Hello
I am getting Very close to laying my N scale track and need to start thinking about a quality powerpack soon.
I would like something that is both DC and DCC compatible for the day I decide to upgrade.
Momentum is a feature that is very important to me as I liked the one my brother made when we were young.
Also I like the idea of having a wireless remote even though it's only a 4 by 8 layout. I like to move around instead of being held to one place. Whether one comes with a wireless remote or it can be added, either way is fine.
I'm a firm believer in "you get what you pay for" and like doing things right the first time around. Money is not an issue within reason. I would imagine a 4 by 8 layout doesn't demand a club layout super system? Unless I'm told differently. The normal operations of this layout will only be one to two operators.
Thanks for all your advice in advance as it is appreciated.
TF
About the only one that does both DC and DCC is the MRC Tech 6, and it had wired handhelds as an option, not wireless.
To get all of that, you should probably consider a DCC system with wireless throttles, and connect it to the layout via a DPDT center off toggle, the other side of which connects to a decent DC pack. Run one or the other. Or just go all DCC - you'll get wireless handhelds, momentum you can configure individually for each loco, not just a generic momentum, and easy multi train operation.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
You are kinda in a place of decision. Being you are where you are I would proubly get DCC ready engines (with the plug installed) and an MRC power pack and when you want to make the switch, you are set up. I will say DCC is more fussy but I do love the sound.
Hi Randy, rrebell, ...and Mike (Mike, you tied my head in knots)
I only have three old school Bachmann locomotives that are DC only that I will want to run on occasion.
Everything else I have is DCC ready Plug and Play, already is DCC, and 4 are the hybrids DC/DCC.
I have a boatload of loco's. Kato, Atlas and Spectrum only.
So I would have to buy both a DCC system and a separate power pack for the Bachman's if I want all the features I listed?
Since the track is technically powerd the same in dcc and dc, I have a plug on the end of my bus wires and a connector on my Railpower 1300. When I move to DCC I will put a plug on that as well so I can switch between the both. Saw a layout set up like this in milwaukee exept they had a togle switch to change between DCC and DC and it worked flawlessly. I picked up my 1300 off ebay last week for $25 with shipping and it works awesome. Very smooth opperation and really smooth at low speeds
For DC/DCC operation then a Tech 6 is the way to go. If you wish to run two DCC trains then you must have the hand held throttle.
I have a Tech 6 and hand held throttle and I simply love it.
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
So you just unplug and replug between packs Ringo.
Reading too fast, sorry, missed the switch part. This could be a consideration. Are you Wireless?
Thanks
I see you agree with Randy on the Tech 6 Larry. It may look like I just have to put up with wires on two handheld throttles.
I hate wires but maybe I can live with that.
Okay, Tech 6 it is.
Unless anybody has something that'll do the same thing wireless.
Thanks for the help guys
TF: When my friend Randy and I built his N scale NORFOLK SOUTHERN layout, which was started in 1992, he quickly decided it would be "upgraded" to DCC in the future.
So, his layout started DC, because all his equipment was DC, but he intended to buy new equipment that was DCC, and upgrade some older equipment with DCC decoders, then switch the layout to DCC when the equipment was ready.
Is this similar to your plan?
For DC operation he chose Hogger power packs, which were great.
To convert to DCC, we wired the layout with small rotary cab selector switches. When the switch to DCC happened, we set all the cab selectors to "1", removed them from the panels and tied them behind the fascia, and put plastic 3/16" plugs in the holes where the switches were.
The DCC system was hooked to the input from cab "1", and all was fine.
So... my advice would be to do something similar if you are planning to switch to DCC in the future. Run the layout as DC until you are ready, then buy a good DCC system and switch over in one sweep.
Just make sure your wiring for DC is easy to convert to DCC and it will be easy.
My next layout will not be able to switch to DCC. I have made to deicision to use polarity reversing power routing turnouts, and these just do not work well with DCC operation.
You can buy a decent MRC Tech II 1500 used, and that is a perfect power pack for N scale until you purchase a DCC system.
-Kevin
Living the dream.
I wouldn’t worry about the Power Pack problem! I started out using DC in 1951 up to today. In 2006 I decided to go with DCC and bought a MRC Prodigy Advance ². I used a 12 volt DPDT relay to switch my layout track from DC Power Pack to DCC Controller automatically. When I turn on my MRC Sound & Power 7000 DC Power Pack the Accessory output pulls in the relay switches my layout from the DCC Controller to the DC Power Pack. I can run in either DC or DCC mode without any problems with this configuration. The two systems are never connected at the same time. I have over 70 locomotives and only 13 decoders, all locomotives are wired for DCC Ready. I have a couple of tenders with sound decoders and speakers that I can easily swap to any of my steam locomotives by simply plugging them into the locomotive.I have a pair of E7s with sound decoders that are semi removable, meaning I could easily remove the decoders but because I run them quite often I leave them as is. The rest of my diesel fleet are easily made DCC operational by plugging in a decoder.I can run any of my locomotives on my layout in eiher DC or DCC any time I want.
Mel My Model Railroad http://melvineperry.blogspot.com/ Bakersfield, California I'm beginning to realize that aging is not for wimps.
Years ago, when I was just starting with a few boxes of trains that I'd carried around from attic to basement for over 30 years, I started building a layout, intending to start with DC and then move to DCC at some time in the future. I had a small financial windfall, and just used it to buy a DCC system and a decoder.
I already had a bit of track laid, so I installed the decoder, a simple DH123, and replaced the power pack with the DCC station. By the end of the evening, I put the old DC power pack on a shelf and never connected it to the tracks again.
If you plan to go to DCC in the near future, do it right away. Otherwise you'll agonize about the money, time and effort you have in your DC system.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
I have a HO layout that is small but it is DCC. I started out DC with a MRC 780 dual powerpack but when I got my first sound DCC loco I quickly found that while it ran, control wasn't great and I couldn't programme anything, let alone access sound functions. I switched to DCC using a simple MRC Prodigy Express. It has worked great for the past 12 years. It has the controller on a wire and I don't find it a problem. I do have the yard isolated with a 'block' so I can cut the power to standing locos and not have sound going on all and it is great if I want to programme on the main.
I also have an N scale layout built on a door. Based on my experience with DCC on HO, I decided to go DCC with the N scale. I'm using a Bachmann wireless set up that is actually made by ESU. My experience with DCC on N scale has only been so-so. The DCC wireless system works fine but I find the N scale locos tend to be finicky about power with DCC in that the track must be very clean as the least little thing will cause them to stall. Also installing decoders can be a challenge. With diesels it is usually just a board swap but still they are very small. Steam is a whole different issue. Some are easy, some are very hard. The worst was a PK2 0-8-0 that had a plug in the tender except no one makes a board small enough to 'plug and play'. I did do it much to the surprise of the LHS owner when I sold it there on consignment. She sold it in a day as her DCC installer won't do this loco.
I don't have sound in any N scale locos and if I had to do it again I would just go DC and use blocks. I only run one loco at a time anyway. DCC just wasn't worth the hassle and cost at least for me. For HO I think it is absolutely great. Hope that makes sense.
CN Charlie
Evening
Just got done with my day and finished reading all my replies here. I'd like to thank each and every one of you for your advice and experience.
I must admit I've never been as good understanding the technical end of this kinda stuff as my brother is but I'm working on it.
From every thing I read here I think I will continue with my plan to lay track with blocks and choose one of the power packs suggested. Maybe I'll try the Kato sound system as an add on for now.
I'm very open minded to upgrading to DCC in the future when I learn a better understanding for it.
The only stone left unturned in my mind yet. Someone suggested just make sure my wiring is DCC ready for when I upgrade in the future. I'm quite lost with that one.
Thanks for all the help here gentleman, appreciated
Track fiddlerI'm very open minded to upgrading to DCC in the future when I learn a better understanding for it.
If you know DCC is a possibility in the future, it is pretty straightforward to build a DC layout that can easily be changed to DCC with few, if any, wiring modifications.
You just have to think it into the construction.
DO you presently have a Kato DC pack? If so, that should be just fine. I have one I use with my Unitrack, and it works very nicely.
No, I need a decent power pack yesterday Kevin. The one I have is a hunk of junk I've been using to test Loco's when I buy them. That's one of the reasons I'm inquiring today.
That Kato sound system is just something I heard about from someone. He couldn't say enough about it. It's just an add-on for sound that hooks up to any DC power pack and senses what you're doing to make the appropriate sounds.
Track fiddlerI need a power pack yesterday
This is the one that I would recommend for a right-away DC power pack, the MRC Tech-2 model 1500.
All ebay precautions are in effect! Buyer beware.
If you need a new one, I would honestly go with the Kato power pack.
Track fiddlerOkay, Tech 6 it is.
Good choice. You can run you DC engimes by a mere push of a button or your DCC engines by a push of the button.
I have 34 DC engines and 7 DCC ( 3 with sound) engines thus the T-6 fills the bill to a T.
On my ISLs I hook two wires to a Atlas snap terminal track and simply plug the hand held into the T-6.
Why the terminal track? Its fast and easy and I hate soldering.
If the only DC locos are 3 old Bachmann N scale locos - well - are they really worth running? I had some Bachmann locos from the mlate 70's when I was last in N scale - frankly, compared to anything made since, they really aren't woth messing with. Yes, I am somewhat bitter, as my dream loco at the time was the Bachmann Santa Fe Northern. I saved up my chore money to finally buy one - and it was a complete piece of junk. Parts fell ovv, and it wouldn't even run on straight track. It was claimed to run on 9 3/4" radius (which is probably wishful thinking), but my layout had greater than 11" radius curves.
I still have some HO that is very impractical to put DCC in, I keep them for sentimental reasons, along with some cars to go with them (all of which have horn-hook couplers). I'll eventually make a display case for them to hang near the layout. They've been unused but in their original boxes for close to 40 years now, but I'm sure they will still run with some cleaning - but I'm not going to put DCC in them. At this point, they are just reminders of childhood and my Dad.
rrinker If the only DC locos are 3 old Bachmann N scale locos - well - are they really worth running? I had some Bachmann locos from the mlate 70's when I was last in N scale - frankly, compared to anything made since, they really aren't woth messing with.
Randy, I will agree with that to a point. I had a Bachmann F7 A-A consist that last the 10 years( 77-87) I had my N Scale door layout as did two AHM RSD15s!
Oddly the only engines I had that gave me issuses was all six of my beloved Atlas/Kato RS-3s. They love to stall on Atlas overly large rubber switch frogs. I replaced the switches with IIRC Peco switches then all was well.
BRAKIE Track fiddler Okay, Tech 6 it is. Good choice. You can run you DC engimes by a mere push of a button or your DCC engines by a push of the button. I have 34 DC engines and 7 DCC ( 3 with sound) engines thus the T-6 fills the bill to a T. On my ISLs I hook two wires to a Atlas snap terminal track and simply plug the hand held into the T-6. Why the terminal track? Its fast and easy and I hate soldering.
Track fiddler Okay, Tech 6 it is.
Mornin Larry
I feel the same way about soldering. When I last model railroaded before now I was known as the Tie Melter. I'm good at so many things, soldering is not one of them.
I planed ahead this time, these were ordered with my track. No Ox ID continuity grease will be put in each track joiner with a toothpick.
Randy, I normally wouldn't be too concerned about the Bachmann's but the Spirit of 76 Bicentennial locomotive was a replacement of the one my grandfather gave me when I was 11. I have since bought another one and I'm replacing my childhood locomotives. The only one of my five locomotives that was remanufactured is the BN GP40.
I have more recently found all the cars that came in that Spirit of 76 Bachmann set on eBay and finding all the other cars I had back then. I must see these trains run again. Dont know, ...Must be a what's left of the little kid left in me sorta thing I guess.
They say you can never go back but I'm gonna to give it a shot
Track fiddlerI have more recently found all the cars that came in that Spirit of 76 Bachmann set on eBay and finding all the other cars I had back then. I must see these trains run again. Dont know, ...Must be a what's left of the little kid left in me sorta thing I guess. They say you can never go back but I'm gonna to give it a shot
I have been collecting the Tyco cars I remember from my youth for the same reason. They get up-fitted with weight, kadee trucks, and body mounted couplers so they will run well.
I have yet to pay more than $3.00 for any of them. It is cheap nostalgia.
This is my latest addition. The condition of this one is nearly perfect.
I also recommend the tech 6 by MRC. I plan on a dcc system by mrc , most likely the MRC prodigy advance. But I have used the tech 6 for years with never a problem.
Dave
Thanks for all the advice and help here as it has been appreciated
It looks like Dave added another recommendation for the MRC Tech 6. I think that's three or four now.
I'm not sure if I should look for one of these used or not. I don't know how solid-state these electronic devices are. Maybe I should buy a new one unless I'm told differently.
SeeYou190 Track fiddler I have more recently found all the cars that came in that Spirit of 76 Bachmann set on eBay and finding all the other cars I had back then. I must see these trains run again. Dont know, ...Must be a what's left of the little kid left in me sorta thing I guess. They say you can never go back but I'm gonna to give it a shot I have been collecting the Tyco cars I remember from my youth for the same reason. They get up-fitted with weight, kadee trucks, and body mounted couplers so they will run well. This is my latest addition. The condition of this one is nearly perfect.
Track fiddler I have more recently found all the cars that came in that Spirit of 76 Bachmann set on eBay and finding all the other cars I had back then. I must see these trains run again. Dont know, ...Must be a what's left of the little kid left in me sorta thing I guess. They say you can never go back but I'm gonna to give it a shot
I have a similar piggyback from the 70's parked in my cart Kevin. The seller claims brand new. I'm not lucking out with the $3 price but intend to do the same upgrades.
I would say in general, for a 4x8 N scale layout, 2 amps is plenty and 6 is WAY more than you will ever need. I wouldn't be worried about power. Though MRC has always had a tendency to overstate their power pack ratings, but not so much that a 2 amp rated system can't power 4-5 running trains in N scale - if not more. The Tech 6 2.0 only allows one handheld though, so while it says you can run 6 locos, you can't actively control more than 2 anyway. Never would have a power problem with that in N scale.