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Advise on making coal or rock loads for hoppers

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  • Member since
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Posted by Eilif on Saturday, March 9, 2019 3:22 PM

I don't know which formulation I have, but I ran a magnet through it and I don't think anything came out that I could see.

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Posted by BigDaddy on Saturday, March 9, 2019 2:21 PM

maxman
Black Beauty blast medium

Has anyone ever stuck a magnet into it to see if there are any magnetic particles?

There are 3 versions of Black Beauty

  • Original  19% ferric oxide
  • Glass   less than 0.05% iron oxide
  • Iron  40-60% iron oxide

Not sure what the difference is between iron oxide ferric oxide, but ferric is also know as magnetite, that's a clue.  They also come in 3 grades extra fine, fine and medium, except for the glass, which is fine, medium and coarse.

Henry

COB Potomac & Northern

Shenandoah Valley

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Posted by maxman on Saturday, March 9, 2019 1:59 PM

ndbprr
Black Beauty blast medium

I have considered this stuff.

Has anyone ever stuck a magnet into it to see if there are any magnetic particles?

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Posted by BroadwayLion on Saturday, March 9, 2019 12:00 PM

Yeah, well LION would just go to a store that sold sand blasting medium. Just pour it into your hopper car.

 

If you want it empty again you just pick up the car and dump it out.

 

ROARING

The Route of the Broadway Lion The Largest Subway Layout in North Dakota.

Here there be cats.                                LIONS with CAMERAS

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Posted by mbinsewi on Friday, March 8, 2019 1:52 PM

Jumijo, once you add the quote to your post, hit enter again to get you out of the quote box, so it's easier to find your post. 

I had to look to see just what you added to this.

Mike.

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Posted by Jumijo on Friday, March 8, 2019 1:45 PM

Eilif

 

 
mbinsewi
Looks like fun for all!  I didn't realize that TycoDepot was such a popular of a forum, actually I didn't know it excisted until I responded to another thread in here.

 

It was fun making the loads.  It can be tough finding layout activities for both of them to participate in. We built a couple of roundhouse boxcars once which was fun until we got to the infuriating screws in metal frams. Also soon I'm going to haul them up to the attic to brush a coat of grey/brown over the layout foam.

I've been planning to involve them in building scrap loads too. Gather up a bunch of plastic junk and let them glue them onto pieces of plastic resting (with saran wrap in between) in gondolas. Then give them various dirty/rusty paints and washes and fun with weathering! I've got alot of Illinois Terminal Gondolas that need loads...

As for Tycodepot, I first want to be clear that I'm not trying to poach folks from here for there.  It's a nice place focusing on older, cheaper and oddity trains which is where my core interests lie.  However, if your interests run to modern production and more prototypical models and operations and keeping up with what's new in the hobby you'll probably find more to your liking here at the MR forums. 

I like both but they scratch different itches.

 

 

Tyco Depot is awesome! 

Modeling the Baltimore waterfront in HO scale

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Posted by mbinsewi on Friday, March 8, 2019 1:25 PM

I really had no intentions of joining it, I'm in enough forums the way it is!

I was just stating, "Who Knew?"  It is a good place to send those that have questions on such equipment.

My Tyco interest ended when I was able to buy my first Athearn, some time in the early 80's?

Mike.

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  • From: Chicago, IL
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Posted by Eilif on Friday, March 8, 2019 1:19 PM

mbinsewi
Looks like fun for all!  I didn't realize that TycoDepot was such a popular of a forum, actually I didn't know it excisted until I responded to another thread in here.

It was fun making the loads.  It can be tough finding layout activities for both of them to participate in. We built a couple of roundhouse boxcars once which was fun until we got to the infuriating screws in metal frams. Also soon I'm going to haul them up to the attic to brush a coat of grey/brown over the layout foam.

I've been planning to involve them in building scrap loads too. Gather up a bunch of plastic junk and let them glue them onto pieces of plastic resting (with saran wrap in between) in gondolas. Then give them various dirty/rusty paints and washes and fun with weathering! I've got alot of Illinois Terminal Gondolas that need loads...

As for Tycodepot, I first want to be clear that I'm not trying to poach folks from here for there.  It's a nice place focusing on older, cheaper and oddity trains which is where my core interests lie.  However, if your interests run to modern production and more prototypical models and operations and keeping up with what's new in the hobby you'll probably find more to your liking here at the MR forums. 

I like both but they scratch different itches.

Visit the Chicago Valley Railroad for Chicago Trainspotting and Budget Model Railroading. 

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Posted by mbinsewi on Friday, March 8, 2019 11:51 AM

Looks like fun for all!  I didn't realize that TycoDepot was such a popular of a forum, actually I didn't know it excisted until I responded to another thread in here.

I guess Tyco lives, big time!

Mike.

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Posted by Eilif on Friday, March 8, 2019 10:12 AM

I bought a 50 pound bag of black sandblasting medium (Black blast I think...) at Menards last year.  More than I'll ever need.

If anyone in the Chicago area (I'm on the west side) wants some, get in touch and swing by and I'll send you off with as much as you want.

As for the making of loads, mine aren't quite as perfect as some here, but I made a project of it with my kids and they look pretty good.

Process:

-cut out rectangles of foam board,

-molded the 3 mounds on each with air-dry clay

-I dripped on some thin superglue that night to stabilize the clay on the foamboard 

-Paint black all over with cheap acrylic.  Lots of fun!

-paint with PVA (tacky or wood glue) and dip in the bucket of Black Blast.

Pictures here:

http://www.tycodepot.com/post/32084/thread

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Posted by doctorwayne on Monday, March 4, 2019 8:37 PM

I use Black Beauty as "live" loads to represent anthracite.  This Athearn hopper weighs 8oz. loaded...

I also use coke breeze as "live" loads of bituminous coal, with a similar loaded hopper weighing about 4oz....

Coke breeze is also used, loose, in all of my steam locomotives' tenders...

Wayne

 

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Posted by ndbprr on Monday, March 4, 2019 5:02 PM

Well if you want a cheap great product you need to find an industrial supply store that sells Black Beauty blast medium.  It comes in a 50# bag and will do several hundred cars.  It is shiny black grit about the same size as sandblast sand.  I bought my bag probably 20 years ago for about $3.00 and still have most of it left.  I doubt it would be more then $10.00 per bag today.  Great stuff, non conductive electrically and adds significant weight to hoppers.

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Posted by Anonymous on Monday, March 4, 2019 2:59 PM

Live loading is an option.

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Posted by dbduck on Monday, March 4, 2019 2:45 PM

Just some added information...I do the same procedure for  my iron ore loads in my ore jennys as well. I have over 50 of those cars.. from various manufacturers. AHM Roundhouse, etc. Their inside dimensions are all diff thus loads dont interchange. To mark those, each brand of car has a unique colored dot on the bottom (not noticable when on track) and corresponding loads marked the same way.  Example  AHM yellow dot  Roundhouse Tan dot...so loads are marked for series of car not each individual car itself

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Posted by dbduck on Monday, March 4, 2019 2:27 PM

The one issue I would have using mold for pouring plaster is that every  load would have the same contour. Just as the plastic inserts that come with some cars do

That being said  I have noticed on some protype coal trains.. the loads do appear similar.. prob from slow moving, on the move loading  by automatic tipple

They all seemd to have a slight higher mound at the same end on every car. Usually the trailing end

For me its just personal preference that each load is unique to itself

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Posted by Lone Wolf and Santa Fe on Monday, March 4, 2019 1:38 PM

dstarr
I used soft pine blocks, cut to size with my radial arm saw. Shaped into rounded coal mound shapes with hand planes, wood rasps, and a 3 inch drum sanding attachment to the radial arm saw. Painted the wood black. Then gave it a good coat of white glue, and a good coating of HO sized coal on top of the glue. Made a dozen loads in one big batch.

Thanks, that just gave me the idea to make the bases using 2x4s cut with my table saw. And making the contour mounds will mean using less store bought ballast.

Modeling a fictional version of California set in the 1990s Lone Wolf and Santa Fe Railroad
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Posted by Lone Wolf and Santa Fe on Monday, March 4, 2019 1:33 PM

    Thank you all. I would have never thought of using saran wrap. That’s a great tip and I like how it means the load fits perfectly into the car. I thought someone might suggest a technique to make plaster molds but this other method seems a lot easier. 
    As for coal, I will use Arizona Rock or some other ballast material. I'm not sure what I will use for the base. I will have to see what I can find around the house. I know I have sheet styrene but I might have some old wood paneling or something. I might try the foam rubber also. Thanks again.

Modeling a fictional version of California set in the 1990s Lone Wolf and Santa Fe Railroad
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Posted by dstarr on Monday, March 4, 2019 1:28 PM

Easy enough to make.  I ran off a batch of 'em last summer.  I was going to post some photos, but the power failed just as I started uploading photos to train board.  Power came back after an hour and a half, but trainboard refused to upload any more photos.  So, no pix. 

  I used soft pine blocks, cut to size with my radial arm saw.  Shaped into rounded coal mound shapes with hand planes, wood rasps, and a 3 inch drum sanding attachment to the radial arm saw.  Painted the wood black.  Then gave it a good coat of white glue, and a good coating of HO sized coal on top of the glue.  Made a dozen loads in one big batch.  Since then I have acquired yet more hoppers and I need to do another coal load project. 

Below is my U-tube video of every coal hopper I own.  You will notice that some of them need loads.

Bis
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Posted by Bis on Monday, March 4, 2019 11:48 AM
For coal, I cut open the water filter cartridge from Keurig coffee maker. Looks just like coal and is about the right size.
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Posted by kasskaboose on Monday, March 4, 2019 7:36 AM

I can attest to what others describe for creating coal loads.  This is a fast and easy method.  The approach makes very realistic coal loads.  I like the ability to take out the loads to create empty cars. 

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Posted by "JaBear" on Monday, March 4, 2019 1:47 AM

Here's a link to an old discussion.

http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/11/p/215446/2367174.aspx#2367174

Cheers, the Bear.Smile

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Posted by JDL56 on Sunday, March 3, 2019 10:11 PM

To be clear, I didn't carve foam. I cut it. It's the soft mattress foam you use for an underlay. Not Styrofoam. I wanted flat tops, per a modern prototype. Mattress foam was perfect. I then spray painted it glossy black. 

John

 

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Posted by xboxtravis7992 on Sunday, March 3, 2019 8:36 PM

I have a friend who molds a shape with some sculpting putty into the coal car or tender he wants the load to go into, then he crushes up some coal he found exploring coal country in central Utah outside mines and at abandoned loading docks/tipple sites. Do not enter abandoned coal mines to find coal... that's dangerous and most of the hardrock abandoned mine exploring community view coal mines as a crazy hazard compared to most caves/mines they normally explore, as my friend did you can probably find enough chunks of coal outside the mines and loading areas without ever needing to enter a mine. 

If you don't want to go hunting out in the desert or foothills of coal country, just look up online for a mom and pa type coal dealer and order a bag of coal from them online. The live steam community might be able to point you in the right direction to a buisness that sells bags of coal. 

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Posted by peahrens on Sunday, March 3, 2019 8:12 PM

My base is a piece of 0.040" styrene.  I added sculptamold in the shape I desired.  Painted flat black.  Glued Arizona Rock & Minerals real coal atop with diluted white glue and alcohol surfactant. 

 IMG_7550 (2) by Paul Ahrens, on Flickr

 IMG_7546 (2) by Paul Ahrens, on Flickr

 IMG_7548 (2) by Paul Ahrens, on Flickr

 IMG_7549 (2) by Paul Ahrens, on Flickr

 

Paul

Modeling HO with a transition era UP bent

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Posted by cowman on Sunday, March 3, 2019 3:14 PM

I use similar methods to those above.  First I cut a strip of foam the width of the cars to be done, one inch is ususally thick enough.  Cut the strip to length to fit.  Using a knife and Surform tool, shape the load.  Cut a chunk off the top, glue in a piece of steel.  (I used cheap latex caulk to hold the steel and repalce the piece cut off).  Put plastic wrap in the car and press in, using the load.  Paint with black (or needed color) latex paint and sprinkle on coal or whatever over the wet paint.  When dry lift out with the wrap, it  has protedted the car and kept the seam wide enough to slip the load in and out without binding, but not leaving a gap.  I use a telecoping magnetic tool pick up to lift out the loads.  As noted, mark the bottoms to identify what type of car they fit.

Good luck,

Richard 

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Posted by mbinsewi on Sunday, March 3, 2019 2:40 PM

For my raw frac sand loads, I did what JC and JDL did.  I carved a piece of foam, and paint and textured accordingly.

The loads come out easy for running empty.

Mike.

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Posted by JDL56 on Sunday, March 3, 2019 2:33 PM

I use mattress foam, cut to shape. See more at:

http://cprailmmsub.blogspot.com/2010/05/easy-coal-loads-from-foam.html 

John Longhurst, Winnipeg

 

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Posted by j. c. on Sunday, March 3, 2019 2:00 PM

foam carved to profile  with a hunk of steel inbeded in it or if you prefer a magnet, then if coal paint black and sprinkle coal or anything black that looks like coal . size depends on era , moderen would be steam coal 2 to 3 inches and under older era would be stoker 1/12 inch or mine run often up to 8 inches to dust.

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Posted by dbduck on Sunday, March 3, 2019 1:53 PM

I have in the past cut a piece of thin sheet styrene or even balsa to fit inside the car  just below the top of the car. i then use plastic wrap such as Saran Wrap to put between the  styrene/balsa and the inside of the car to keep the coal from being glued to the car so that the load can be removed when dry, and creating a loose fit for later

. Next I pour  my coal material, usually Woodland scenics, into the top of the car to the contour of my liking. Glue it in place as I would ballast.. wetting with alcohol & then applying a deluted glue solution

When set up the load should be hard as a rock.. remove it using the plastic wrap to assist..after that you should be able to  install & remove with little trouble (no plastic wrap)

If your cars are of different manufacture  size etc.. you can write on the bottom of the load as to which car it belongs with

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