PC101,
Thanks for the additional tips. There are a couple of shows coming up before too long, so will look for a donor loco.
At the moment I am sorting and boxing all my rolling stock so that I can start work on finishing the room where my island has been sitting for some time, then I will put up an around the room shelf, so I'm not in a rush. Some of the sorted goodies will end up for sale at one of the shows.
Thanks again for the info and will try to get back to you when I find the needed materials, time and the courage to tackle the job.
Have fun,
Richard
cowman,
Finding a straight donor frame with the coupler pads drilled and tapped will be your best bet and after you find that frame you should try to straighten your old warped frame slightly and see how it goes. If it breaks then you transfer all parts. If it doesn't break, you have learned something. Since you had the walkway and body seperated from the metal frame before lets hope you are at this point again. Now with the frame, weights, trucks and motor in front of you, before you take anything more apart, take a Sharpie pen (not black) or paint pen and mark on one end only, the frame, truck, truck worm gear cover, weight, flywheel. When you assemble it all back together again, all marked parts should be on the same end. When you get ready to disassemble, look at that fuel tank you will see the ears/latches holding the fuel tank in place, the ones closest to the round air tanks (long hood end) are first to get unlatched from the frame then the other two closest to the boxy (short hood end) of the fuel tank will just unhook and the fuel tank will come off. You will have to disconnect the four truck pickup wires (maybe cut, unsolder or un clip that stupid plastic wire retainer from the circut board). Remove the four screws that hold the two weights in place. Slip off the plastic worm gear covers on both trucks. Don't loose the two drive shafts or worm gears and bushings. Now that you have the fuel tank off, remove the two screws holding the motor in place. There, the warped frame should be striped and now the parts will be installed on the new frame. Just remember that the walkway and body will only go on the metal frame one way correctly. I have bought a few RS3s (cheap) that were installed end for end wrong and the walkway was stretched out a bit and messed up. Easy fix as long as nothing is cracked.
I see you have sound, meaning a speaker, that you will need to address on how to switch out to the new frame. I have milled out space under the motor and my speaker sits there with opening in the fuel tank bottom.
Thanks for the description. I'm weighing options.
Any ideas on what kind of a job it is to change frames, either from a derelict loco or purchase a new frame (if available). If I hadn't had DCC w/sound installed, I'd feel a lot differently about trying different options.
Thanks again for the ideas,
Strighting these cast frames are tricky depending on the distance you must go and direction. Doing it free handed is like squeezing a raw egg in the shell but can be done as you did it. I have used my milling machine with steel blocks and bolts to hold the frame center while lowing the milling head to push down on the ends to strighten it. The frame was stripped down. Another way would be to remove just the body and walkway. Turn the metal chassie upside down, take four identicle pieces of hard wood, place two under the frame directly under the trucks on each side. The wood blocks will be supporting the truck ends. You will want very little space (thickness of a quarter, 25 cents) between the top of motor/decoder (center of the frame) and the work table (use shims of plastic if needed under the wood blocks to gain space between the motor and work table) so you do not over strighten and crack the frame. You do not want the frame to move to fast or to far. Now push down on the fuel tank very lightly and see if the space between the top of the motor is closer to the work table. The quarter hopefully will not slide between the motor and work table. This is the best I can say besides... roadtrip, or maybe find a new/used STRIGHT frame. Now I need to clean off my work bench and find my feeler gauge. Just remember as mentioned above which way the walkway and body go back on the frame.
PS: I never applied heat (hair dryer or heat gun) to the cast metal frames yet.
Thank you for the tips. It is a black box, Classic Series.
My old hands aren't strong enough to squeeze the fuel tank enough, so I left it attached as you suggested. I had seen that it looked like it only hid those two screws, I was just following the directions. (Must be all else had failed.)
When I got the body off it still looked like there was a sag somewhere. I took the sill off and laid a straightedge on the frame. It was slightly bowed. I gently tried to straighten it. When I reassembled it one coupler is now at the proper height, the other still high. It was a bit difficult getting the sill back on, but I finally succeeded.
At the moment I don't feel like trying it again, at least tonight, have another, modeling project, sort and store, that needs to be done next, so it may be a few days before I tackle it again.
Any suggestions on straightening the frame would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks again for the help,
With the loco on it's roof the long hood end of the fuel tank has latchs/ears holding the fuel tank to the metal frame. Squeeze those two cylindrical air tanks with your fingers an lift the fuel tank ever so slightly up from the metal frame. STOP, you will see the latches/ears on the fuel tank corners. Now slide the fuel tank towards the long hood end and the latches /lugs on the short hood end of the fuel tank will unlatch from the metal frame.
Just curious, which vintage of RS3's do you have, Yellow box with molded on the body grab bars that the couplers attach to the plastic walkways (bad engineering design) or Black box with separate applied grab bars that the couplers attach to the metal frame?
Any chance somebody reversed the body and walk way on the frame? That would make the body center high. There is a metal tab on the frame that will not fit into it's location in the plastic if the plastic body is backwards. Square fuel tank towards the cab/short hood, side air tanks towards long hood is correct.
I do not see the reason to remove the fuel tank for anything except to get to the two screws holding the motor in place.
Progress, despite the cows destroying a section of fence this morning.
Found the loco to compare to in the very bottom of the last box I looked in, where else would it have been. That showed me that the frame was not quite in place at the center, though tight at the ends, also could see that the steps were not quite verticle.
Went to the Atlas site and got the removal instructions. The second step is to remove the fuel tank by "sliding it away from the frame." Doesn't seem to want to slide, do I push it toward the long hood end, the short hood end or sideways?
I'm used to working on much larger equipment and tend to be a bit tentative when working on fragile, expensive things like this.
Thanks for the help, we'll get this fixed yet.
How to make oneself look like a fool in one easy lesson.
As I wrote this original question I was going to look up to see if there were any other similar discussions, but I was in a hurry and didn't do it.
Well Ed, the reference to another discussion you listed was my asking the same question with the same title a little over 2 years ago. (Duah!!!) I'd forgotten all about it. (Maybe I am geting old.) Not sure what happened at the time that stopped me from fixing it (or trying). I've had a few ups and downs as to what I am going to do, but now I have a good chance to make some significant progress, so am on an up. Cleaning things up, putting away so new layout can be started.
Originally I did look at the frame, it seems to fit at the ends, where I looked. However, now that I look at it again the center doesn't look quite right. Looked for another RS-3 to compare, but it's hidden in a box somewhere, more looking soon. When I do find one to compare it to and the instructions on how to take the shell off I will see what I find.
I did have a sound decoder installed, so there may be something holding it up just a bit somewhere.
Thank you all for your replys and I certainly plan to come back and tell you what I find as soon as I find stuff.
Thanks again,
doctorwayneThat would be what I'd check first, especially since you mention that they're both too high
I have found that in the haste of the manufacturing process sometimes a bit of flash or, yikes, a wire was pinched between the frame and shell.
In the earlier M-R thread I linked to above, someone mentioned a design change at Atlas where the coupler mount has been moved from the frame to the body shell.
Careful inspection and diagnostics is required.
Good luck, Ed
gmpullman...maybe the shell doesn't sit down onto the frame far enough...
That would be what I'd check first, especially since you mention that they're both too high, but to differing degrees.Wayne
Is this one loco or do you have another that it may be compared to? Is everything seated? If no issues stand out, Kadee makes "overset" shank couplers that would lower the knuckle and "underset" shanks that would raise the knuckle.
I have a pair of Atlas Gold RS-3s and the couplers are fine on both. There's not much wiggle room but can you get a Kadee #211 shim under the box?
https://kadee.com/htmbord/page211.htm
Atlas_RS3_draftgear by Edmund, on Flickr
Atlas_coupler by Edmund, on Flickr
You might have to file a little out of the pilot opening. There must have been a run of these engines with a different truck bolster height or maybe the shell doesn't sit down onto the frame far enough? I seem to recall an earlier thread with some modelers having the same problem.
http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/88/t/259692.aspx
Good Luck, Ed
How does one adjust the coupler height on an Atlas RS-3? Have one that both are high, one moreso than the other.
Would appreciate any helpful hints.
Thank you,