1988 compared to 2004 Advertisers

[Anonymous]

I love those old layout books, especially the pictures -- Dad at least in a tie and sometimes in a jacket as well working on the railroad with his crew-cut son. No wimmin around! [(-D]

[BR60103]

Speaking of ladies, do you remember the "everything runs smoother on Tru-Scale" with the cartoon of the two guys on the treadmill powered loco, and the engineer with his carousel of ladies - 30 mph, 50 mph, 80 mph and Reverse? Now that was sexist. Was it really funny?
I got an old Kalmbach layout book recently (1950s style layout building) and one page was a collection of train sets that you could start with. I was starting to notr the manufacturers who had gone, when I realized that a lot of the manufacturers and the sets were still around!

[trolleyboy]

You are right there do seem to be less companies advertising,my guess is that since everything has pretty much gone overseas productionwise. I have found and I could be wrong that the big "plastic" companies atlas,kato,lifelike etc are running like brass manufacturers small limited runs order when they are there or you miss the boat. That's the downside the upside is that we actually have more loco's and rollimg stock to choose from just less time to buy them in,oh well at least we are making more money now than in '88. Trolleyboy

[dknelson]

Hey, my MRC gold case Ampack is still powering my test track more than 40 years after I got it. And my Ulrich hoppers are as sturdy as the day they were put together
I won't argue that the new materials and techniques are all improvemements but .... We'll see how well and how long the new stuff lasts ....
Dave Nelson

[orsonroy]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Texas Zepher

QUOTE: Originally posted by orsonroy

There was more available in 1988, but the products were crap as compared to today's offerings. In 1988, we still had fiber tie flextrack, code 100 brass rail, old gold case MRC power packs, Ulrich cast metal blobs O' freight cars, many board by board wood freight car kits that may or may not actually look like any real freight car, Walthers wood passenger cars, and steam kits.

I agree there are many far superior products today, but many of those products you mention are much older than 1988. I remember things quite a bit different. I haven't seen fiber tie track in the hobby stores since 1968, PECO track was available just undiscovered by the general population, the last gold case MRC I got new was 1965, and I am certain I had a Tech II by 1981. Command control already existed and was in wide use since 1979 when MR ran a series of how to build your own. Ulrich's haydays were the 1950's and were sold to Walthers in 197x, but I have several of their war composite gondolas which I consider some of the best looking on my layout. No one has ever called them metal blobs. They have real wooden "floors". I also love the board by borad freight cars that are lingering on my layout. I wi***hey would bring them back.

Actually, you helped my point. Throughout most of the 1980s, we were stuck with great, steamy piles of older models that were still being marketed. Heck, the NMRA was still printing their cardstock car sides in the early 1980s! I recently went through a bunch of MRR mags from the 1970s-1990s looking for plans, and was amazed by what I was seeing. For example, it looks like MRC didn't stop advertising their gold case power packs unitl almost 1990!

And if you think that Ulrich GS gons look good, take a look at a Red Caboose GS, or even a Westerfield Casewell GS gon. They'll blow away the Ulrich model. And I still say that real wood generally looks horrible on models, since the grain is way too out of scale. It might "look" right to us, but it's not.

[chutton01]

QUOTE: Originally posted by cwclark

what did become of America's Hobby Center?...someone told me they got out of the train business....Chuck[:D]

They exists, an outlet in Jersey and a very small storefront in Manhattan, a block south of Penn Station. They sell trains and such at the store, but they had little railroad items online.

[Texas Zepher]

QUOTE: Originally posted by orsonroy

There was more available in 1988, but the products were crap as compared to today's offerings. In 1988, we still had fiber tie flextrack, code 100 brass rail, old gold case MRC power packs, Ulrich cast metal blobs O' freight cars, many board by board wood freight car kits that may or may not actually look like any real freight car, Walthers wood passenger cars, and steam kits.

I agree there are many far superior products today, but many of those products you mention are much older than 1988. I remember things quite a bit different. I haven't seen fiber tie track in the hobby stores since 1968, PECO track was available just undiscovered by the general population, the last gold case MRC I got new was 1965, and I am certain I had a Tech II by 1981. Command control already existed and was in wide use since 1979 when MR ran a series of how to build your own. Ulrich's haydays were the 1950's and were sold to Walthers in 197x, but I have several of their war composite gondolas which I consider some of the best looking on my layout. No one has ever called them metal blobs. They have real wooden "floors". I also love the board by borad freight cars that are lingering on my layout. I wi***hey would bring them back.

[willy6]

This might be a little off topic but i'll ask anyway, what company started HO scale model railroading and when? I want to say it was Tyco.

[cwclark]

what did become of America's Hobby Center?...someone told me they got out of the train business....Chuck[:D]

[chutton01]

QUOTE: Originally posted by dknelson

The sultry looking lady in the MR ads? Was that Patsy of Patsy's Tools ("I want to be your tool lady")?

Hmm, I believe you are correct sir.
I remember that her photo was one of the very few pictures of (real, adult) women in the magazine at the time.
Or heck, even today, for that matter.

[orsonroy]

There was more available in 1988, but the products were crap as compared to today's offerings. In 1988, we still had fiber tie flextrack, code 100 brass rail, old gold case MRC power packs, Ulrich cast metal blobs O' freight cars, many board by board wood freight car kits that may or may not actually look like any real freight car, Walthers wood passenger cars, and steam kits. High tech engines were from Atlas and Kato, same as today. Today we've got Micro Engineering flex track, code 55 to code 83 nickel silver rail, DCC, high quality plastic and resin freight car kits that are better than most prize winning NMRA contest entries, Walthers and Branchline plastic passenger cars, and RTR steam and diesel engines that blow away anything offered in the 1980s. Add the fact that the price increases have basically kept up with the rest of inflation (what did a house or car cost in the 1980s?), and we've got it pretty good now.

[dknelson]

The sultry looking lady in the MR ads? Was that Patsy of Patsy's Tools ("I want to be your tool lady")?
There was a time in the 1970s when Plastruct used a young lady in a two piece swim suit to sell their plastic parts. They never explained why.
Decades ago Fleishmann had an ad showing, I think, Blaze Starr the ... well, let's call her an entertainer ... sprawled out near an HO layout, wearing a rather flimsy outfit (ironic since Fleishmann trains were anything but flimsy -- they were built like little tanks).
For a time GEM models used celebrities to sell trains. They had Mel Torme endorsing their articulated and I seem to recall actress Ann Blythe promoting her latest movie, photographed in a rather low neckline outift and definitely sultry. But you have to be old like me to remember that one -- we're talking 1957 or so.
If it sells beer I guess it can sell trains ....

Dave Nelson

[DSchmitt]

Pecos River Brass is closing [:(]

http://www.pecosriverbrass.com/

Overland Models is alive and appears to be well [:)]

http://www.overlandmodels.com/

[Anonymous]

1988.

Bachmann Spectrum GP-30 CSX road name $55.00 complete. (I still have it, anyone want it? ) That was all the rage in the day. Tech II supposedly was the top power you could get according to MR. You were told that command control and personal computers will run your railroad someday... Little do we know then that the INTERNET IS the railroad today?

Instead of fighting thru packed Greenburg trainshows looking for that one OOP item, you can spend a few hours on EBay and find it.

Athearn Kits (Blue Box) were about $2.40- give r take a little, now some of these appoach 10.00 with prices on Ebay sometimes topping 50- for NIB Pickle tanks from Athearn.

I made $3.35 minimum wage pushing a library computer hooked into a network that was insanely fast for the day but inadequate and very very obselete today when compaired to DSL. Heck, I could run that entire County's network on THIS computer and internet connection at once.

Brass 4-8-4 in the WM paint scheme for the Western Maryland imported costs about 570- (I think.. not sure) which was WAY expensive for the day. Now at about 1250 retail it is STILL way too expensive today.

I think gasoline was about 75 cents a gallon, milk 1.50 a gallon a Atlas NICKEL silver switch was about 8 bucks against a good old brass for maybe 4 dollars.

Super detailed dioramas shown in mall is smiled and pointed at with comments of "Wow very nice choo choo..." Today's exravagant displays are followed with "Wow that took alot of money to make"

And there are folks that can take a bit of paper, pencil and a paperclip and create a award winning model for any show given enough time.

Today's models require every little componet painfully manufactored and then slowly assembled while constantly recheciking against the EXACT prototye.

And in 1988, everything was availible ALL the time. To walk into the hobby shop thru the year is to walk into a place where nothing needed to be special ordered a year ahead of time, new products were released on time and there were room in homes to actually run a pernament layout. Now we squeeze into tiny apartments and soothe each other with a 2x6 branch attached to a 4x8 foot layout.

I think I better stop here....

The best for last... a certain lionel O gauge trainset was able to be assembeled for about 200 dollars in rolling stock and about 300 for the matching engine. Today such a complete set commands 1500-2000 at a show and you had to marry into the sales man's family and raise his grandchildren before you were given the oppertunity to buy it for yourself.

Smile!

[Texas Zepher]

QUOTE: Originally posted by tatans

Was this Balls of Brass the same guy as Bob Brass in Baltimore? how about Pacific Limited, Pecos River Brass, C.C.Crow in Mukilteo? Overland, Trout Creek, etc. etc. etc. Where did they all go?

Well, I know that the owner of Trout Creek Engineering unfortunately died, shortly after he moved the company from Colorado to Arkansas. The company assets were sold, but I don't remember to whom.

[tatans]

Was this Balls of Brass the same guy as Bob Brass in Baltimore? how about Pacific Limited, Pecos River Brass, C.C.Crow in Mukilteo? Overland, Trout Creek, etc. etc. etc. Where did they all go? I guess to that old weed filled siding in the sky beside all those beautiful rusting steam locomotives, remember Chicagoland Hobby? Also take a look at the prices of an H.O. PFM U.P. 4-6-6-4 3950 crown for $867.00, now remember what you made per month in 1988???

[chutton01]

1988, eh?
I wonder if 'Balls of Brass' was still around then (and was those the ads with the rather sultry looking woman in them - forgot her name).
Also, there had to be the big 2-page spread in the front of the mag for America's Hobby Center, with all sorts of deals and cool looking (although kinda junky) stuff.
By 1988, I guess we were leaving the cheesiness of the 70s finally behind, but did we start seeing the mercenariness of the 1990s yet?

[ericsp]

There are a plethora of manufacturers that are rarely mentioned in the forum. It seems like if the company is not big and/or does not make locomotives it is not mentioned very often. Go to Walther's website and look at all of the companies they distribute.

[eastcoast]

TECHNOLOGY has come a long way since 1988.
If you look at rates and Cost of living prices have
actually not been bad. Just seems to go up when
job market is slow. Ads are pushing new advances
and gotta try to stay ahead or just fold up.
As you know, it's all set to supply and demand.
If we stop buying new technology, it goes away !!!!!

[egmurphy]

I'd venture my opinion that (at least in N scale) we're much better off today than 16 years ago. Lots more to choose from, better detail, and better performance.

There are still a lot of advertisers in the magazines, and a lot of manufacturers in the hobby. The fact that only a few manufacturer's names keep popping up here may be that people usually ask "what's the best" as opposed to asking "who are all the manufacturers".

The proliferation of e-business and web based advertising may also affect the numbers that you see in magazines. I've seen a number of guys who have small detail parts manufacturing businesses that are putting the word out on their products on different model railroading forums. They may have a small website, but may not be big enough to want to advertise in a magazine.

I'm sure you'll get some different opinions, that's just my take on it.

Regards

Ed

[tatans]

I was reading an old (1988) railway magazine and looked at the advertisers, there was about 10 manufacturers of engines, 30 makers of cars ,10 kit makers, wheel manufacturers, building kit makers, decal makers, track suppliers, makers of frogs, lost wax parts, ties, freight car parts, rails, etc.etc. this does not include hobby shops, brass importers, book suppliers and other like supplies. Compared to todays selection there only seems to be the same 5 company names whenever a product is mentioned on this forum. I realise there have been companies go under and takeovers also. I'm sure offshore sourcing is responsible for a large part. Would this not open up a gap in the model railroad business that could be filled by an American company? or I guess it's that old competing against $1.50 per day wages(if it is that much)--- Am I correct in these observations or am I not getting it? Are we better off today than back then? just a thought.