dknelsonSo if "poof" the trains are all gone, but your hobby knowledge/ skills are not impaired, then what? It could be very liberating.
As I have said before, if I HAD to start all over again:
Shelf style 1:32 scale layout around the walls of my 11 by 22 room. One GP-7, and one 0-8-0 locomotive with the most amazing sound systems I could install, and a Pro-DCC throttle to run it.
-Kevin
Living the dream.
Just be sure to ENJOY the process!!! No rush..
MJ4562 Where would you start in terms of building and acquiring models and what general order do you do things if you want to be efficient with time and money? Has technological progress made stockpiling equipment for the future less wise or is there still value in it? What other issues should a modeler consider?
As others wrote, to answer those questions requires a bit of research and planning. There are plenty of challenges to consider in changing scales. The time/cost/effort required are only three of many. You also need to plan for ease and reach b/c standing on hard surfaces becomes more challenging when older. A ton of factors at play.
You also can have part of a layout in one scale and another in the primary.
dknelsonNot "pretend" Colorado narrow gauge but actually try to find 30 inch gauge prototypes.
A couple of Hawaiian common carriers were 30" gauge, as well as a number of sugar cane railroads.
Layout Design GalleryLayout Design Special Interest Group
The way the OP set forth the question is interesting because I do tend to think that even a fairly modest accumulation of models does tend to straight-jacket you from making too radical a change in scale, era, prototype (or at least geographical area). Even if common sense tells me I should switch to a larger scale due to eyesight for example, I have not and will not. Too many assets are tied up in what I have.
So if "poof" the trains are all gone, but your hobby knowledge/ skills are not impaired, then what? It could be very liberating. An opportunity not to be squandered.
Well I think the big first question is, realistically, how many years do I have left - of life, of eyesight, of mobility, of independent living, of sound mind, of adequate income?
Second question - is anything left? The trains are gone - but the benchwork? The scenery materials stash? Tools and raw materials, paints and cements? Is that all gone too?
Back in the 1960s when Egger-bahn first introduced its line of HOn 2 1/2 trains (soon followed by AHM's mini-trains line which a few years ago somebody brought back), Model Railroader published a neat article about an HOn 2 1/2 layout that used Egger-bahn stuff and I was captivated. Unlike most of the On30 stuff that Bachmann sells today, Egger bahn was not used to mimic 3 foot narrow gauge nor Maine 2 foot gauge, but actual contractor/industrial railroad sort of genuine 30" gauge prototype, using the little two axle flat cars and gondolas and hoppers that Egger bahn and AHM sold.
It was a beautiful little layout going to a quarry and running through a woods over a stream, with a lightweight little bridge over the stream. The track was N gauge but NOT N scale track - real HO scale track with widely spaced ties. I was fascinated by the idea and that layout.
I think I would try to do something like that layout but using On30. A few structures to build presumably from scratch. I'd zero in on the Bachmann 0-4-0T and 0-4-2T and Forney locomotives, and the smallest freight cars, maybe 2 axle if someone makes them. Not "pretend" Colorado narrow gauge but actually try to find 30 inch gauge prototypes. Maybe even try my hand at handlaid track. Scenery would be the thing.
Nice to think about. Unlikely to occur.
Dave Nelson
Prices can be all over for new stuff. My first move into DCC happened with a deal from e-bay, a sound MTH gP35 unit (newer run) and a Digitrax DCS 51, $200 out the door. Then I waited and got some other sound engines from Bachmann for real cheap from a major retailer. You only need one engine and a few cars to get started, the rest will show up in time and it takes time to build a layout.
LOTS of questions here...
MJ4562 recall reading articles where modelers jump into a new scale because a manufacturer has introduced a new line of locomotives for a specific prototype they are interested in.
I switched from N scale to HO after Life Luike brought out the Proto 2000 models. They were sweet enough to get me to jump scales.
MJ4562 On the other hand, technological progress can turn older models into expensive paperweights.
I have not kept up with technology. I still run DC and use old style Shinohara Non-DCC turnouts. No problems with paperweights here.
MJ4562Popular models often get re-released with more details, are smoother running and DCC ready.
I am different from other modelers here. I prefer my locomotives more durable than detailed. Some of these new locomotives (and Kadee's tank car) are nearly impossible to pick up because so many details are so fragile. Locomotives will require maintenance and handling. I want mine durable.
MJ4562Where would you start in terms of building and acquiring models?
That depends on the situation. For the current (and my final lifetime) layout project, I went with rolling stock first. That was I could have something to work on while waiting for the layout space to be completed.
I have also spent three years obtaining EVERYTHING I will need to build the layout. When I get the "green light", I will shoot into the project like a madman.
MJ4562What general order do you do things if you want to be efficient with time and money?
Model Railroading is a hobby. It is not efficient with time or money, it wastes both. In return you get joy and fun.
MJ4562Has technological progress made stockpiling equipment for the future less wise or is there still value in it?
That depends. If you must have DCC, superdetailed locmotives, and onboard sound, yes. If you are happy with DC, building from kits & details, and brass locomotives, like I am, then no.
MJ4562Where would you start in terms of building and acquiring models and what general order do you do things if you want to be efficient with time and money? Has technological progress made stockpiling equipment for the future less wise or is there still value in it? What other issues should a modeler consider?
Those are good questions. Here's my thoughts if I was to start over.
I have a United Models Santa Fe Class 1950 2-8-0 and that would be my startinng point. I would use Accural freight cars because of the wide choice or road names. Since that 2-8-0 still has its Pittman DC70 I would go DC using either my MRC Control Master II or my CM 20.
My other choice would be a C&O urban industrial lead set in 1963/64. Locomotives would be two P2K GP9s,2 P2K SW1200s and a Atlas RS1. Again I would use Accurail freight cars and again I would use either my CM II or CM20.
I suposse the thrill of starting over would be exciting.
To be sure I have given much thought in starting over with one of the above choices and I'm 72..
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
I design the layout for the models I reasonably foresee actually owning and running, even if I don't have the models yet. I go with as large a radius as I possibly can, and leave room along the layout edges so that no derailed item hits the floor. Usually 4 to 6 inches all the way around is sufficient for that. In HO I used the Kato 26.375" radius curved track with 28.75" radius transition pieces at the end of curves (to mimic the spiral curve transition and reduce sway of big equipment).
Those curves have been adequate to accommodate any Genesis or Genesis 2.0 diesel, any freight car I ever wanted, all of the commercially available plastic passenger cars, any plastic or hybrid steam engine I ever wanted to run (including all articulateds, big boys and 4-12-2's), and most brass steam power excepting some of the largest brass engines. You do not really need to have humongous radius curves, though some prefer large radius curves for aesthetic reasons. (I did redo part of my layout for larger radius curves, but found out I didn't really need to and wish I had not taken out any of the Kato track as it has been better and quieter than both Atlas and Walthers/Shinohara track).
I will say that some brass steam engines like may not like 26.375" radius. It is case by case, depending upon the end play in the axles and do any details interfere with leading and trailing truck swing. I had one brass 2-8-2, the Key/Samhongsa Texas & Pacific one from the late '70's, that didn't really like those curves, but every recent Boo Rim engine including Rock Island 2-8-2's, Texas & Pacific 4-8-2's has been fine (have not had a 2-10-2). Most of the older or vintage brass was actually designed to operate on 22" radius curves, so I have been told, so many of the older steamers actually will do that, but 24" or 26" radius is better and looks better.
Good luck with your plans. It's a fun hobby. I've started over, or re-started my interest and time period with motive power and rolling stock more than once. Currently am trying to go mostly steam...
John
That question confuses me. Are we changing scales or re-entering the hobby on the five year plan?
My understanding from recent brass threads is that brass has lost value. 1980's Stewart and Life Like Proto, have not appreciated in value, but are still desireable if you want to install DCC, which is not that hard.
Restarting or changing scales, I maintain you need a theme. You are not stocking a hobby store, you want locos and rolling stock that fit your era and location.
Some people, it they don't currently have space for a layout, go on a building spree of buildings they want. Other's accumulate. Dan Cortopassi has a youtube channel. He has boxes and boxes and boxes of locos and rolling stock and is just started to build a layout. Did I say he has boxes of stuff?
I think your time and money is better spent designing and building the layout, rather than accumulating more that will ever be able to run in anticipation of building a layout.
Henry
COB Potomac & Northern
Shenandoah Valley
Dream, Plan, Build. MR used to push that mantra a lot. It is still valid.
Sit down in The Comfy Chair with a drink, a pencil and a pad of paper. We can all work those. It's too early for the learning curve of computer layout design software. Draw the space you have. Think about doors, closets, water heaters and whatever else might get in the way. Write down your choices. Steam, diesel or electric? The past or modern day? Continuous running or point-to-point? Passenger or freight? East Coast, mountains or west?
What do you dream of? I used to dream of subways, and a subway train was my first purchase when I returned to the hobby. So yeah, Dream comes first.
Planning is important, too. Don't take forever, but it helps to write down your goals and keep referring to them.
When this virus nonsense is over, get out to train shows or do some club visits. See what others have done, but don't start buying things yet. Most of us have a workshop full of kits that really don't belong on our layouts, but we bought them before we thought about it.
You can get caught up in Plan, though, something we sometimes call Analysis Paralysis. I remember sitting in my office with computerized layouts on the screen in front of me. I realized I was stuck, for no good reason. I got up and went to the lumber yard.
It was time to Build.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
MJ4562What other issues should a modeler consider?
About 3 years ago I acquired a disease that affected my balance to the degree that I could no longer work on my multi-deck HO layout. I switched to N-scale so I could fit more layout in the same room while keeping it all on a single level and all reachable from a rolling swivel stool.
I settled on a modern-themed Norfolk Southern concept and immediately started gathering the equipment for fear that if I didn't grab what I wanted when it came available, I would miss out. About half the NS's roster at the time was Dash 9-44CW's and Kato was the only model available but only made 2 road numbers. Since I "needed" 6 I bought 4 more in another road name, 4 undec shells and decals.
I have almost completed the benchwork but laid no track, and now Scaletrains has really nice Dash 9-CW's available, even with sound. I almost bought them and put the others on ebay. Then last week NS announces they're retiring 300 locomotives - guess which ones.
OTOH, the Fox Valley heritage N&W and Southern units I picked up are like hen's teeth now, so you win a few and lose a few.
I have the right to remain silent. By posting here I have given up that right and accept that anything I say can and will be used as evidence to critique me.
Hi MJ4562,
How much are you prepared to spend on each locomotive or car? If you can afford to buy the best, like Rapido for example, then you will be thrilled with the level of detail and the performance. On the other hand, most of the older 'better quality' stuff works really well too, and for a lot less money.
Most of my locomotives are InterMountain, Proto 2000, Atlas or Kato, and I did the DCC conversions myself. I'm not worried about them becoming obsolete because I used (or will use) Loksound decoders which are upgradeable as the software improves. The locomotives all run extremely well with the Loksound decoders. I doubt that the drive systems will quit as long as they are cleaned and lubricated every few years. The only minor exception is that some of the Proto 2000 locomotives can suffer cracked axle gears, but that is an easy fix that only needs to be done once.
I recently purchased a Radido FP9A and I love it, but I'm just as happy with my InterMountain F series engines. In fact, the Intermountains run better than the Rapido did out of the box. In fairness, the Rapido hasn't been broken in yet. There are also a couple of details on the Rapido that I am very disappointed with. For example, the roof mounted Mars light is pathetic. I can build a better one from scratch. The Rapido came up on eBay for almost $80.00 less than the usual asking price so I couldn't resist but I doubt that I will buy another.
As far as rolling stock quality goes, you have a wide array of choices. You can buy the best RTR stuff from the beginning (for a price), or you can go all the way to the other end of the spectrum and buy really cheap cars and detail them yourself ala doctorwayne's fantastic work. I'm in the middle. Most of my freight cars are Athearn BB that have only been tuned to meet the NMRA standards. I'm quite happy with them. However, I have purchased some higher end RTR freight and passenger cars because they appeal to me.
I think it all boils down to a couple of simple questions: What is your budget? And, what do you want to spend you modelling time doing?
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
Let's see. You really need to decide what scale your new layout will be, before you start acquiring rolling stock. DCC is all the rage, everybody is talking it up. For a large club layout that hosts operating sessions with half a dozen engineers or more, DCC is the cat's meow. For a home layout where you are the only operator it is not all that necessary. My home layout is plain old DC. Models age gracefully. I still run rolling stock I scratch built and kitbashed 60 years ago. Buying stuff is one of the fun parts of model railroading. If you see a cool model at a good price, nothing wrong with picking it up.
Next step is finding, or negociating for, somewhere to build your layout. And the step after that is to get a train to run. Think about a very temporary layout, perhaps just an oval of snap track on a piece of plywood. Then you need a locomotive, a power pack and you ought to be in business. The simple oval of track can serve as a test track.
Now you are ready to build the layout of your dreams. Read a few Model Railroader magazines. Get and read John Armstrong's "Track Planning for Realistic Operation". Make some track plan drawings. Have another model railroader criticise your drawings. Start building benchwork and laying trackl.
David Starr www.newsnorthwoods.blogspot.com
Technology is always advancing. New control methods like DCC come along, motors get better, materials improve, RTR gets more detailed, signals get more realistic, etc. There is no solution for this other than buying all new every few years.
But except for locomotives, all the model railroad stuff I have accumulated over the last 45 years is still usable with DCC without change. With DCC, locomotives may need converted or replaced. Sure the cars from years ago don't have the same level of detail, but they still work. Same for structures. At normal viewing distances it all looks fine to me. So mostly I ignore the changes.
I was fortunate in that many of my S locomotives had an NMRA plug so converting to DCC was easy. More recent ones are already DCC. I have some older ones that will need converted eventually, but I can operate without them.
Paul
Just my opinion here. If you don't have a stockpile of gear, that's a good thing. It means you're starting from scratch and it's all wide open to you.
There are a lot of variables involved here that can affect other things. Example, if you want a coast to coast basement empire, but less than 500 sq ft, you might want N scale. If you're older and eyesight isn't what it was, you may want S or O scale. If you want a vast selection of available products, you might want to look at HO.
My suggestion would be to assess your physical priorities ( space, health, finances, etc), then what you want to do. Fascinated by logging? Love to see long- long trains? Like exquisitely detailed models? Favorite road and equipment available?
Put it on paper and you should have a clearer picture. Hope this helps.
Jim (with a nod to Mies Van Der Rohe)