AHM Engine, good, bad or in driffernt?

[emdgp92]

Ken,

Look at it this way. If the engine decides to "keel over," you can always put it back on Ebay as a "junk lot" or park it "stored unserviceable" near your locomotive shops. I have a few dead Bachmann F units that I've weathered (peeling paint, lots of rust and grime) simply to sit around the shops as "parts supplies" for my other Fs. At the time, it simply wasn't worth fixing them--the motors were shot, and would have cost almost as much as a new one.

If that idea isn't for you, why not butcher the unit, and dump the parts in a scrapyard? Quite a few rail-served yards also take in locomotives. Sometimes, you can see parts of them sitting around.
 (In fact, MR did an article awhile back about one guy who has an F7 cab in his basement layout room!)

Another solution might be to lay down a section of rail in a park, and use the engine as a town display. If you've ever been to Horseshoe Curve, there's a GP7 up there, surrounded by a high fence. A display engine could be anything--a little Model Power 0-4-0, an F7, Geep, even a Big Boy.

As if that wasn't enough, how about this idea? Suppose you have a dummy interchange on your layout...but don't want to actually run trains there. A "dead" engine would be perfect--you could simply park it, and wire up the headlight.

[Don Gibson]

KENNY:

TO REPEAT: "You are buying things you are unfamiliar with, sight unseen."  True or false?  Is this wise?

"Your attempts at fixing things is laudable".- That's "laudable", not laughable.

Don't ask me what I really think, because  (I worry about your judgement). I'll just let myself off the hook, with a simplistic "It's your Railroad" - so 'enjoy', 'enjoy'.

Whether it's inability to resist a 'bargain', or a masochistic streak , YOU are the one (reading your earlier posts) crying out for help - but if you are bent on repeating mistakes, go ahead. 

Re:AHM

(Quote) "I am not the first one that bought one and will not be the last either"

.  I rest my case.

 

[oleirish]

Driline  : Its five feet wide and ten feet long,not finished yet but fun!!

KEN: right on!!

JIM

[cudaken]

Gee Mr Gibson, I think maybe you should see a Proctolgist and get the tie pulled out your Caboose! You have made me learn and in a unfreindly way. Thanks to you telling me I cannot make something work I have.

 As far as buying something I did not know about you are right. Reason why I bought is I  remember IM, AHM is close but not the same thing.

 As far as my attempt's of repair being laughable. You bring $200.00 worth of enginges and rolling stock and I will bring the same and have a train off at K-10 trains!  $200.00 worth of what ever and I will bring $200.00 of my junk, longest train up a 2% garde win's the other person train. I will even let the losser spend the night with me at the home stead. After lossing your train I hate to have the losser have to pay for a hotel room.

 Now lets play nices and your comments are still welcome. Just tone down your comments a little.

 Driline, yep I am pretty happy with what I have for now. I am guessing that a few people here that was not born with a silver spike in there mouth have bought a AHM engine so they know what they don't like. So Iam not the first one that bought one and will not be the last either.

 One the I taught my managers, don't be afraid to make mistakes! It is the best way to learn and over come them. I used this rule when I was racing and still do today.

 On the PIC that where posted of the board, I can only wish at this point. But I will get there! My board is U shaped 19' X 13' X 8' and 38" wide. I am buying lumber so I can do a class board as so as I know what I want.

 Cuda Ken, not wanting to fight again.

[Driline]

KEN

Hang in there Remember its your railroad!!!!!!!

There are people who figure if you don't have a million dollors you should not be in model railroading!!!

And then there are those who don't even have an model railroad,but think they know everything!!

I sorta of like to mess around with everything So I make my own mastakes but learn from my mastakes!!

S.P. forever

your do'in fine KEN

JIM

It looks  like you gotta lotta trains there in a small space. Just how big is your layout anyway?

[oleirish]

KEN

Hang in there Remember its your railroad!!!!!!!

There are people who figure if you don't have a million dollors you should not be in model railroading!!!

And then there are those who don't even have an model railroad,but think they know everything!!

I sorta of like to mess around with everything So I make my own mastakes but learn from my mastakes!!

 

S.P. forever

your do'in fine KEN

JIM

[Don Gibson]

C.KEN:

E Bay is not your friend,   Seems to me that you are 'living proof'  !              - and they say that 'Love is blind'. You are buying things you are unfamiliar with, sight unseen.  (Don't buy any land in Florida).

WORSE, YOU'RE STILL DOING IT!

Do you have some sort of 'Death Wish' ?   You like to collect 'Orphans' ?   or have you just always wanted to run a 'Repair Service'? Your attempts at fixing things is laudable - however that is where I get off.

Don't ask me what I really think.

AHM / Associated Hobby Models has become IHC / International Hobby Corp. who are importers of cheap goods overseas. Old AHM Engines (made by Rivarossi) generally had wheels with 'cookie cutter' flanges - popular in the European 'toy train' market - but less so here, and of course with 'horn-hook' couplers.

COMPLAINT:  European type flanges 'bottomed' on some U.S. made .turnouts.   YOU probably should have some.

 

 

[jondrd]

You'd have to have twenty hands to have enough thumbs to give the thumbs down to AHM engines. ...................

As some suggested, Cuda Ken, ask first, then buy. One of the reasons some of us are here is to help fellow model railroaders learn by not replicating our mistakes.

 

Jon

 

[GearDrivenSteam]

Yeah, like I've told him all along, at least he's learnin what to stay AWAY from. LMAO.

[csxns]

I had that same loco and put a Atlas Roco fly wheel on the back shaft and it ran better.

[cudaken]

 Thanks for the kind word's Selector. Yep it has been a jounry but I have learned alot.  My cheap rolling stock with up grades roll as well as my Athearns.

 Have all so found away of taking the slop out of the push in trucks.  Couple of Kadee spacers, part of a paper clip and some liquied nail and ready to roll and no slop. Off the rails tuck hangs just like a Athearn RTR (was not impressed with the one I bought I will add). Just because it cannot work does not mean it won't work!

 I am dummy, but not stupid.

               Cuda Ken

[selector]

 Welll it sounds like it is going to be better than the Life Like Pancake engines I started with. Mainly  looking for something that would pull around 10 to 15 cars. My long trains are pulled by PK's and BB's. 

 As far as buying good engines, I do. Mainly Athearn and PK's. But NIB and $10.00 with shipping what the heck.

 Reason I did not ask, well to be honest I forgot about it while I was watching the auction. Went to  watching section and there it was with 5 minutes.

 Some of the folks here and gotton on my caboose about buying old worn out engines from E-bay and rightly so. Yep, got to buy parts, bug you fine folks about what wrong with them and then fix them. But, another way to look at it is with the way I run my board (Tuesday 6 hours a lone) I am going to ware out the new stuff as well, might as well start learing about fix this stuff now than later. Either way break downs are coming.

 Thanks on the tip about Hard Wiring the trucks as well.

 

                 Cuda Ken

You tell 'em, Ken.  And let's not forget that while you are doing all this, you are learning a great deal.  There will soon come a time when you will be an authority about fixing modest stock on this forum; instead of someone who needs to be guided, you will be able to guide others. At the same time, those who opine that the hobby is getting too expensive will begin to appreciate that it takes someone with a dogged and methodical approach to developing a decent model railroad to fix and improve the less fine and expensive items that can still be had on ebay and other places for just a few dollars.

[cudaken]

 Welll it sounds like it is going to be better than the Life Like Pancake engines I started with. Mainly  looking for something that would pull around 10 to 15 cars. My long trains are pulled by PK's and BB's. 

 As far as buying good engines, I do. Mainly Athearn and PK's. But NIB and $10.00 with shipping what the heck.

 Reason I did not ask, well to be honest I forgot about it while I was watching the auction. Went to  watching section and there it was with 5 minutes.

 Some of the folks here and gotton on my caboose about buying old worn out engines from E-bay and rightly so. Yep, got to buy parts, bug you fine folks about what wrong with them and then fix them. But, another way to look at it is with the way I run my board (Tuesday 6 hours a lone) I am going to ware out the new stuff as well, might as well start learing about fix this stuff now than later. Either way break downs are coming.

 Thanks on the tip about Hard Wiring the trucks as well.

 

                 Cuda Ken

[rrinker]

AHM was the original importer of Rivarossi and their engines were the equivalent of P2K today (in their time).  Most have a three pole open frame motor that had ball bearings and most ran pretty well but noisy.  The AHM/Rivarossi GG1 is a fine runner and very smooth because the motor is mounted vertically and a worm drives the wheels directly rather than through a series of shafts.  I'd take everyone of those I could get my hands on and do.  I've bought 28 of them on E Bay for my fleet.

 While it's true they run well, pull good, and look very nice, one thing to watch out for is that ALL the Rivarossi GG1's have flanges that are deeper than RP25 standards, and will NOT run on code 83 track. If you use Code 100 - no problems.
 The newer Mehano versions use the same tooling, but seriously need more weight, they can barely move themselves let alone a decent train of passenger cars. They have the same spaces for the same size weights used in the Rivarossi versions, they just saved a few cents and leftout the metal plates used as weights.

                                             --Randy

[jeffrey-wimberly]

My view on AHM locos is this. Avoid them! I've had 3 and all of them were junk.

[Darth Santa Fe]

AHM's quality depends on who the manufacturer was. The quality of their engines was from the less detailed but smooth running Mehano made stuff to high quality brass.

The engine you got was the only one ever made for them by Roco. It should be a smooth runner, and the detail looks pretty decent except for that EMD type vent behind the cab (RMC magazine accidentilly put it in their diagram of the engine). If you want to know just what kind of drive is in there, there's an exploded parts diagram in the Literature section of http://hoseeker.net (it will be under the Rivarossi name, since they made most of AHM's stuff).

[tankertoad70]

One thingie about AHM lokeys is they can be a great starting point for kitbashing.  There have been articles in past MR's about modelers who have taken AHM power and turned them into first rate runners and well detailed to boot.  I don't use stock AHM stuff, but have found them to be a great start for kitbashing.  I took one of their GP18s, kitbashed the daylights outa her (fun project to boot), and she came out looking like a respectable unit that modelers tell me it couldn't have been an AHM unit.

[rrebell]

Since you like ebay why not go for like a kato or one of the newer atlas, you can pick them up for as little as $25.00. I'm mostly into steam really, but have picked up 0-8-0 proto's for as little as $65.00 so you might do even better on the diesels ( hey I finaly learned how to spell diesel, I'm so proud of myself ).

[emdgp92]

The paint scheme is nothing like the real one. It didn't have the white stripe running through it and there was no such road number 853. PLUS, everything on it is not to scale meaning the handrails, ect.

It looks like AHM used the scheme BN had on their E units. These did have the white stripe. BTW, has anyone seen one of Tyco's "BN" E units? I have one of their E7s in a similar "fantasy" scheme. This one has a green nose and roof, but with silver sides.

[ndbprr]

AHM was the original importer of Rivarossi and their engines were the equivalent of P2K today (in their time).  Most have a three pole open frame motor that had ball bearings and most ran pretty well but noisy.  The AHM/Rivarossi GG1 is a fine runner and very smooth because the motor is mounted vertically and a worm drives the wheels directly rather than through a series of shafts.  I'd take everyone of those I could get my hands on and do.  I've bought 28 of them on E Bay for my fleet.

[dknelson]

AHM stuff was made by a wide variety of manufacturers, and sometimes they would find cheaper copies of their own stuff, so that some Fairbanks Morse C Liners are Rivarossi and others are Yugoslavian knock offs (yet the knock offs had slightly more accurate trucks so go figure ....). 

They were inexpensive and you got what you paid for.   I bought two used engines of the kind your picture shows at a swap meet and I think I paid $15 for the two, and the guy threw in a freight car or two if I recall correctly.  

The major problems with AHM engines are/were these, and I speak here mostly of the diesels.  First for a long time they had horribly oversize flanges that will not run reliably on many makes of Code 83 (and smaller) rail -- even some makes of Code 100 turnouts have problems.  Over time they addressed that so look at a model carefully before buying if you have Code 83 or Code 70 rail. 

Second, the motors were decidedly cheap.  Often three pole motors, meaning that slow speed operation was erratic.  Also the motors were often small and heated up under load (risky because many of their engines have rubber traction tires, so burn out of a motor is not unheard of).  Also in their early engines they used an odd combination of carbon and wire brushes on the motors -- the brushes wear the commutator and the carbon needs replacement from time to time.   Some of their "flat" motors are particularly poor runners.

Third the diesels had truck mounted X2F couplers and therefore big gaps at the pilots of the engines.

Fourth often the paint was applied too thickly -- or they would color the plastic and not paint the engine at all which gave some of them a translucent look.

And many details were poor such as handrails, horns, stanchions, etc. 

Having said that, for the time they often had quiet and smooth mechanisms meaning repowering with a can motor often gets good results.  However some of their mechanisms using flat motors are so odd and unique that repowering is not always the easy option.   The BL2 and C Liner are examples. 

They had some interesting prototypes that others did not (and still do not) feature.  And some paint schemes were rather well done by the standards of their time.  

A friend of mine who is a custom painter who works almost exclusively in brass was once asked to repaint an AHM engine.  He reluctantly agreed -- stripped the paint off the engine -- and told me he was amazed at the level of detail that was on the shell.  

In short -- if the price is right go ahead and buy an old AHM engine but regard it as a project, not as a ready to run purchase.   And I guess I have to mention here that I say that as someone with a forty-plus year old "scrap box" of motors, chassis, and other parts to dip into when doing this kind of project.  If I had to buy everything needed new I'd probably take a pass ....

Dave Nelson

[Anonymous]

It's not as bad as people think it is. If you clean the motor up and give is some weight it can be a pretty smooth running loco. I had the same exact one. This is how I know. What's not good about it is that it's not Prototype at all. Now BN  had C424's and 425's and I think that supposed to be close to a C425. The paint scheme is nothing like the real one. It didn't have the white stripe running through it and there was no such road number 853. PLUS, everything on it is not to scale meaning the handrails, ect.

What I did to it since I got it to run smooth without any jerking on the track.
1. Solder additional wires to the trucks for constant power
2. Added Weight
3. Remove the handrails and get some Athearn metal ones
4. Stripped it bare and repainted it to prototype
5. Add correct decals

Presto. Everything in MRR is not useless unless it don't work at all.

[BRAKIE]

The 60 era AHM locomotives was smooth runners and can not be compared to Tyco or the train set Bachmann.Of course these locomotives was made by Rivirossi...

[RoyalOaker]

These guys are right, They are not the best engines around.   But,  I have had an old geep for about thirty years and it still runs.   It doesn't run like my Atlas, or Spectrum engines or even my BB, but it runs.   I let my five year old son take it out every now and again.   He has two speeds,  Stop and ALL OUT.  The gearing on this engine must put the scale MPH at 200.

I have seen some of these AHM engine run great for many years.  However for each gem out there, there is a probably a dead engine stuck in an engine shop.

 

[Soo Line fan]

In general, I have to agree with these guys. AHM are / were better than Tyco, but that is not saying much. I had a SD-40 and it was mechanically inferior. The bodies are not too bad so the best advice is put one on top of a BB chassis. IHC owns a lot of the AHM stuff as well as the old Tyco molds.

This one is kind of odd. Roco built this Century 424 model for AHM and it has never resurfaced. The roof has a GM fan behind the cab, which is incorrect. In the late 70’s and 80’s Roco built a line of Diesels for Atlas and they were state of the art at the time. Roco also built the Model Power Sharks and they ran very well.

Ken, as this is a Roco built unit, I would like to see a picture of the mechanism.

 

Jim

[GearDrivenSteam]

Dam dude, with all the crap you've bought, you couldda bought four or five REAL good ones. Think about that.

[zxb1]

Next time you see an ahm up for bid, just keep scrollin by !

[Railphotog]

See the other thread "IHC Locomotive Reviews".  They are the same thing.

[Virginian]

It has been awhile, but in my experience I would rate AHM right down there with Tyco.  Not as low, since Tyco is the reverse pinnacle of the art form, but in the same vein.  Not to be too ugly, but did the sequence "ask first, then buy" ever cross your mind?