Hi all, first post here
I recently bought a brass locomotive that I want to clean up and display as a static unpainted brass model and I'm looking for advice for cleaning it up.
ive been doing a lot of research and have read over a ton of posts about this topic, here and other places, but almost every one is focused on prepping brass for paint. My goals are a bit different as I'm not looking to paint it, rater restore the brass look and disply it unpainted. I have found exactly zero discussion about how to do that! As such, I have several takeaway methods but I'm looking for help from you more experienced guys on understanding how to apply these methods to do this properly.
My loco is a sunset models Sn3 D&GW K-28 from I believe the mid 80's. It's in excellent condition and overall very clean. I believe it's NOS. As for the oxidation level, it's only slightly tarnished - the brass is slightly browned pretty evenly all over with some darker brown areas around the edges of the tender and on the frame around the trucks. The overall sheen is a dull satin bordering on flat in areas. All of the details look very solid and it's very well built.
The goal would be to get it back to a new looking state. I'll probably paint it at some point in the future but until then I'm assuming I'll want to seal it with a satin finish.
I have an Elmosonic ultrasonic cleaner and it seems to make sense to use this.
So I guess some questions...
I don't know if this model has a clear coat from the factory that needs to be removed? Any recommendations for a solvent to use in the ultrasonic cleaner?
For actual cleaning of the brass I've read about everything including acetone, soapy water, IPA, over the counter cleaners, chemicals, and homemade lemon juice paste mixes. Seems more voodoo than science! I've also read about etching using vinegar. But there's very little info about what is being accomplished and how it affects the finish of the bare brass - or what it's left looking like when you're done.
What would be an appropriate method to use with an ultrasonic cleaner?
I've seen hints that different cleaning methods might change to look of the brass - like a certain cleaner will bring out the yellow, or another cleaner would make it look more coppery etc. I'm afraid of an unintended result from the cleaners!
There's a lot of info out there for a newbie to sort through and decipher. Any insight would be appreciated!
Thanks all!
Hi there. I removed tarnish from a number of brass locomotives for painting purposes. I would apply the same method for your purposes as it is basically the same objective: removing tarnish to achieve a smooth finish. My favorite method is to use a hobby sandblaster, using baking soda as a medium. I have a Badger, but there are other makes.
Recently, I removed tarnish from a brass loco using a dremel with metal brush. It actually did a really good job. Brass is fairly hard and there were no scratches as a result.
In your situation, I would apply a coat of clear shellac after the tarnish has been removed. It can be dilluted (50%) and applied with a brush. I do two coats to make sure it is all covered. Otherwise, you can apply a Dullcoat with a can, but my feeling is that shellac sticks better to brass than regular varnish. Up to you to see.
I avoid using vinegar. It can cause corrosion. If you do, do not let it soak for an extended period. I speak from experience.
Simon
You could always do what a lot of the early brass manufacturers did .... just paint it a nice brass color ! Does a great job of hiding unsightly solder joints. Once you strip the brass paint off those models it looks pretty rough with all the exposed soldering points.
Mark.
¡ uʍop ǝpısdn sı ǝɹnʇɐuƃıs ʎɯ 'dlǝɥ
Your ultrasonic cleaner might find any "borderline" solder joints. Not necessarily a bad thing as it is much easier to repair prior to reassembly. I have an Overland NYC H-10 that I discovered some loose-fitting crosshead guides this way.
Mark R.You could always do what a lot of the early brass manufacturers did .... just paint it a nice brass color !
That's my suggestion, too. I've come across some models with the brass color paint and it is really convincing. I didn't realize the "clear coat" was actually brass paint until the stripping process.
It will make a nice looking display, prevent further tarnish and won't harm the value of the model as some finish is expected on an unpainted brass piece.
Good Luck, Ed
I would NOT bead blast the model because it will leave a "dull brass" color, and not a bright shiny brass color, once you are done.
I would strip off all the old lacquer otherwise it would show through any paint that you do, perhaps not much, but it will show if not removed and usually it looks really bad.
Then I would paint the model either brass color (as Sunset imports does or did) or use gold color (Accupaint has it) whichever your preference. Then perhaps a light clear coat if you prefer.
That will keep it looking good forever.
Even if you lacquer over a pristine clean shiny clean brass finish, it will develop spotting over time. I would want something that I can handle often and even run. Back in the day many people left their brass models unpainted so that guests could discern that they were discriminating modelers who wanted the "best" available at the time--so they'd actually operate them in unpainted condition.
As for me, I would use the gold paint, but whatever you prefer.
As an aside, there are musicians who prefer the patina of a raw brass finish on their horns, with no clearcoat whatsoever, and they will certainly hold up that way, but eventually get some ugly toning on them. Others will get a "natural brass" finish (which is not the shiny brass but the dull weathered look) and then get clearcoat over it. Others still prefer shiny brass with clearcoat over it, or silver/copper/gold plating over the brass. There's room for all kinds of colors. They have to silver plate first before gold, because the gold does not adhere well to bare brass. They can apply copper plating directly to the brass. Cost of gold plating a trumpet? $500 and up.
I think the accupaint "gold" more nearly matches some of the shiny brass model finishes that survive from back in the day. To me the Sunset painted brass look is way too yellow, but again, it's your world.
John
Thanks for the replies! You all got me thinking about what kind of finish I want the end result to be.
The thought of painting it sort of makes me cringe - I picture those altificially shiny models I've seen that look they've been polished...not my bag! I'll look into the brass paint, I'm curious what kind of finish it leaves, if it looks metal. Any recommendation on where to get some? I also definitely do not like the yellow brass look.
Media blasting might be too much but it might be what gives the finish I have in mind. I've media blasted many, many things in my time, and the surface finish that's in my mind would best be obtained by media blasting - a smooth, satiny finish.
Before I take that step though, I'd like to try just lightening up the little bit of surface tarnish that's currently on it just to see how it comes out looking, because it's only slightly discolored.
PRR8259I would strip off all the old lacquer
Any recommendation for what to use for stripping?
I've seen the spotting that can occur over time when a clear is applied right over the metal. I believe this is mainly caused by improper surface prep but I might be wrong. Either way, this is meant for the short-term - I'm sure I'll end up painting it properly and turning it into a foreground model sometime in the next year. I just want to look at it in brass for awhile :)
-Kevin