Got yet another one for my Fourm friends. As I live in a northern climate, I tend not to order paint from November to March or so. At least that was with water-based paints e.g. Humbrol, the old Polly S/Polly Scale and Model Master. (I had a bunch of Polly Scale feeze on me many years ago and ruin it.)
My question is this: With the Tru-color and Vallejo paints needing acetone to clean brushes, does that change the point at which the paint would freeze? Not being able to order paint for a fair part of the year can get a bit annoying especially when I find a need a color and don't want to risk it especially with what Montana and the area's weather can do this time of year. For those that may suggest an LHS, I don't have a LHS and the closest that would have a shot at having paints is about 145 miles away and I don't have an easy way to get there.
As usual, any information that can be provided would be most welcomed.
My advice, such as it is, is not to leave anything like paint or glue where it would freeze in the first place. The same is true for anything with a delicate mechanism or components made of zinc.
The principal reason for cracked dials on pocket watches is differential expansion when the watch is exposed to excessively hot or cold temperatures. That particularly applies to watches placed in storage.
I don't think you can get around 'not ordering in potentially freezing weather'. I don't think there is cost-effective 'heated' shipping analogous to dry ice for cooled shipping, and while a well-insulated package might help, it might require multiple shields and nanoinsulation like aerogel to work well enough...
Ditto. Where are you storing your paints?
I would store them indoors where the temp doesn't get below 60oF/16oC. Usually on the label of the paint can or bottle it states the allowable temperature range for storage. Otherwise, you run the risk damaging the paint or paint consistency.
Tom
https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling
Time...It marches on...without ever turning around to see if anyone is even keeping in step.
Just for a little education in safety and materials, since you mentioned Vallejo in your post, here is the link for Vallejo Safety information.....
https://acrylicosvallejo.com/en/safety/
As you can see, there are numerous items you can choose from. I clicked on Model Air and it pulled up the Safety Data Sheet (and clicked on USA English).
https://acrylicosvallejo.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/SDS-Model-Air-2019.pdf
There's a lot of information, but we'll focus on your question. On page 13, section 7: Handling and Storage, sub-section 7.2, it shows minimum temp of 41 degrees and maximum 86 degrees. On another note, if you go to section 9: physical and chemical properties, it lists boiling point (235 degrees), but doesn't list freezing point. So, like others have stated.....keep it at room temperature.
You mentioned using acetone to clean brushes. That indicates you might be using laquers, which changes the game and you would need to seek those Safety Data Sheets. If you were using acrylics, you should be using soap and water for cleaning.
Terry
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Living on the prairie, UPS and FedEx deliveries start early in the morning over 90 miles away. The deliveries take a zig-zag course to get to me. They are in the back of a large van in below 0°F for 12 - 14 hours before they get to my house. I've had things delivered that, while I didn't take their temperature, felt freezing cold to the touch.
I'm not sure if that plays into part of this question.
York1 John
I asked my doctor if I gave up delicious food and all alcohol, would I live longer? He said, "No, but it will seem longer."
I think that if you're ordering paint, it would be best to do so in the late spring or early fall, where temperatures usually don't reach extremes.
My paint shop is in a small room in my 160 year-old garage, and I do paint there in our Canadian winters, but do not store paint there.My compessor is rotary type, which runs continuously when in use, where the compressor screw runs in an oil bath, so if I wish to paint in the winter, I simply plug in a portable electric heater to warm-up both the compressor oil and the room. Once the painting starts, I simply turn down the heater, so that it cycles on and off to keep the room at a comfortable temperature. (I do have a closeable inlet for make-up air, as I always run the exhaust fan when airbrushing - it is vented to the outdoors.)Summertime painting is usually done with the compressor in the garage, but outside of the paint shop...since it runs continuously, it generates a fair amount of heat if I'm painting a lot of items.
I use both water-based and solvent-based paints, but clean both my airbrush and my paint brushes using lacquer thinner, which causes no damage to brushes with natural bristles.
My modelling paints are always stored in my basement workshop, and all housepaint and rattle-can paint is kept in the basement, too, usually on the shelving under my layout.
Wayne
York1 Living on the prairie, UPS and FedEx deliveries start early in the morning over 90 miles away. The deliveries take a zig-zag course to get to me. They are in the back of a large van in below 0°F for 12 - 14 hours before they get to my house. I've had things delivered that, while I didn't take their temperature, felt freezing cold to the touch. I'm not sure if that plays into part of this question.
I think this answers the OP's question. I'm sure he knows how to store paint. He was asking about shipping conditions.
Ray
David Starr www.newsnorthwoods.blogspot.com
Colorado Ray York1 Living on the prairie, UPS and FedEx deliveries start early in the morning over 90 miles away. The deliveries take a zig-zag course to get to me. They are in the back of a large van in below 0°F for 12 - 14 hours before they get to my house. I've had things delivered that, while I didn't take their temperature, felt freezing cold to the touch. I'm not sure if that plays into part of this question. I think this answers the OP's question. I'm sure he knows how to store paint. He was asking about shipping conditions. Ray
That it does. And I'm nowhere in the so-called toolie bushes. Our post office is somewhat of a regional hub. While nothing is sorted here anymore, a lot of the smaller communities around here send their mail here.
doctorwayne I think that if you're ordering paint, it would be best to do so in the late spring or early fall, where temperatures usually don't reach extremes.
That's kind of what I had been operating on anyway. Although I still order in the summer as well because it doesn't get hot enough to boil paints. That's when I seem to be able to get most of the layout work done. (At least around juggling working on my house.)
FRRYKidWith the Tru-color and Vallejo paints needing acetone to clean brushes
FRRYKid: I have used hundreds of Vallejo paints. I only use water to clean the brushes, and an occasional follow-up with "Brush Cleaner For Acrylic Paints" to keep everything pristine. I have extensively used the "Game Colour", "Model Colour", and "Panzer Aces" lines.
Vallejo does make some "Alchohol Based" metallic finishes that require mineral spririts for clean up.
Why are you using acetone?
-Kevin
Living the dream.
SeeYou190 Why are you using acetone?
I seem to remember reading somewhere that the Vallejo paints needed acetone to clean the brushes. It's not as if I don't have it one hand. (I have some Tru-color paints.)
From experience:
TruColor is acrylic acetone based paint, but it will not handle delivery via UPS in freezing conditions. It does freeze, and does not like it at all. (Forgot a bottle in my garage overnight before it was heated....)
Vallejo is acrylic water based paint, not acetone based. I automatically assume it will also very much dislike freezing. I've never tested it, but I am sure it would not go well...
Ricky W.
HO scale Proto-freelancer.
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If you know someone that travels they may be able to help you out. My sister travels a lot and in the past, I have had things sent to a hotel where she will be staying and she brings them home for me in her carry-on. As long as the paint doesn't take a side trip to Alaska it should be fine.
Brent
"All of the world's problems are the result of the difference between how we think and how the world works."
I've been storing rustoleum spray paints, model master acrylics, tamiya acrylics in an unconditioned Chicago basement. It was 8 degrees F yesterday and about 45 inside while I was painting. As long as it's not freezing, paints will still perform but they'll take a really long time to dry. It may impact coverage, but that depends on the paint. Obviously aerosol paints don't work when it's freezing. They'll just instantly crystallize in the air.
Only thing I could find on the Vallejo website is it saying
"In our own manufacturing processes we further subject our colors to regular testing for aging and freezing resistance".
There's no warning about freezing, although it does advise
" the colors last an indefinite length of time if they are handled properly and stored in moderate temperatures 15 to 25º celsius (60-80 degrees Fahrenheit)".
I would be surprised if there was enough water in acrylic paint that it would be that big an issue with freezing, at least when it is factory sealed and airtight. If the paint is OK being shipped in an unheated container on a ship from Spain crossing the Atlantic in the dead of winter, I would think it would be OK sitting in a box on your porch for a few hours.
I have successfully airbrushed with acrylic paints outside with the temp in the mid 20's F. My concern was that the expanding gas would furhter cool and freeze the paint. Surprisingly that did not happen. Paint was mixed inside and then immediately brought outside for a short painting session.
If the OP also paints outside, that information be useful. Acetone freezes at -94C but that doesn't mean other components of paint can't freeze. I guess the real question is does the UPS driver keep the door open to the cargo section? Perhaps it never gets below freezing.
Henry
COB Potomac & Northern
Shenandoah Valley
BigDaddy If the OP also paints outside, that information be useful. Acetone freezes at -94C but that doesn't mean other components of paint can't freeze. I guess the real question is does the UPS driver keep the door open to the cargo section? Perhaps it never gets below freezing.
I don't paint outside at all. Painting outside in Montana is dicey at best. As already stated, I'm just worried about transporting paints from shippers to me.
Resurrecting this post for a very valid reason. Since I started the post I have switched to extensively using Trucolor paints. I'd sent an email to them about the freezing question earlier this week. In a email recieved yesterday, I was informed that their paints are good to -15 degrees F or -26.11 degrees C or 274.04 degrees K, depending on which tempurature scale you wish to use.
FRRYKid I was informed that their paints are good to -15 degrees F.
It is good they responded to you.
I think if they are good to that temperature I will bo OK storing them outside year-round.
I have left automotive spray paint out in the garage during freezing conditions for years and it is always fine once warmed. Same with Rustoleum, both spray and regular cans.
Latex house paints are another story, they are always ruined.
Hobby paints, mainly Floquil and Scalecoat stay in the house.
I went on a bit of a Scalecoat buying binge after hearing about their issues. It arrived from multiple sources, mainly cold weather states around the country during the so called "bomb cyclone". The bottles were very cold. Some were on the porch for most of the day. None were frozen.
For paint currently in production, contacting the manufacturer is a great idea. If they will not give a definite answer, I would assume the paint should not be left in the cold.
Jim
SeeYou190 I think if they are good to that temperature I will bo OK storing them outside year-round. -Kevin
Not in my neck of the woods however. Montana has a quite different climate than Florida. The forecast for tonight is supposed to be -9 F.
Soo Line fanI went on a bit of a Scalecoat buying binge after hearing about their issues.
I went on two Scalecoat binges. Once when Weaver went out, then about a year ago when I decided to "cover all my bases" with a massive order direct.
It takes a lot of paint to fill a Craftsman lower drawer as shown in the scalecoat thread. Nice haul!