Although Walthers makes some great name trains the cost is just too steep. I looked at some of them and decided to pass them by.
I do like the Panama limited and would like a set of F units in that scheme.
I would love to see Walthers to release a Southern Pacific "Golden State" or "Sunset Limited" in HO Scale, just like they did with the first run of the "Super Chief".
Sunset Models has announced some really nice looking plastic Harrimans. Im onboard for some inSP.
SB
binder001 We could also use a Denver Zephyr for the CB&Q guys.
We could also use a Denver Zephyr for the CB&Q guys.
I think the CB&Q guys need a Twin Cities Zephyr, so it can be combined with the (Walthers) Empire Builder or the (Walthers?) North Coast Limited. And pulled by some recently announced (Walthers) Burlington E9's.
And maybe some re-released (Walthers) Burlington E7's, for those who can't find any to buy.
Ed
WE need some decent "Harriman" passenger cars, especially UP/SP types. We could also use a Denver Zephyr for the CB&Q guys.
gmpullmanI think Walthers realized that when they cancelled production of their announced E-L, NKP, MoPac, D&H and Rio Grande "Fallen Flag" series over a year ago.
I was surprised about the cancellation of the MP and RG cars! As far as I know there are quite a lot RG and MP fans out there, and the RG as well as the MP Eagle scheme are pretty popular! I was quite disappointed because I wanted to purchase some MP cars for my T&P Eagle train....
I hope they finally make the NCL in both 1946 Pine Tree and 1954 Two Tone Green versions! And along the way they could finally release MILW baggage dormitorys, Touralux sleepers, Lake sleepers and Creek sleeper lounge observations so that people can add these cars to the Twin Cities Hiawatha cars in order to model a correct Olympian Hiawatha. Although I don´t model the Northwest I would probably model these trains as in my opinion the OH is the most beautiful streamliner in terms of design while the 1954 NCL has by far the most beautiful paint scheme of all trains! But I love the Pine Tree scheme as well! A Pine Tree NCL being pullled by Athearns Z-8 Challenger would surely be a delight not only for NP fans!
fmilhaupt Somehow I managed to end up with eight of the PM-style streamlined baggage cars over the years. It'll take some imagination to explain six of them...
Charles mentioned this already, but I would second a Santa Fe Scout (1936 - 1948)...when the heavyweights wore the two tone gray paint and had Scout plaques on the cars sides.
We all know Santa Fe sells. And this is a nice excuse for Walthers to do some more heavyweight cars.
The problem for this trainset would be the locomotive. Nothing currently available in the Walthers Proto line that would work as a Santa Fe mainline steam loco. Maybe a joint Walthers-Broadway Limited Imports Scout could work.
Matt from Anaheim, CA and Bayfield, COClick Here for my model train photo website
All of the above suggestions are good.......... but not as good as: - Illinois Central "CITY OF NEW ORLEANS" - Illinois Central "PANAMA LIMITED"
All of the above suggestions are good.......... but not as good as:
- Illinois Central "CITY OF NEW ORLEANS"
- Illinois Central "PANAMA LIMITED"
I would buy both of those, but I doubt we see them because the heavywieght cars the IC converted in their own shops into streamliners aren't generic enough to use in other livery.
I do think they could sell the original consist of the City of Miami though. PS designs they could sell in other livery and it was one of the most colorful trains ever. I would buy one to run on my layout even though the City of Miami ran in chocolate brown and orange in the era I model.
Jeff White
Alma, IL
riogrande5761 It was disappointing that the Rio Grande train was cancelled. From my observations, Rio Grande has sold very well over the past 15 years so it's a puzzeler unless there isn't much demaind for 1950's/1960's Rio Grande.
It was disappointing that the Rio Grande train was cancelled. From my observations, Rio Grande has sold very well over the past 15 years so it's a puzzeler unless there isn't much demaind for 1950's/1960's Rio Grande.
-Fritz Milhaupt, Publications Editor, Pere Marquette Historical Society, Inc.http://www.pmhistsoc.org
gmpullman ATSFGuy A name train release under any of those roads would fail miserably as there is very little or no demand for it. I think Walthers realized that when they cancelled production of their announced E-L, NKP, MoPac, D&H and Rio Grande "Fallen Flag" series over a year ago. Regards, Ed
ATSFGuy A name train release under any of those roads would fail miserably as there is very little or no demand for it.
I think Walthers realized that when they cancelled production of their announced E-L, NKP, MoPac, D&H and Rio Grande "Fallen Flag" series over a year ago.
Regards, Ed
Rio Grande. The Action Road - Focus 1977-1983
PM Railfan Way ahead of ya my friend. Irrespective of Walthers version of the PERE MARQUETTE, I had long ago resided myself to doing what you said.... part it together myself. I have the E units, the baggage cars, and the coaches. I lack having the Observations, RPO's, and the diners. Looking forward to scrathbuilding those cars one day, as I pretty much knew to model this train - I would have to do. I have a pretty good start on the heavyweights too. What Id really like to get my hands on are some Palace cars! Douglas
Way ahead of ya my friend. Irrespective of Walthers version of the PERE MARQUETTE, I had long ago resided myself to doing what you said.... part it together myself.
I have the E units, the baggage cars, and the coaches. I lack having the Observations, RPO's, and the diners. Looking forward to scrathbuilding those cars one day, as I pretty much knew to model this train - I would have to do.
I have a pretty good start on the heavyweights too. What Id really like to get my hands on are some Palace cars!
Douglas
Back in the mid-1990s, I started to piece together sides for the 1946 Pere Marquette cars from pieces of Eastern Car Works sides and Evergreen corrugated siding, in kind of a riff on how Andy Harman has been piecing together a heavyweight 20th Century Limited.
Before I got too far, NKP Car Co. announced the etched sides, so I bought enough to make two trains. But given other obligations interfering with modeling time, they've sat in their boxes for about 20 years, now. Heck, I just sent one long-overdue issue of PM Tracks to the printer, but still have to finish detailing a couple of PM Mikados so I can finish the next issue (The boxy type 19RA tenders will have to be a project for another day, though).
For heavyweights, Walthers seems to have us covered on the parlors, double-window coaches and sleepers, and the Branchline single-window coach kits are mostly right for the PM (the exception being the one they numbered as an Imperial Salon car).
The baggages and baggage-RPOs are still troublesome. I found a trio of undec Rivarossi (new-style/C&NW design) baggage cars at the "A-Train" show a couple of years ago, put four-wheel trucks under them, and painted/numbered them into a fictitious series just to have some shorter baggage cars.
I've a pair of the Bethlehem diner-lounges nagging me from the shelf, since I got as far as soldering together the side layers, but, again, time to complete them has been lacking.
Somehow I managed to end up with eight of the PM-style streamlined baggage cars over the years. It'll take some imagination to explain six of them...
I think you should send them a "strongly worded email or letter" explaining how you feel about the NCL and why it needs to be released.
Until Walthers has done the North Coast Limited, the Twin Cities Zephyr and the Wabash Bluebird, they haven't even scratched the surface.
Or, putting it bluntly, I'm in for all three. As in, checkbook out and hand a-twitch.
(who is wondering if 3 Burlington E9's is REALLY enough)(is it?)
ATSFGuyA name train release under any of those roads would fail miserably as there is very little or no demand for it.
I agree with ACY that there really isn't much more that Walthers can do as far as "Big" name trains go.
As a modeler I sure wish they would make some Pre-Amtrak mid-to late sixties stuff and the "Betterment" cars that were pretty common on B&O, Pennsy, Erie and a few western roads. As pointed out, there's really no marketing "pizzaz" in promoting a "has-been" streamliner.
I think walthers has the ability to release the trains we all want, however outside of NYC, PRR, B&O, C&O, roads such as the MON, N&W, LV, CNJ, ERE, EL, RDG, and DL&W are not popular when it comes to passenger trains like the western roads are. A name train release under any of those roads would fail miserably as there is very little or no demand for it.
A name train under a western road name (outside of ATSF, SP and UP) has many options to choose from and is very salable, (even if it's a heavyweight set with lightweight streamlined cars mixed in, I've seen streamliners like that). CBQ, CNW, DRGW, MKT, MP, RI, T&P, SL-SF, GN, NP, (and MAYBE SP&S) would work if enough orders were placed and modelers showed enthusiasm.
Mheetu This might not happen how about The Canadian of CPR or The Super Continental of CNR
This might not happen how about
The Canadian of CPR
or The Super Continental of CNR
Didn't Rapido do one or both of these already???
mobilman44 All of the above suggestions are good.......... but not as good as: - Illinois Central "CITY OF NEW ORLEANS" - Illinois Central "PANAMA LIMITED" The IC played a very important roll in the development of the country's mid-section and yet is pretty much ignored by MRs and subsequently the mfgs........
The IC played a very important roll in the development of the country's mid-section and yet is pretty much ignored by MRs and subsequently the mfgs........
Well, I'm an idiot. I left these out of the equation. Sorry:(
I suspect there may not be much market left for complete large passenger trains, unless somebody can come up with some innnovation that makes previous offerings outmoded.
Any train that used a significant number of upgraded heavyweights is going to present problems of uniqueness that do not fit well with the modern model manufacturers' wish to focus on items that were fairly uniform and widely operated.
I suspect the real potential lies in individual cars that can be mixed and matched to create prototypical consists we haven't seen before. For example, quite a few 14-4 sleepers of MoPac, T&P, MKT, and SL-SF ran through to Eastern cities on PRR and B&O trains. Since 14-4's were also operated in the liveries of B&O, SR, KCS, and others, this seems like a car with market potential, some cars with smooth sides; others fluted, much like Walthers' release of B&O Plan 4167 10-6's in smooth and fluted versions.
Walthers produced a P-S Plan 4140 sleeper some time ago. The tooling must still exist. They never produced the Tuscan Red Louisville & Nashville scheme applied to the cars used in through service on the PRR's Cincinnati Limited east of Cincinnati. Westward from Cincinnati, the cars operated on L&N trains to Memphis, Louisville, and Nashville. I've looked for the decals to do the job myself, but can't find them.
Walthers has done lots of PRR sleepers, plus the twin unit diner. Unfortunately, their PRR observation car and lounge car were based on the unique Broadway Limited cars. A more usable PRR tail car would be the Plan 4134 2DR 1Cpt 1BR Buffet Obs used on the Spirit of St. Louis, Cincinnati Limited, and Liberty Limited, and named after past PRR Presidents. These trains used Plan 4086A 6 BR Bar/Lounge "... Falls" cars, which would be a great companion to the obs.
There would be no need to create a whole new train, but this type of thinking and marketing could enable modelers to create them themselves.
Tom
(edited for clarification)
You can clearly see that the striping and lettering on the EB cars in the photos above are NOT a bright yellow.
Thanks for the neat shots,
other Ed
7j43kGoing with that, it's my recollection that the green that GN used on the Empire Builder went a bit olive (browner) over time.
The green is supposed to be identical to "Pullman" green.
Get some oxidization going and add some road grime and it does indeed take on a more olive appearance. Much like the discussions about Brunswick Green, which quickly aged to much lighter shades.
riogrande5761 Ed, as you note, color can be a vexing problem - especially those colors that shift with time, exposure to sun, oxidation etc. Some are also sensitive to the temperature of the sunlight under which the photo's were taken. It may be a case like the Easops Fable: no matter how hard you try, you lose your ...
Ed, as you note, color can be a vexing problem - especially those colors that shift with time, exposure to sun, oxidation etc. Some are also sensitive to the temperature of the sunlight under which the photo's were taken. It may be a case like the Easops Fable: no matter how hard you try, you lose your ...
Going with that, it's my recollection that the green that GN used on the Empire Builder went a bit olive (browner) over time.
I suspect the best thing is to match a fresh paint job. It's usually easier to weather something than to unweather it.
The Lackawanna's Phoebe Snow, of course!
Anything that served the Southwest besides Santa Fe, We have SF covered with cars from the other 3 or 4 Chiefs they have done.
How about a Missouri Pacific Eagle to everywhere? Could have used PA's or E's. The portholes might be a problem for E7's. The Eagles that left St Louis really pretty much covered most of the Southwest and the western deep south.
An SP Sunset Limited! Would have used PA's or E's.
The MKT Frisco Texas Special! The 1952 plus version could use E8's.
And don't think there aren't model railroaders down here. I can think of over 50 layouts in the Austin area alone.
FRRYKid I saw that the North Coast Limited was mentioned. The problem with that, unfortunately, is that it had so many incarnations over the years (it was first started in 1900 IIRC), unique cars (the water-baggage car for the first semi-streamlined train [the '47 incarnation still had heavyweight cars in it] being just one) as well as enough different types of engines (various steamers, F3s, F5s [Phase IV F3s], F7s and F9s) that I don't forsee Walthers producing one of those.
I saw that the North Coast Limited was mentioned. The problem with that, unfortunately, is that it had so many incarnations over the years (it was first started in 1900 IIRC), unique cars (the water-baggage car for the first semi-streamlined train [the '47 incarnation still had heavyweight cars in it] being just one) as well as enough different types of engines (various steamers, F3s, F5s [Phase IV F3s], F7s and F9s) that I don't forsee Walthers producing one of those.
To me, there is NO question which version of the NCL Walthers would make: the one with the domes. in the colors that have become almost synonymous with Northern Pacific: Loewy.
That said, it would be wise to do BOTH diners that were used in that circumstance. And BOTH lounge cars. That way they could also span more eras AND do the earlier paint scheme.
I would expect they'd do F7's. They would do for the Loewy paint scheme AND the earlier one, though not before about 1949. But the train before then had lotsa heavyweights anyway, so doing those years is moot.
So, I'm not seeing a problem here.
I used to think I had it bad as a D&RGW fan and wrong shades of orange year in and year out, but in the past ten years maybe they stopped using original paint chips, which didn't tranlate very well to models in basement lighting, and making shades that looked "right" on the model.
wjstixThe Walthers Empire Builder cars are generally considered wrong primarily because of the shade of orange used - too dark.
Duane Buck pointed out that the orange was too red. On consideration, I agree.
I have pointed out that the yellow striping is too bright. It should be less bright and more tan.
Walthers recently did their F's in GN simplified. Sadly (for me), they went with the reddish orange so that they would match their EB cars. My sadness arises because my Empire Builder is painted in colors much closer to the prototype.
Curiously, Walthers' GN U28B looks to me to be done exactly right. I really love the look of that loco.