad, so you only need the basic starter consol to get started. One other advantage is that the Zepyr starter set is set up so that you can convert the standard train set power pack you already have into a DCC throttle and thus your investment in that piece of equipment is not wasted. I am also volunteering on teh Wiring for DCC website (http://www.wiringfordcc.com) and can help you get started. I would like to state that I my self was hesitant to start DCC but I found that in reality it makes thing very very easy to run. Its just discussing how the system actually works that gets compicated. DCC can be used in any scale.

Another style of model railroad that you mgiht want to consider is a system known as shelf layout. It generally consists of shelvs between 8 and 18" (12" is the most common i have seen) wide with tracks laid out in a switching pattern. Then if one wants continuous running the shelf can be mounted relatvly high. About chin hight perhaps. and ran all the way around the room. The all the way around the room version is known as a"wall track" system. I have built two of these layouts my self and are quite fun. Often the shelving pieces are small eneugh that one can work on each section at the workbench. (Comandeered kitchen table perhaps?) and then installed in its final posistion. They are often small eneugh that they can be moved with a minimum of fuss as well.

One more piece of information I would like to pass along. Like other people have mentioned before, finding fellow modelers is always helpful. I would like to mention a chat room that me and several of my friends frequent on an almost nightly basis. I highly reccomend Trainweb's "Railchat" chat room. (http://www.railchat.com) THere are many people there who share a passion for model railroading and are more than willing to give advise to a fresh recruit like you.

Well I hope I have been of some help. Feel free to email me at [e-mail] and I look foward to possibly seeing you in Railchat.

Sincerely Yours

James R. Mitich

[Hawks05]

QUOTE: Originally posted by GaryA

I'm not sure how far New Brighton is from Hudson, but it's north of Minneapolis and St. Paul on 694, west of I-35W. You can check the website for Becker's http://members.aol.com/wcbecker/ and e-mail him, or check out mapquest for a good route.

Gary

do you know of any places in woodbury or stillwater. thats where i'm more likely to go. also do you know of any shows or anything like that coming up in the twin cities area?

[Hawks05]

Grayhound thanks for the help. most likely i'll be emailing you asking for some help. i'll take a look at the chat room a little later. right now i have homework so i'm busy with that but i look forward to you help along the way along with everyone else here who has helped me. i really appreciate it and it is really getting me motivated to purchase my first locomotive saturday or at least books and magazines to help me get an idea for what to do.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: do you know of any places in woodbury or stillwater. thats where i'm more likely to go. also do you know of any shows or anything like that coming up in the twin cities area?

No, I don't know of any stores in Woodbury or Stillwater, but I believe there's a show coming up at Woodbury High School on one of the coming weekends. I'll check and let you know.

Gary