need help with ho locomotive

[Louisvilleandnashvilleforever]

so I went to a train show the other day and bought a tyco mantua spirit of 76 cboat and an ahm southern pacific gp9

 

while the southern pacific loco preformed ok with an occasional hiccup the spirit of 76 will start make a couple laps around a test oval slow down and activate the overload light on my blue box era athern starter set controller

 

i have a video detailing what's happening on my YouTube channel

i was hoping to see if I could get a diagnostic and how to fix the issue

the southern pacific will occasionally trigger the overload light but it's rather inconsistent and part of me wonders if it was a freight car with metal wheels navigating a turn slightly sharper then it could handle with ease

 

anyways here is the video

[RR_Mel]

Your first few post are delayed by Moderators.  Hang in there, I’m giving your post a bump for others to view it.


Mel
 
Modeling the early to mid 1950s SP in HO scale since 1951



My Model Railroad    
http://melvineperry.blogspot.com/
 
Bakersfield, California
 
Aging is not for wimps.

[tstage]

Did you happen to notice or feel if the motor of the Spirit of '76 is warm or hot to the touch?  Also, the video link gives an error message and is not viewable.

Tom

[Trainman440]

Sounds like the motor is overdrawing current and causing your controller to "short out" due to overloading.

Those TYCO powerdrive motors/mech are terrible in todays standards, and infamous for overheating, overdrawing current, and being loud and noisy. Dare I say they are train set quality and designed with planned obsolescence in mind, designed to fail after a few months. But I digress, I know a few modelers who have managed to get thier TYCO diesels(and chattanooga) to run flawlessly. 

IF this is the case, the solution is to diassemble the engine, clean off the old grease (likely causing resistance resulting for high current draw), put in some fresh grease and call it a day.

The more permanent solution is to replace the mechanism entirely, whether thats cramming a CD motor in, using a NWSL (or similar) stanton drive, or fitting the shell over a different mechanism (such as an athearn one)

Alternatively, it could be something else, such as the metal wheel causing a short as you mentioned. In that case, run the same exact train around with a non tyco engine and see if the overloading light turns on. If not, its clearly the engine. 

Good luck!

Charles

 

[SeeYou190]

Trainman440

The more permanent solution is to replace the mechanism entirely, whether thats cramming a CV motor in, using a NWSL (or similar) stanton drive, or fitting the shell over a different mechanism (such as an athearn one)

This is my best suggestion for a solution also. All of my "childhood heritage" Tyco units have mechanisms from better quality locomotives.

I used a Proto-Power West chassis in an F unit, and the mechanism from an Atlas/Kato yellow-box U boat for the Midnight Express Shark Nose diesel.

I plan to use an Oriental Powerhouse chassis underneath my Chattanooga Choo Choo 0-8-0 (making it a 2-8-0), but I do not know if this will work or not.

-Kevin

[Louisvilleandnashvilleforever]

thanks for the advice 

probably what I will do is clean out any and all grease that may or may not be in there replace it and put the locomotive together if that doesn't work (or perhaps down the line I will do this anyways) I'll consider purchasing a spare motor to replace the old power torque motor

i remember a YouTube modelper smt mainline tested a cheap motor in a model locomotive (I forget which brand) and it ran better then it had ran before

[MisterBeasley]

I would agree that an old motor, possibly corroded and with a gearbox full of old dried-up grease could be drawing too much current.  At the same time, do other locomotives run successfully with the same old power pack and track?  You could have a poor locomotive and/or a weak power supply.

Can you test these engines at a local train shop or on a friend's layout?  Can you put a meter between the power pack and the track and measure the current when the locomotive is running?  How does that compare with the rating of the power pack?

[richhotrain]

SeeYou190

 

Trainman440

The more permanent solution is to replace the mechanism entirely, whether thats cramming a CV motor in, using a NWSL (or similar) stanton drive, or fitting the shell over a different mechanism (such as an athearn one) 

This is my best suggestion for a solution also. 

Yep!

[BigDaddy]

To post a youtube video use the HTML address, not the share and use the icon that it to the right of the mountain.

[rbturner]

Most of those have similar problems. Disassemble the motor and clean the oil off of the brushes. Clean between the commutator segments (this is what usually causes high current draw).

Check the brush spring tension and reassemble.

[PM Railfan]

I think it best to check the whole electrical pickup system in the model. I noticed you had to turn the throttle way way up before anything started to happen. Your model should be moving by atleast 1/4 throttle, not 2/3's to 3/4's as I saw in video.

 

Clean the wheels.

Check wiring for connection. (at both ends) and both sides + and - . (Red and Black wires)

Check the wires themselves for brittleness, conductivity. (requires an ohm-meter). Even replace them with a larger gauge wire if needed.

Check the metal contacts touching the wheels, polish if necessary. Are they worn?

Ofcourse cleaning and lubing the mechanical works is always a given.

Check the motor itself - brushes (reshape or replace as needed) - communtator (make this part nice and shiny!). Remove any fur balls left from previous owner.

Check to see if not only your positive side is conducting, but also check your ground side. (ohm meter again)

 

An easy way to check your electrical thru-put is remove motor (and light) and replace with voltmeter leaving all wiring/pickups/contacts in place. Take a reading. It should match the track voltage. If lower, then you have a bad electrical system. If they match, the problem is in the motor or gearing.

While you have the motor out, free wheel the model on track. Does it move easily or hard to push? If easy, then you know its the motor. If hard, toss that puppy on the grease rack and lube her up. (you may have to remove an idler gear or two for this test)

While motor is out, you can hook it up to your transformer and test it all by its lonesome. Check for sparking, over heating, and quite possibly smoke.

Lastly, even though we saw your train move, are you sure your electrical from transformer to track is ok?

 

These techniques and those listed above by others are generally the care and maintenance of model trains.

 

Good luck!

PMR