Darth Santa Fe If you can't find a gear that works, NWSL makes gears specifically for KMT drives like the one in your ALCO. I've used some, and they're better than the originals!
If you can't find a gear that works, NWSL makes gears specifically for KMT drives like the one in your ALCO. I've used some, and they're better than the originals!
Thanks! I thought that might be the case. Hafta have a look around.
Amanda
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Yay! I got the motor in my RS-2 #2 this afternoon. AND... poop. The bottom (plastic) gear on the rear truck seems to be short 3 or 4 teeth. I "might" have something around that'll work. I have a lot of plastic gears left over from odds and ends of robotic projects. Some calipereing and micrometering will be called for.
Sadly tomorrow marks the end of my precious days off. Back to the salt mines! Bleah!!!!
Amanda ;-)
Overmod Are these the shafts with the little rubber 'giubo' universal on the ends with the three little pins, like the ones in their BP-20s?
Are these the shafts with the little rubber 'giubo' universal on the ends with the three little pins, like the ones in their BP-20s?
Hey Overmod!
Yep those are the ones. Kinda tricky to get lined up but it's doable.
OvermodWhat's the minimum radius on that DES-3?
I went with a re-motor and replaced the drive shafts with ones salvaged from a Proto 2000 FA-1:
NYC_DES-3b by Edmund, on Flickr
The only thing that limits the radius is the cut-out in the frame where the gear tower passes through. My minimums, even in yard trackage is at least 28" although I do have some #5 turnouts.
The short wheelbase of the DES-3 negotiates these with ease.
NYC_DES-3_531 by Edmund, on Flickr
Cheers, Ed
I presume there are two sleeves per end, and that the intermediate shaft 'floats' between the two. Also that the swing is little enough that the sleeves don't see too much compression.
What's the minimum radius on that DES-3? Doesn't look to me to be the poster child for the kinds of radii the prototype would be expected to negotiate...
OvermodAre these the shafts with the little rubber 'giubo' universal on the ends
If it is set up anything like my DES-3 it is simply a length of 2mm steel shafting to make up the distance between motor and gear tower.
NYC_DES-3d by Edmund, on Flickr
NYC_DES-3c by Edmund, on Flickr
Silicone tubing certainly works better than the old gum-rubber sleeves that turned to crumbles after a short time.
Good Luck, Ed
Glad to be of some help for you, Amanda.
I hope your Alco is running well again, soon!
Monon Railroader I just don't remember where that small container is stashed.
Yep! Been there, done that
Regards, Ed
gmpullman Hi, Amanda I sent the two motors today. Snipped 8-< Regards, Ed
Hi, Amanda
I sent the two motors today.
Snipped 8-<
I sent the two motors today. I PMed you with the tracking number.
I forgot to put a note inside but I wanted to mention that I tested both motors and the one that runs better is the one with the green sticker on it.
Smoother, lower current draw, like 200 mA at 6V. no load.
Hope that works for you,
Monon RailroaderI might go with a can motor for the first RS. I've watched some Youtube videos on the topic. Seems a "relatively" painless process. Just figuring out a mount for it! Actually, I did think of rewinding the armature but common sense got in the way. :-)
Hi, Amanda,
Click on MY gmpullman screen name in any of the responses and a page will come up which includes "Messages".
M-R_IM-page by Edmund, on Flickr
Open that and there will be a place where you can send a private message. (Start Conversation) You may choose to include your email address or simply send your mailing address in the private message (PM)
You may have your Flickr photo setting to private. If you open your photo in Flickr, scroll toward the bottom of the page, you can change "Viewing Privacy" to public for that one photo, otherwise it is restricted to only people you have sent permission to view it.
I sent you a "PM" that you should be able to open by clicking on "Messages" in the right-hand menu.
Hey Ed, that would be great! how do I get in touch with you?
I think this link should show my motor. (Flickr seems to have changed things a bit!!!)
https://www.flickr.com/photos/188462102@N05/49905060518/in/datetaken/
Monon RailroaderOh... collector value doesn't concern me much. It's just that I'd like to have the original setup. I'm odd that way... well, probably in many other ways as well! :-)
Amanda,
I have an Alco Models H20-44 road switcher (ca. 1981) that has a Taneda can motor. While I was initially able to get some impressive slow switching out of her (0.25sMPH) after a good cleaning and re-lubing, the gear towers were very noisy and had quite a bit of slop to them; thereby making them more challenging to maintain so that it ran well reliably. After some discussion with NWSL, I'm looking at completely replacing the towers and motor and going with Stanton drives.
If it's just a simple motor replacement I wouldn't hesitate one whit to do that. You can always keep & store the original "setup" should someone be interested in it. I would be much more interested in it running well...but that's just me.
Tom
https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling
Time...It marches on...without ever turning around to see if anyone is even keeping in step.
Overmod In my opinion unless you can confirm 'collector value' in having the KMT, I'd swap it out for a modern can motor. Without seeing the specific KMT and installation, I can only refer you to places like eBay to find a compatible replacement if anyone here doesn't have one cheap. You will without a doubt want to replace the factory magnet in it with a modern NIB or similar high-strength magnet (and people here can advise how best to do that). With your other interests and skills, it might be possible for you to rewind the motor if in fact it has been fried, and get a set of agate balance rails from eBay or set up a knife-edge arrangement to poise the armature afterward. People here might weigh in on the current value of using a coreless motor as an option.
In my opinion unless you can confirm 'collector value' in having the KMT, I'd swap it out for a modern can motor.
Without seeing the specific KMT and installation, I can only refer you to places like eBay to find a compatible replacement if anyone here doesn't have one cheap. You will without a doubt want to replace the factory magnet in it with a modern NIB or similar high-strength magnet (and people here can advise how best to do that).
With your other interests and skills, it might be possible for you to rewind the motor if in fact it has been fried, and get a set of agate balance rails from eBay or set up a knife-edge arrangement to poise the armature afterward.
People here might weigh in on the current value of using a coreless motor as an option.
Hi Ed! Looks very much like those. I'll post a picture of mine. Think I have one on my phone.
People here might weigh in on the current value of using a coreless motor as an option. I've been a lover of these in models since being introduced to them (by MR) in the very early 1970s.
Monon RailroaderMy question involves the KMT motor. Does anyone have one of these they might want to part with... yeah right! :-)
Does it look like this one? From an Alco Models NYC DES-3 (the motor sits in it sideways with a bracket)
NYC_DES-3_motor by Edmund, on Flickr
NYC_DES-3_moto2 by Edmund, on Flickr
NYC_DES-3_moto3 by Edmund, on Flickr
I can get better dimensions later tonight. If this looks like your guy I have a pair you can have.
A long absence and more questions.
I've expressed my interest in the Alco RS-2. My fleet has grown somewhat. I now have 7 of the critters... 3 of the AHM variety, an Athearn RS-3 (Advertised as an RS-2, but what the heck?! :-) ) and 3 - Alco Models Brass units.
The first Brass unit had the infamous Sagami putty installation and slipping U-joints. The second was all original with a shorted KMT open frame motor (Grrr) and the third had a can motor installed. Haven't opened this one to see what was done but it seems to run well and I'm happy.
My question involves the KMT motor. Does anyone have one of these they might want to part with... yeah right! :-)
OR... is there someplace I can send the KMT to be rebuilt? Probably not cheap, but I can always ask.
Thanks for any advice!!!!!
Amanda Ward
Hi Amanda,
Glad to see you back. Are you going to use DC or DCC to run your trains? If you are using DCC many people will suggest that you don't need flywheels if you have a decent decoder and a keep alive. The flywheels won't hurt anything but if space becomes an issue you can get by without one or both.
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
I've found a motor I "think" will work in the brass beastie. It's a Proto 2000 motor, with flywheels, from the NW/SW series switchers. The RS frame and motor bracket have cleaned up nicely.
I'm pretty sure some rejiggering will be needed, but I have power tools ;-) I'm not attempting a mint restoration here... just an RS-2 that will run around pulling cars.
I'm not on a lot, cuz' there's a lot going on at the moment. I'n the process of starting a new job, building a 200 ton crane kit (Athearn #1699) and recovering from the affects of some stubborn stomach bug (Blech!)
7j43k Amanda has not responded since her post 11 days ago. Perhaps she has lost interest in model railroading. It happens. Usually not so quickly. Best wishes in your new interests, Amanda! Ed
Amanda has not responded since her post 11 days ago. Perhaps she has lost interest in model railroading. It happens. Usually not so quickly.
Best wishes in your new interests, Amanda!
Ed
Ah... no, haven't lost interest at all. Right now I have about 450 sections of track with 10 switches (and a wye), 5 crossings and a trestle set. I bypassed my current motive power problem with another (used) AHM RS-2 and a new Kato NW2.
I checked the NWSL site and found some hardware that should get the brass RS going. However, that has gone to the back burner, temporarily, with the acquisition of the NW2. (Thanks for the lead guys!!!)
My =small= layout is going to be confined to a 4 x 8 sheet of plywood. :-( I live in a 2br apartment and my roomie is "somewhat" opposed to train track all over the place. :-)
I was going to call my outfit the Monon after the Chicago, Indianapolis & Louisville, but I don't think a 4x8 spread could do the name justice. With the mish-mosh of road names on hand, I've decided on calling it the CM&MRR... Conglomerate, Merger and Monopoly Railroad!
Anyhow, I haven't abandoned the obsess... er, I mean hobby. :-)
Happy Weekending!
Darth Santa Fe The chassis in that RS-2 is definitely modified. The tower gears were replaced with Grandt Line chains and sprockets, and those will last forever, so I'd keep them if they're working smoothly. The Sagami motor is as good as anything else you'll find too, so I'd also keep that. Maybe just straighten it out if the angle is causing problems. The universals in there appear to be from Athearn, or they're the Athearn clones from A Line. Replacing those with proper fitting universals from NWSL will be a big improvement. Beyond that, I think a good cleaning and some fresh oil and grease in the gears and bearings will get this thing running nice and smooth.
The chassis in that RS-2 is definitely modified. The tower gears were replaced with Grandt Line chains and sprockets, and those will last forever, so I'd keep them if they're working smoothly. The Sagami motor is as good as anything else you'll find too, so I'd also keep that. Maybe just straighten it out if the angle is causing problems.
The universals in there appear to be from Athearn, or they're the Athearn clones from A Line. Replacing those with proper fitting universals from NWSL will be a big improvement. Beyond that, I think a good cleaning and some fresh oil and grease in the gears and bearings will get this thing running nice and smooth.
What about just replacing the trucks with "modern" items from Athearn, etc? I've got some of their RS's, and they run beautifully, even with whatever motor Athearn chose. Another source of Alco trucks would be the Atlas and P1K RS-11's. With Rapido coming out with much improved versions, these should be going for pretty cheap. I've just delivered to my local shop 4 of them to sell for whatever they can get.
I'm not having a lot of confidence in the guy who built this thing. And I wonder about the installation of the lower chain sprockets. Are THEY glued on?
hon30critter Ed, that's just what we need to encourage new people to participate in the forums! Well done. Dave
Ed, that's just what we need to encourage new people to participate in the forums! Well done.
I don't know that my comment will inspire her to begin to participate (participate: "to take part in or become involved in an activity"). Eleven days is quite awhile to not respond to people's supportive advice.
I do suppose it's possible, as Mike suggested, that she had to be off at work all this time. If so, it would have made sense to wait to ask the question until she got back and could give it proper attention.
Or she travels for work or has other obligations. Airbrushing is the only way to paint HO scale or smaller brass. In O scale, the finer spray from proper modeling rattle cans(not the hardware store cans) does an ok job on older models. Most all early HO diesel drives in brass were coffee grinders till Samhongsa in Korea developed a truck that cut noise down to Athearn blue box level, followed by Ajin that got them really quieted down. The best running early HO brass diesels I had were Tenshodo SD9's with a can motor in them, with only a single tower of noisey gears they were a bit quieter, the other truck was driven by a shaft thru the middle of the fuel tank area. Those SD's were quite heavy and pulled really well. Mike the Aspie
Silly NT's, I have Asperger's Syndrome