Hi all,
I'm the guy who needed help shopping for Amtrak stuff. Well now I'm looking for some power for the Central Railroad of New Jersey.
My requirements are HO scale, DCC/sound, and something the CNJ had in 1971. (Therefore no EMD F units).
The only two locomotives I know of that are/will be available are the Bowser Baldwin DS 4-4-1000 and the Bachmann EMD GP7. The Baldwin is a switcher and the GP7 I've been told is terrible because it's Bachmann.
Thoughts and suggestions?
Edit: I am looking for a freight locomotive rather than a passenger one.
Modeler of the Lehigh Valley Railroad in Bethlehem PA, 1971 and railfan of Norfolk Southern's Lehigh and Reading Lines of the modern day.
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"When railroading time comes you can railroad...but not before."
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I highly disagree with the Bachmann GP7 being terrible. Lacking in detail yes, its more like the early Atlas/Kato yellow box era engines. I had 3 of them, all ran very nice, smooth and quiet. I did upgrade the decoders to TCS T1's to eliminate motor hum at slow speeds. I put lots of miles on them at the local club. If you buy one, test it before you leave the shop, some do run like crap, but most run quite well for the price. Only other options is getting a model custom painted. Not sure when CNJ got rid of thier Alco RS3's. Good luck in your hunt Mike
Silly NT's, I have Asperger's Syndrome
A quick search on Walthers.com reveals that Atlas has made SD35s in CNJ paint. Walthers says they are sold out, but you may be able to find on a your LHS or trainshow or eBay.
I think you may need to costum paint if you want something else. However I’d say if you get a pair of CNJ SD35s and a Baldwin switcher you’ll have road and yard power. A GP7 would compliment them, but you may need to work with the Bachmann a bit, it’s hard to say, I’ve had poor experience with Bachman but other have not.
Good Luck
Regards, Isaac
I model my railroad and you model yours! I model my way and you model yours!
HO Hobbyist ...the GP7 I've been told is terrible because it's Bachmann.
"One difference between pessimists and optimists is that while pessimists are more often right, optimists have far more fun."
Have you checked EBay? A quick search will yield you a number of engines that would fit your time period.
https://www.ebay.com/sch/97170/i.html?_from=R40&_nkw=CNJ&LH_TitleDesc=0&_sop=1&rt=nc&_oaa=1&_dcat=97170
Good luck!
Neal
Poking around eBay and the internet I found the following listed:
You'll have to consult the CNJ Historical Society for specific dates that certain CNJ locomotives operated. However, the Fallen Flags website for the CNJ lists a number of 1st & 2nd generation locomotives still operating in the early 70s - i.e. assuming those photo dates are correct.
Tom
https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling
Time...It marches on...without ever turning around to see if anyone is even keeping in step.
Here's a CNJ Atlas FM Trainmaster that you might be interested in:
http://www.20thcenturyhobbies.com/item.php?item_code=ATL-7765
Russ
Modeling the early '50s Erie in Paterson, NJ. Here's the link to my railroad postcard collection: https://railroadpostcards.blogspot.com/
HO Hobbyist ...the GP7 I've been told is terrible because it's Bachmann. Let’s get this clear from the beginning, I do not do any of the following for Bachmann, work for them, paid to represent their products, have Bachmann shares, know someone who works for them! 15 years ago, when I used to fill in at the long gone LHS, I would have steered purchasers of locomotives away from Bachmann, apart from their “Spectrum Series”, to other manufacturers. BUT that was 15 years ago, things have changed over at Bachmann. I have three Bachmann DCC equipped Sharknose, 2 A, 1 B, that have had hard usage running on the layout at shows, 8 hours a day, for up to three days. I should also add that apart from addressing and consisting, they are as they came out of the box. Fellow Model Railroaders of a certain age have observed and favourably commented on them, and other “new” Bachman in action, but then are overheard still continuing to perpetrate the “Bachmann is Rubbish Myth”. Word of mouth is good, but only if the word is well informed. Cheers, the Bear.
I agree with you Bear, execpt now the prices are so high that you're better off getting an Atlas or something else. My .
As for the question, look at photos from the locale and era. I know it can be hard finding photos.
Harrison
Homeschooler living In upstate NY a.k.a Northern NY.
Modeling the D&H in 1978.
Route of the famous "Montreal Limited"
My YouTube
Wow everyone that was quick! This forum post was more successful than any of my others.
I'm going to look through the suggestions and will get back to you.
A per the Bachmann GP7, is it worth $140? New/DCC+sound. Or am I better off searching for something else.
Regarding the Bachmann thing, here’s my !
My first loco was a Bachmann Spectrum GE 70tonner I got at a train show for $20 (though it was tagged at $25, fellow gave me a discount as he knew I was a beginner). The loco was in good condition when I bought, I ran it on the test track at the show and it ran fine.
A month later I had accumulated enough track and a power pack and but the loco to work. After a few runs I began to smell that electrical smell just like those old slot cars. I though this is weird so paid a bit of close attention to it running and saw it ran jerkily, especially in reverse.
I bought a new engine at a local used train store, which ran way better than the Bachmann, and asked the guy there if he knew what was wrong with my engine (he is a pretty experienced guy since he fixes up trains for a living!). He guessed that it had cracked gears just like old P2Ks are notorious for having. I wonder if they may have melted. The loco remained this way when I put it in storage a year ago. Have too look at it this summer.
Now this must have been an older model, but when I look at Bachmann’s newer stuff the detail is medium, but then the price is about what you’d pay for a high end Atlas, yet the detail doesn’t meet that price, and I’ve heard that people have had issues (even more resently) with their Bachmanns.
Hense I will not buy a Bachmann unless it is the only plastic version of a specific engine. I worry their upcoming SC44 might hook me, though if their prices follow their recent trends, I may not even be able to afford it!
Again just my opinions! I realize I just wrote a whole ton, so good job if you have read this far!
Here's a review of a Bachmann GP7, DCC, from MRR in June, 2010.
http://mrr.trains.com/news-reviews/staff-reviews/2010/04/bachmann-ho-scale-electro-motive-division-gp7
I have some Bachmann Spectrum locomotives, and they run fine. I don't think you should be afraid of Bachmann.
The days of the old "pancake" style motor are long gone. I would say a GP7 with DCC and sound, is a decent deal at $140.
I paid about the same price for a Bachmann Spectrum 2-8-0, DCC and sound, and it runs and sounds great.
I'm not normally a steam guy, but I just had to have it.
Mike.
My You Tube
HO HobbyistA per the Bachmann GP7, is it worth $140? New/DCC+sound. Or am I better off searching for something else.
More than likely it's going to have a paired-down OEM decoder vs a full-featured one. If you are okay with that then it's a decent deal.
I would rather have an Atlas or Bowser/Stewart locomotive (e.g. RS-12). While you are going to spend more for one with sound, it's worth it for the better-quality decoder and motors. Cannon and Buehler motors - like those in the Bowsers - are 2nd-to-none in smoothness.
mbinsewiI paid about the same price for a Bachmann Spectrum 2-8-0, DCC and sound, and it runs and sounds great.
Those Bachmann Spectrum 2-8-0s are indeed sweet units, Mike. The one saw operating back in the mid-2000s didn't have sound decoder but it ran very smoothly.
Ok everyone.
Despite the lack of detail I likely will go with the Bachmann. It can work as a mainline runner and assemble it's own trains. (CNJ doesn't have a yard on my layout). However, there is one major deal breaker with the Bachmann...
The Bachmann is a model of CNJ 1523. I can't find pictures of it pulling freight, only passenger. If anyone knows about this locomotive, I've posted on the Trains general discussion.
I can't vouche for the CNJ but GP7s on the NYC were dual-purpose units and could be used for either freight or passenger service. My guess is the CNJ Geeps were used the same and the photos you are finding are from an excursion run.
Here's a photo of #1532 operating some freight in Jim Thorpe, PA:
I think it's safe to say that #1523 did the same...
While I know some Geeps did pull freight, I can't find one picture of #1523 doing so.
Why no F units? Your timeframe is a period when the CNJ was in bankruptcy and had huge power shortages, so they leased F units from the B&O and N&W (N&W units were former Wabash). F7s, here, as opposed to the CNJ's original F3s. SD35s would be found, as well as a bunch of B&O leased SD40s.
You can find models of pretty much all of these. They may not have DCC and sound already iunstalled, but that shouldn't stop you.
Plenty of photos online to see these various locos.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
tstage I think it's safe to say that #1523 did the same...
Hate to disagree with you Tom but I’d have to disagree. The SP&S had a group of 6 gp9s. Now 150-152 had steam generators and were use primarily as backup passenger engines. They rarely pulled frieght. However their siblings nos 153-155 lacked steam generators and only pulled freight. With the CNJ being similarly relatively small, it could easily have done similarly. I wouldn’t assume w/out photo graphic evident, especially if the picture you have of a gp7 pulling freight is so many numbers off.
To the OP I’d go for an Atlas or a Bowser, they are much higher quality. Besides, if you have the excuse to run a Baldwin that late then do it! However in the end it’s your railroad!
Here's a couple of pics of CNJ 1523 in passenger service in '66 & '76:
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1193361
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1491007
So, that would indeed seem to be the case for that particular locomotive. Good call, Isaac...
HO HobbyistWhile I know some Geeps did pull freight, I can't find one picture of #1523 doing so.
Change the loco's number to what suites you.
Just because a picture doesn't excist, is no proof that it wasn't occasional used for freight, as suggested by Tom, and in Trains by Flitlock76.
Do what you like.
mbinsewi HO Hobbyist While I know some Geeps did pull freight, I can't find one picture of #1523 doing so. Change the loco's number to what suites you. Just because a picture doesn't excist, is no proof that it wasn't occasional used for freight, as suggested by Tom, and in Trains by Flitlock76. Do what you like. Mike.
HO Hobbyist While I know some Geeps did pull freight, I can't find one picture of #1523 doing so.
This is true.
Today I spent a lot of time speaking to people and searching around, and found that the Atlas SD35 listed on Walthers' website is not out of stock, but far from it! It's unreleased! Therefore, I'll wait until I see what people think of it after it comes out.
If you want to see my current plans, check my website at http://hohobbyist.weebly.com/wish-list.
You'll like the Atlas over the Bachmann. Especially if get the ESU sound.
So, I don't know anything in particular about the CNJ, and while doing some searching around, I've noticed that there are 3 colors, the dark green, the red, and the lighter green, as the Atlas loco is.
Whats the correct color for your 1971 time period?
Just curious.
Atlas? Bachmann? If you don't mind waiting, Athearn will soon be making a CNJ Passenger GP7 with the bulges at the end of the long hood for train-lighting equipment.
Dave
Just be glad you don't have to press "2" for English.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQ_ALEdDUB8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6hqFS1GZL4s
http://s73.photobucket.com/user/steemtrayn/media/MovingcoalontheDCM.mp4.html?sort=3&o=27
Dave,
From earlier in the thread conversation, I think the OP would prefer a freight locomotive rather than a passenger.
HO Hobbyist Today I spent a lot of time speaking to people and searching around, and found that the Atlas SD35 listed on Walthers' website is not out of stock, but far from it! It's unreleased! Therefore, I'll wait until I see what people think of it after it comes out.
FYI train now adays are often in limited runs, and preordering is nessesary to be certain of getting an engine. Just saying, don’t wait to long for buying the SD35!
Have yet to miss somehing I wanted by not pre-ordering. I never preorder. The locos will show up a few months after they are "sold out" on eBay, for the original price ANd sometimes years later at a greatly reduced price - like my Atlas Trainmaster, got the DCC/Sound version for the price of the DC version, years after it was sold out, and new in box. Not a used loco. Picked up an extra PCM Reading T1, also NIB, long after they were sold out, but before the Paragon II ones came out (which I don;t want, don;t need the smoke, and the ESU decoder is better than BLI's decoders). ANd my new Walthers Plymouth switcher - I wanted the undec blue one, because it matches th scheme on othe rlocos used at the cement plant I plan to put on my layout. Blue with white roof. They were suppsoedly sold out weeks after the were released, preorders sucked them all up. Until a few months ago when a Walther's sale annoucement reminded me that I did want to get one if I could. Orderign direct was an option, but I paid less for the loco AND less for shippign by getting it from Modeltrainstuff - yes, they had one in stock. I didn;t even have to fight on eBay for it. Click, ordered, and in my hands in a couple of days.
Patience is the key. If you MUST have it now, then you need to preorder. Otherwise, you can always get something.
tstage Here's a couple of pics of CNJ 1523 in passenger service in '66 & '76: http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1193361 http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1491007 So, that would indeed seem to be the case for that particular locomotive. Good call, Isaac... Tom
Note the train lighting equipment box ont he end of the long hood of 1523 in these pictures. Note it is NOT present on the photo of 1532 at Jim Thorpe.
1532 wouldn't have been able to haul those passenger cars. That's not to say it might not have been used to pull other passenger cars that had axle generators, but I think all the CNJ commuter cars were converted to head end power and thus used locos like 1523 outfitted with the control equipment.
Reading was a little different. Geeps and other locos were purchased for passenger service and numbered x60 and up, while the freight ones were X00 and up. Freight geeps had dynamics, passenger geeps did not, but had steam heat. In warmer months, when heat was not required, freight locos often pulled the passenger trains as substitutes. This was doable because the difference here was just the steam heating system, and if you don;t actually need heat..
Regarding the OP's original question (and not regarding Bachmann), and assuming you want locomotives that CNJ actually owned/leased, and not the wide range of run-through power from Reading, B&O, and others:
In addition to what's been mentioned above, Atlas "Classic" line has offered CNJ RS-1 (green/yellow stripes) and RS-3 (blue); at least one of them also was offered in the earlier yellow box/Kato line (sorry, can't recall which one). The RS3s, at least, were certainly in use in 1971. Just a couple years later than your time period, Athearn "ready to run" offered SD40 3067 (in the red/white scheme). These all turn up on ebay occasionally. Also, in the early 1970s CNJ had acquired a number of Reading RS3s (not sure if they were leased or bought second hand by CNJ; as far as I know all were in the older Reading solid dark green, no green/yellow); again, Atlas (Classic or yellow box) has done these. Also, the LifeLike Proto 1000 RDC came in a CNJ version. Rapido offers a much more expensive, higher quality CNJ RDC also. You'll probably find other options if you search the ebay HO locomotive category using parentheses and commas to cover all of these naming possibilities: (Jersey, CNJ, JCL).
HO Hobbyist and something the CNJ had in 1971. (Therefore no EMD F units). The only two locomotives I know of that are/will be available are the Bowser Baldwin DS 4-4-1000 and the Bachmann EMD GP7. The Baldwin is a switcher and the GP7 I've been told is terrible because it's Bachmann. Thoughts and suggestions? Edit: I am looking for a freight locomotive rather than a passenger one.
and something the CNJ had in 1971. (Therefore no EMD F units).
Ok, CNJ did have Funits in 1970 - 1971, leased (or donated) from the B&O and N&W (ex Wabash). A quartet were almost always on the Pit at Potomac yard, VA. for use on the PY to Jersey City Hudson. The B&O crew used to follow our motors (PC train BL-6, PY to Phillipsburg, NJ).
Bachmann GP7s are not junk. They lack some detail, and should have the OEM decoder replaced by something else. The CNJ GP7s were all dual service, as were their RS-3s and FM Road Switchers. One item missing from most models of GP7 painted for the CNJ, is the auxiliary power box, on the long hood end (see previous photo link), which may be available from the Anthraacite RRHS, or another supplier. Other than that they are good to go.
GP7s were still very much in use in 1972, running out of Penn Station Newark, some by then in B&O Dark blue and yellow striping, with Lady Liberty logo where the Capitol Dome would be.
If you are modeling the Lehigh Valley of PA, the CNJ used to run trains into Allentown, PA, which by 1971 were cut back to Phillipsburg, NJ as NJ would not subsidize trains into PA.
Boris