Guy,
I was thinking about it but since I'm not independently wealthy I was planning to build the market with freight and passenger equipment and invest the profits into having a loco produced. If I would go through China, as I said before, the minimum piece requirement is 1000 so in order to even think about getting this off the ground I'll need roughly 500 guaranteed sales at MSRP. Though rare, and go for a lot, you can still find EBT and ET brass locos on eBay and if you ask around on various facebook and Yahoo groups and forums. I'm sure every serious EBT modeler has at least one of the Hallmark EBT mikes.
Anyway, thanks for the good luck wishes and if this doesn't pan out numbers wise I have some other options I can look ino.
Nathan
trainnut1250 Nathan, I agree with Tom. I would start with motive power first to build your market. EBT modelers are a smaller subset of the Narrow gauge community. I'm not sure what the numbers have to be to make this viable, but I would think that modelers would be looking at motive power first. Why buy realistic rolling stock if you have nothing to pull it? (besides rare brass) Regardless, I wish you the best of luck with the project. I presume that you have asked this question in all of the HOn3/EBT narrow gauge groups?? Guy
Nathan,
I agree with Tom. I would start with motive power first to build your market. EBT modelers are a smaller subset of the Narrow gauge community. I'm not sure what the numbers have to be to make this viable, but I would think that modelers would be looking at motive power first. Why buy realistic rolling stock if you have nothing to pull it? (besides rare brass)
Regardless, I wish you the best of luck with the project. I presume that you have asked this question in all of the HOn3/EBT narrow gauge groups??
Guy
Tom, all,
The surveys didn't show up as clickabe links for some reason so you'll need to copy and paste the links.
I was also planning on using the quickpic books <http://www.quickpicbooks.com/files/EBTngbooks.html> for detailed pics.
The point is to have an RTR painted model; not one requiring extra work.
The main differences in the coaches is as follows...The roof vent placement on the ET cars was a liitle different, the EBT coaches window spacing was in groups of 3 compare to equally spaced like the the ET's, ET coach #23 had tongue and groove siding instead of board and batten, and the ET coaches had dipped equalizer trucks, like EBT combine #15, instead of the regular Laconia trucks. This is the reason I chose to have them lettered but unnumbered so the modeler can choose which model they would like to recreate. I, through the groups and forums where the surveys have been posted, have made people aware of these slight differences between the two roads.
Combines 14 and 15 are on the list. I should have put miner's coach 24 on the list instead of coach #5 but the rest of the equipment scored lower on the survey. The combine #14, #15, and miner's coach #24 would all be one offs. Now, if I go through China to have this done there would be a minimum order of 1000 pieces, now within those 1000 pieces you're allowed to have slight variatios to each car type; this is why I'm leaning towardsthe coaches and cabooses as the first models. Out of the 1000 coaches you can get 3 variations...EBT, ET, and painted unletteed. Out of the cabooses you can also get three variations...#27,#28, and painted unlettered. This way I can get 6 different cars out of 2000 pieces as compared to 6000 one offs, makes sense to me. The ET combine #15 would need to be a one off as well.
Now, all these surveys are just to gauge interest right now and there's no guarantee that any of this will happen; especially with the dismal numbers in the surveys so far.
My choices would be based on the survey results, being able to cross sell the cars, availability of drawings, and what's currently availabe on the market such as the steel boxcar.
Thanks for your two cents, I'll take it into consideration.
ACY Hi --- I didn't do the surveys because I couldn't pull them up. Don't know why. I objected to boxcar 170 because of poor information. If you do it, you may have to go to Orbisonia and spend some time with a tape measure. A friend of mine started building the old Gloor Craft kit, but found that he had to throw out and replace just about everything because when he went to Orbisonia to check details, he found that the kit didn't match the prototype closely enough. I really think the steel outside braced boxcars would be a better choice for that reason, and because they were so much more numerous. A model of 16-17-18 should probably have tender rivets. They can be sanded off by those who want a better match to number 16. The Laconia 1888 coaches (4 EBT; 4 ET&WNC) all came from the BRB&L. One would expect them to be just about identical, but their sides had significant differences. It is rare to find a photo showing more than one or two on a particular train, although I have seen WWII era photos showing several of them on one ET&WNC train. If any passenger car is offered, I think it should be Combines 14 amd/or 15, or a Miner's coach such as number 5. That way, modelers can focus on the true heart of EBT operations. For ET&WNC, the ideal passenger car is the Mail-Passenger-Baggage Combine. If the market develops, then maybe it would make sense to add the unique, less typical and numerous pieces later. Just my two cents. Tom
Hi ---
I didn't do the surveys because I couldn't pull them up. Don't know why.
I objected to boxcar 170 because of poor information. If you do it, you may have to go to Orbisonia and spend some time with a tape measure. A friend of mine started building the old Gloor Craft kit, but found that he had to throw out and replace just about everything because when he went to Orbisonia to check details, he found that the kit didn't match the prototype closely enough. I really think the steel outside braced boxcars would be a better choice for that reason, and because they were so much more numerous.
A model of 16-17-18 should probably have tender rivets. They can be sanded off by those who want a better match to number 16.
The Laconia 1888 coaches (4 EBT; 4 ET&WNC) all came from the BRB&L. One would expect them to be just about identical, but their sides had significant differences. It is rare to find a photo showing more than one or two on a particular train, although I have seen WWII era photos showing several of them on one ET&WNC train. If any passenger car is offered, I think it should be Combines 14 amd/or 15, or a Miner's coach such as number 5. That way, modelers can focus on the true heart of EBT operations. For ET&WNC, the ideal passenger car is the Mail-Passenger-Baggage Combine.
If the market develops, then maybe it would make sense to add the unique, less typical and numerous pieces later.
Just my two cents.
Tom
see stuff at: the Willoughby Line Site
Hi Tom,
Did you complete the surveys? I chose the #170 because it is a unique car and actually is currently in second place in the survey. This has not been availabe sincd offered as a shake the box caftsman klit by Qualty/Gloor Craft many many years ago. The steel outside braced boxcars are currently being produced by Funaro & Camerlango.
The rest of the models are all currently pretty close in the survey. The cabooses are a logical choice as far as production because you can split the minimum order in half by just chaning the car number. The train crews actually preferred riding in the combines because they rode a lot nicer than the cabooses and were actually used more often; especially on the mixed trains that handled the mail.
The Laconia coaches were purchased second hand from the Boston, Revere, Beach and Lynn by both the EBT and the ET&WNC. Although the ET&WNC had some slight differences the one car can be used to represent both railroads. EBT coach #8 was equipped with roller bearing trucks to be used behind the M-1 and was in use until the railroad stopped oprating at the end of the 2011 season.
Combine #14 and #15 are on the list because the train crews preferred them and they were usually seen on the back of the hopper trains and because, until the the end of the 2011 season, they were used on the torist operation. Actually #14 had been undrgoing repair for a few years and was still out of service at the end of the 2011 season. Coach #5 is on the list because it still survives today as Tweetsie #5. Combine #18 and baggage #29 areon the list because these are the two cars the FEBT recently rescued for restoration.
My plan is to start with freight and passenger equipment and then loook into locomotives. All of the freight and passenger cars can also be offered as painted unlettered because they are unique and will be perfect for freelance private road HOn3 model railroaders! The M-1 and 2-6-2 #11 are on the list because, like the Mikados, they have not been produced since the 80's and are also perfect candidates for painted unlettered versions for freelace modelers. Number 12 was the smallest, and the first Mikado purchased by the railroad, so this is a one-off model. The #14 and #15 have some slight differences when it comes to appliences,mainly the headlight, but that may be a variation allowed withing the minimum order. The 3 big Mikes were used the most during the common carrier days since they could haul more. 16, 17, and 18 were all basical the same exxcept for slght diferences in appliaces; again, mainly the headlight. #16 had a welded tender so that would make it a one off. #17 and 18 had different headlights. This may be an allowed variation within the minimum order.
ET&WNC 4-6-0's #11 and #12 would be a good candidate because it would just require a number change.
Thanks for your feedback and I hope I was able to help you better understand my reasoning for my choices at this time!
Nathan Kline
ACY EBT boxcar 170 seems an odd choice, since it is a one-of-a-kind car and several published drawings have errors (I hope you don't plan to rely on them). The EBT steel outside braced boxcars would seem to be a more sensible choice, just because there were more of them. The cabooses might be the most approprioate because there were (are) two of them, and they were used on the road's hopper trains, the lifeblood of the railroad. The passenger cars mentioned were mostly one-offs or cars that spent most of their time in storage. As much as I love the EBT, I don't think popular interest will take off unless or until a correct locomotive is available at an affordable price. My favorites are 14 and 15, but the market probably would be best served by one model that, with slight mods, can represent not two, but three engines: 16, 17, and 18. The same can be said of East Tennessee & Western North Carolina. The ideal prototype ET&WNC locos are probably 4-6-0 11 & 12 (almost twins). Tom
EBT boxcar 170 seems an odd choice, since it is a one-of-a-kind car and several published drawings have errors (I hope you don't plan to rely on them). The EBT steel outside braced boxcars would seem to be a more sensible choice, just because there were more of them.
The cabooses might be the most approprioate because there were (are) two of them, and they were used on the road's hopper trains, the lifeblood of the railroad. The passenger cars mentioned were mostly one-offs or cars that spent most of their time in storage.
As much as I love the EBT, I don't think popular interest will take off unless or until a correct locomotive is available at an affordable price. My favorites are 14 and 15, but the market probably would be best served by one model that, with slight mods, can represent not two, but three engines: 16, 17, and 18. The same can be said of East Tennessee & Western North Carolina. The ideal prototype ET&WNC locos are probably 4-6-0 11 & 12 (almost twins).
I’m looking into the possibility and cost of having RTR HOn3 EBT and other Eastern US narrow gauge prototype models, similar to Blackstone Models, produced. Pricing would be similar to Blackstone Models. I would start with one model and go from there. They would all be in the common carrier paint scheme. They would have Kadee #714 couplers. Here is a list of models I’m considering…
Caboose #27/28 Laconia Coaches #8, 9, 10, 11 (lettered unnumbered) Laconia Combine #14 Laconia Combine #15 Coach #5 Combine #18 Baggage #29 Boxcar #170
I’m just trying to judge interest right now. Please let me know how many of each model you would purchase. Please click on the link below to take you to the survey page that I setup.
PLEASE NOTE: This survey does not represent a survey for any particular model manufacturer and is solely for the purpose of gauging interest in particular models that I am considering having manufactured. Your response is in no way a commitment to purchase the model. Thank you!
<https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/C6PGRM5>
EBT locomotives... <https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/XQDD76Y>
and for the ET&WNC folks... <https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/JVDW9TL>
and painted unlettered for the freelancers... <https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/NVXLN6W>
This survey will close on October 31st at 11:45pm.
*Pictures are not mine. Please feel free to comment but also make sure to complete the survey so your answers are recorded. Thank you!