I Got The Sand, The Coal, The Water, But What the Devil About the Oil?

[selector]

Wow, John, you really went to town on that set of silos. They turned out very nicely, indeed!!

[canazar]

Selector,

Your pipe idea made think of this. I made this useing 3" drain pipe to make my grain silo's. I kinda hacked everythign else together. I made in about 30 minutes rushing to get somethign done the night before a big train show where our club had set up our module.



[:D]

It is funny. All of the places I have been buying my parts for my 4x4 fabrication shop (hardware stores, suppliers, etc) have been getting a second eye since I started my train hobby. I knwo what you mean by I love this hobby![8D]



TStage, That is a sweet setup. I am going to look into that for kicks, Thanks for posting it up.[:D]

[tstage]

John,

If you ever did decide to include a coaling tower on your layout afterall, Suncoast Models makes a very nice 4" tall Fairbanks-Morse coaling tower that can fit into a tight space. Here's a picture of one:



Tom

[selector]

I am in the throes of a substantial basement reno, and have just had a plumber in to relocate most of the Gordian Knot that fed into our septic system. I am left with several choice pieces of used PVC sewer pipe in the 2" range that are about 2.5" long...perfect for painting, putting on stilts, adding "hoses", and a conical cap to simulate a fuel loading facility. This thread has served me well. Thanks, everyone.

Jeez I luv this hobby!

[canazar]

This is turning into a great thread. [:D]

Truth be told, I would love to have coal tower up and service (1956) or still standing (2006) on the layout, but I am bit strapped for room. Plus, the buildings are close to the edge, and in between me and the tracks. For some reason, that just bugs me so I am trying to keep it low, or small.

So, for my railroads history sake and my model railroad pracitcal purposes, (and it is a small regional line), coal was very limited. If I run with my prototype version of events, coal was more or less done by the end of the 40's on the K V R. Being located in Arizona, coal was never popular. Never mined there, and not much demand for heating, (Being Arizona) coal was always difficlut and exspensive to bring in as it sometimes had to come quite aways. Oil was popular as it was much easier to come by and may of the K V R's are engine were converted to oil to get away from the dependency on coal. (Either I will get oil fired engines for my railroad, or I will end bashing them to look like oil fired types)

So, any coal service now would be limited to the occasional visitor from another road bringing in traffic. (Or when folks come over to run their stuff, they dont feel left out) and I can use a few coal hoppers loaded and track side conveyer to get away with that.

But the oil tank, well, I will need that. Some of you metioneded underground tanks, and heating devices...which all the different lines of thinking behind them makes sense.

Well, I am going to get an above ground tank for quite a few reasons... One being model railroad speaking, it will look cool ...

Thinking in "my prototype mind" Being in Central Arizona, not alot of people around so they are safe. If it were my "real railraod", I would have them painted black and let them sit in the sun to keep them warm right there. Making it easier on the oil heater. I am hitting the train shop tommorow [:D] to see if I can find a good lookin oil tank. Let you guys know how it comes out.

[tjsmrinfo]

ok found the book its "ho trackside structures you can build" and the article is titled "tank car water tank".


hope this helps

tom

[Don Gibson]

GENERAL rule of thumb:

Most STEAM used coal. .
WESTERN roads converted to oil after oil was dicovered in CA.
DIESELS need oil
BOTH used sand.

Steamers required WATER enroute. Fascilities varied with the Railroad.

[tjsmrinfo]

canazar if you can find it kalmbach has a book for ho structures, not the industries book but a different 1, sorry cant remember the name, in it theres a small water tank built using an old tank car and set on wooden pilings/trestles and is gravity fed for the steamers.
you could also get a cheap train set quality tank car and put it on styrene blocks and add piping etc.

hope this helps

tom

[David_Telesha]

QUOTE: Originally posted by tstage

David,

Hmm, that's the description they gave it on the web site. Oh, well. I trust you more than them.

Here's a picture of the Collinwood coaling tower:

>

(Double-click to enlarge)

Looks like both of them a pretty massive.

Tom

Tom,

Don't worry about it [;)]- I really appreciate that you tried to find a pic of CH.[:D][8D] The pic I posted I took it myself there in North Haven, CT. I remember walking up a pile of woodchips in a little park on a side street to get that pic over a chain link fence.[;)]

That one you posted of Collinwood is really awesome!!! That is a really big structure.[:D]

[Anonymous]

Well if its a small operation and the big tower is assumed gone and few coal engines remained, Perhaps a small coaling platform with an Oil Tank built up out of an N scale beer can tank car, A few barrels for the oilers and a sand tower
with small drying house.
I just built this in O but if the lil shack became a sandhouse, the coal section was moved to center and a tank built up on some rr tie stock wer on the end, it would not only be a serviceable structure, but it would have some interesting character to boot.
This probobly wouldnt be best for a big Class 1 but a small regional may have made due like this until more permanent structures could be built.

[tstage]

David,

Hmm, that's the description they gave it on the web site. Oh, well. I trust you more than them.

Here's a picture of the Collinwood coaling tower:


(Double-click to enlarge)

Looks like both of them a pretty massive.

Tom

[David_Telesha]

That's not Cedar Hill - too small and too square.

This is Cedar Hill;



http://www.freewebs.com/nestatesrail/myrailroadphotos.htm

[tstage]

QUOTE: Originally posted by David_Telesha

The NH coal tower in Cedar Hill is still standing in 2006 - its on the National Historic Registry..

Found a picture...



The Collinwood yard, here in Cleveland, still has a 500-ton coaling tower. It's quite regal looking. I don't think it's on the National Historic Registry though.

Tom

[David_Telesha]

The NH coal tower in Cedar Hill is still standing in 2006 - its on the National Historic Registry..

[GMTRacing]

For what's it's worth before this thread takes off on its' own. For large facilities the oil was usually stored in below grade (underground) tanks with a pump house above ground and multiple nozzles in the fueling area. This was especially true during the WWII era to deter saboteuers.
Many roads kept their large coaling facilities and large water tanks well after they quit using them. The massive coaling tower for the New Havens Cedar Hill yard was still standing in 1984 some 36 years after the NH desielized so both sets of fuel dispensers can prototypically stand side by side. Hope this helps. J.R.

[tomikawaTT]

Considering the oil capacity of that cab-forward, and the characteristics of the Bunker C it burned (one step removed from roof tar) you would probably require some kind of heating system for your storage tank and a heavy duty pump (in its own dedicated, fireproof shed) near same. Assuming the oil reaches the servicing crane underground, the tank and pump house could be a fair distance away. Most likely delivery system would be railroad- or oil company-owned tank car, single dome, piped for heating from an external steam source, and the unloading point would certainly be close to the storage tank..

[radio2]

Heres an easy way to set up for oil, I took an old oil tanker that had seen better days , stripped the trucks off and cut it in half lenthwise glued it down next to the track as if it were burried half way, scratched some pipe (wire) and hoses and had an oil servicing station .

Rm2

[Anonymous]

I would maybe have a small oil dealer nearby or at least a very old oil truck. Perhaps a repainted texaco tanker or something.

There are ways to get oil to the railroad. Dont worry about justifying existence. I use a old AHM fuel and sand facility made in the 60's and a small oil tank nearby.

[canazar]

Wow, thanks everyone. Everyone had some great info.

[canazar]

NIce! Thank you white. I kinda thought so, but wanted to make sure.

SP and SF? Great since I am in the southwest, that will work.[:)]

Rix?[8D] That helps alot, I will surf for that now.

10 bucks?[:D] Oh yeah... best news of all.

[gmcrail]

The oil supply would be kept in a tank, with the supply line running tp a standpipe, in a similar manner to the water from the tank in your picture. Selley (Bowser) makes a good standpipe kit. For a tank, I'd recommend a cylindrical tank (standing on end) to supply your cab-forward. I have a small ATSF 2-6-2 as the only oil-burner on the FHN, so I made a tank from an old tank car body mounted on a trestle. A one-evening project.

[Anonymous]

Canazar:

I have seen in a issue of MRR a tanker sitting on a siding that was used for oil and was connected to some pipes that lead to a nozzel for use in filling! was more of a modern tanker car but I think the idea could be expounded on and used either for youe early or late periods.

[twhite]

Canazar: The oiling facility is easy. Rix products makes an oil-storage tank that is perfect for either SP or Santa Fe facilities, and Tichy makes a free-standing oil-spout that you can put right at trackside. Between the two of them, you'll probably spend less than $10 and you've got your oiling facility. Place the oil tank near your water tank, and the oil-spout near your water spout and you're in business.
Have fun.
Tom [:D]

[canazar]

Ok, here is the deal..... In the picture below, I am modeling my "steam era service track" The kicker is my layout is goin dual era where alot of my buildings, scenery etc, am trying to keep it some what "generic in age". Others, I just come up with some great lines of bull[censored] to get by the Rivet Counters.



As an example, I shelve all the modern engines and rolling stock, load up the 50's, bring my Cab Forward (At the moment, my only steam engine) and away I go. The SD7 and the SW7 are either brand spanking new (circa 1956) or they have been some what recently repainted and still serve the same railroad faithfully all these years. Only thing that changes are thier roles during operations.

So, with my loose cannon idea in mind, I can run everything. I got the metal water tower as it would still be standing today. Chances are, i will use a small coal loading structure, or even a small dump type or coal hopper conveyer as in 1956, the Kiva Valley didnt have much coal fired steamers coming around. The story there is the old coal tower is was torn down and replaced with the car repair shop building in 1953 . So.... leaves me with the oil.

I need to find info on what a smaller sized oil loading area would look for refualing oil fired steamers... As the big issue is my Cab Forword, who is a very steady vistor from SP, uses alot.

So, did they have big tanks by the tracks? Or was the oil kept in a big tank and just pumped underground to a place where a large spigot and hose would fill it up kida like my water system? And input, stories, or information would be great as I would like to finsih the scenry in this section but have no idea what I need to do for the oil as that would be the only major item left to model.
[:)]