#6 and #4 turnouts what should i use

[cmrproducts]

Chip

I have over 150 Atlas #4’s and #6’s on my layout and most of them in the yards and industrial tracks are #4’s

If your equipment is in gauge, properly weighted and you try to keep the S curves to a minimum you should not have any derailments.

As I operate the layout more I am trying to replace the turnouts on the layout with larger numbered ones. I have a number of #8 double curved turnouts and these go a long way in smoothing out the trackwork.

Remember the ZREO maintenance layout info!

BOB H – Clarion, PA

[jxtrrx]

Don is correct. The Atlas Snap Switch has an 18" radius. Not the #4.

[Don Gibson]

QUOTE: Originally posted by BRAKIE

Guys,A Atlas #4 custom line switch is not a real sharp switch and should handle 6 axle units and long wheel base cars..Now a Atlas #4 snap switch is fair sharper then the custom line #4...Please don't confuse the different types of #4 switches.

mrdls1

There IS no "Atlas #4 snap switch", and there never has been. The poster is confused.

There are #4's, and there are "snap switches" (notice they are not even called 'turnout's). Check the ATLAS website.

Snap switches are 'curved' so the fit into a 36" circle and designed for the beginner 'toy train' market. As such, they make poor Yard ladder's, and tend to derail 6 wheel trucks.

[BRAKIE]

QUOTE: Originally posted by DigitalGriffin
[

If you engine can take an R18 then you're fine. However I would stay away from passenger cars if you have S curves. (Chances are you'll have at least one on your yard track. 40' box cars and hoppers are fine however on most S curves.

Not really..The Atlas #4 switch has a smooth transition and eliminates S curves in most cases..A "S" curve in a yard isn't a bad thing and will handle cars up to center beams and 86 foot auto part cars.The key is having cars with the correct wheel gauge and coupler trip pin height and a slow steady hand on the throttle instead of backing in at mach 5. We routinely switch passenger cars at the passenger terminals #4 yard switches at the club with no problems.

[SpaceMouse]

QUOTE: Originally posted by BRAKIE

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Chip said:Bill, just because there's a prototype doesn't mean you want to do it. I have enough problems with getting my track to work.
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Chip,Us older and more experience industrial switching layout builders model track like you see in that picture with out any derailment problems.[:0]

If you are having derailment problems I suggest getting a NMRA gauge so you can check your track and wheels.Then check your cars trucks to ensure they are not to tight.[:D]

Maybe slow your trains down as well?[:0]

Of course it could be the track and switches..That's why I stick with Atlas track as I know its the best from my years of experience.

Brakie,

I was being sarcastic.

Until recently, I've not had any derailment problems, and when I figure this one loco out, I won't have them again.

I will say that for right now I have better things to do than model poorly built track and make it so I can run really slow on it. Our local B&P had a section like that and they ran 5 mph on it and still derailed. Eventually they just fixed it. Fortunately, I'm modeling well built track although I may face that delima when I guild the run from the logging camp to the log loading area.

[whitman500]

A lot of modelers go overboard on their turnout number. The turnout used should match the minimum radius curves on your layout. A #5 turnout is equivalent to a 28 inch curve and so if you have sharper curves than this there is no reason to use a #6 except for appearance. In Amstrong's book on realistic planning he has a table with the equivalents and recommends using a 4.5 turnout if you have 22/24 inch curves. The Atlas customline #4 is supposedly actually a 4.5.

[DigitalGriffin]

Ummmm

#4 is about ~18" radius last time I checked. (Depends on make of turnout) You can sub them for an R18 curve on a 4x8 with Bachmann EZ Track, or LL-Powerlock. (Possibly others)

#6 turnouts take about 12" of space. But as Chip said, these can often be clipped to make this a little shorter.

If you engine can take an R18 then you're fine. However I would stay away from passenger cars if you have S curves. (Chances are you'll have at least one on your yard track. 40' box cars and hoppers are fine however on most S curves.

John Armstrongs book is an excellent guide with ways to help avoid S curves. It also list information about turnouts and their equivalent radiuses.

[jxtrrx]

A #6 (or greater) turnout is not required for reliable operation. John Armstrong points out in "Track Planning for Realistic Operation" that a #4 has a 29" radius. An Atlas #4 is close to 36". Those who supposedly have locomotives that won't make it through these size curves have locomotives like I've not seen. #4s make beautiful yards with closely spaced parallel tracks, and as Don points out, just the right spacing to be able to work with your cars by hand. The problem with #4 turnouts is not is yards, but when you introduce S curves such as on sidings or passing tracks where you turn-out to the right then immediately shift back left to make the siding parallel the main. A tight S [:)] like that will create derails for ya' every time. It's easy to say you need at least 45" radius curves and #6, #8 or #10 turnouts... but hard do in a real life spare bedroom.

[icmr]

[#ditto] It just depends on your space.

[#welcome] to the forum mrdls1.



ICMR

Happy Railroading.[swg][swg]

[MisterBeasley]

Shinohara and Peco both make 3-way turnouts. The Shinoharas are #6, I think, while the Peco's look like #4's. They are basically just 2 turnouts in tandem on the same frame. If you are tight for space, these are a good solution in some cases.

[BRAKIE]

Guys,A Atlas #4 custom line switch is not a real sharp switch and should handle 6 axle units and long wheel base cars..Now a Atlas #4 snap switch is fair sharper then the custom line #4...Please don't confuse the different types of #4 switches.

[Leon Silverman]

#6 turnout crossovers will handle 85 foot passenger cars with with body mounted couplers (no movement of the coupler box). To paraphrase Capital One's ad campaign: " What's in your layout?"

[wjstix]

Could always use Walthers (or others) No.5 turnouts - they save space but have much less trouble with S-curves etc. than No.4 turnouts do.

[selector]

Plan for future requirements. You may be perfectly happy with #4's on your mains for several months, maybe even a couple of years. But, if you are like most of us, you will yearn for larger locos before long. If you want to run your bigger locos into the yard, that is when your #4's will become dog poop.

[Don Gibson]

Another reason for using #4's in the yard's, is ones finger's fit between ladder tracks for placing and re-railng equipment before sending it out on the main - something I cannot do easily with my #6 ladder's.

[Anonymous]

thanks fot the info. looks like ill try to use #6 for everything room permitting. thanks again

[JohnT14808]

Boy, everyone seems to have covered all the bases already. My only comment would be to have a switcher small enough to handle the tighter #4 and if you have to haul a long string of stock, then HAVE TWO SWITCHERS, or maybe three. Depends on the size of your yard.

[BRAKIE]

Don is correct..The rule of thumb calls for #4s for yards,#6s for mains. As far as size 8's Well-if you have the room if not a crossover made of #6s will work for a medium speed crossover.
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Chip said:Bill, just because there's a prototype doesn't mean you want to do it. I have enough problems with getting my track to work.
=============================================================
Chip,Us older and more experience industrial switching layout builders model track like you see in that picture with out any derailment problems.[:0]

If you are having derailment problems I suggest getting a NMRA gauge so you can check your track and wheels.Then check your cars trucks to ensure they are not to tight.[:D]

Maybe slow your trains down as well?[:0]

Of course it could be the track and switches..That's why I stick with Atlas track as I know its the best from my years of experience.

[Bill H.]

QUOTE: Originally posted by SpaceMouse

Bill, just because there's a prototype doesn't mean you want to do it. I have enough problems with getting my track to work.

Agreed, I'd be unhappy if my scale track looked like the pic, too. At least the speed over such will be very slow. SAFETY FIRST [:)]

FWIW: #6 is my yard standard. Mainline is mostly #10, with a few #8, as space dictates. There are 3 #4 turnouts, w/ code 70 restricted to very small locomotives.

Mainline carries big time steam. Code 83.

[jecorbett]

It's really a matter of how much room you have and what kind of equipment do you want to run. Then establish a standard that fits your situation. I have a large space and want to be able to run large locos and full sized passenger cars. My standard is #6 for yards and spurs, #8 for main line crossovers and sidings. Some one else might be short on space but have shorter equipment so a 4/6 standard might be best for them. The person who has a problem is the one who wants to run big equipment on a small layout. Your track has to fit your equipment. If it doesn't, you are asking for trouble. You might get an big steamer to negotiate a #4 turnout, but don't count on it.

[SpaceMouse]

Bill, just because there's a prototype doesn't mean you want to do it. I have enough problems with getting my track to work.

[Bill H.]

The real world doesn't always follow the "tried and true."

[Don Gibson]

No ONE size fit's all

BUT since our model layout's cannot use the prototype's curves, the best 'Rule of thumb' is #4's for yard's and #6's for main's. (#8's for high speed Crossing's).

98% of today's equipment will work on the above. If it doesn't (my brass 4-6-6-2 didn't), modification is in order. REAL railroad's didnt run their big mainline engine's on branchline track's, so why should you? ... Because your 4-8-4 with undersized driving wheels can?

(Dumb}.

[Anonymous]

I use peco code 83 #6 streamline turnouts in my yard, they are as long as a standard straight.

[SpaceMouse]

YOu can also save some space with your #6's by cutting down the excess straight portions of the turnout.

[IRONROOSTER]

Since this is the yard, it depends on the yard locos. If you're using 0-6-0's then 4's should work. Keep in mind that the cars are also limited by the turnout size. i would recommend that you use #5's in the yard.
Enjoy
Paul

[howmus]

The answer is maybe...... If you have room, I would use the #6 turnouts even in the yard. If you are using small steam (moguls, connies, Americans and the likes) #4s would work fine. The longer wheelbase of late steam will make the use of #4 turnouts problematic. The best advise is to always use the largest # switches that will work for your space. Have fun!

[twcenterprises]

Short locos=short turnouts; long locos=long turnouts. Some long locos will handle short turnouts at slow speeds but the short locos will easily handle the long turnouts. You can use #4's on the main as long as the long locos will only use the straight side (such as an industrial spur).

Brad

[Anonymous]

I am just getting started in the hobby. I am wondering if i can use #4 turnouts in the yardsto use less space or does this depend on the size of the loco i am going to use i plan to use #6 on the mainlines. I am planning on running steam locos.