Hi Xterminator,
I have an article from an old MR which may help you grow a layout ... check your private messages
Also I wrote another article on a british web site http://yourmodelrailway.net/view_topic.php?id=10671&forum_id=6&highlight=sunil#p203627 which may be of help... read it in conjuntion with the MR article ... let me know
Regards from Australia
Trevor
Have fun with your trains
Take a look at the January Model Railroader. There is a good starter layout in there. The track plan (and many others) are available on this web site.
http://mrr.trains.com/how-to/track-plan-database/2015/11/ho-scale-eagle-mountain-rr
-Don (Random stuff, mostly about trains - what else? http://blerfblog.blogspot.com/)
If it hasn't been mentioned before here, you'll likely need some more switches (also called turnouts). Many of us on this forum have gone the expensive route when it comes to turnouts (Peco, Shinoharra, etc.), but you don't need to spend a lot of money on them. I own about 35 Atlas code 100 turnouts, about 1/2 to 2/3 of them I picked up at train shows, some for as little as $2-$3 a piece, in good condition, some never used at all. Also, probably about half or more of my freight car roster was purchased used at train shows and silent auctions at model RR meets. Most of these cars already come with Kaydee (knuckle) couplers on them already. BTW, I own about 300 freight cars; more than enough to use on my U-shaped, around-the-walls switching layout, which is about 20 linear feet.
Check out the micro-layouts at http://www.carendt.com/
Start out with a reliable engine from the start like a Kato, you can usually find a diesel for around $50 on e-bay. For track, Kato's track can't be beat but it is not the most relistic but it is a start and can be found cheap on e-bay also and then sold or used as yard track when you advance in the hobby, though some stay with that track as it is less work. For steam proto 2000 0-6-0 is best, going for around $75 for DCC ready.
pirate While just about everyone here is saying go for it, the fact you are asking means you really aren't sure. Since you have "fond memories of building models and dioramas," that's what I would do. Build a diorama and see how you like it, and by then you should know if you want to invest more time and money into it.
While just about everyone here is saying go for it, the fact you are asking means you really aren't sure. Since you have "fond memories of building models and dioramas," that's what I would do. Build a diorama and see how you like it, and by then you should know if you want to invest more time and money into it.
A modular layout club may be a good idea here.
Modeling the N&W freelanced at the height of their steam era in HO.
Daniel G.
IMO you can make a convincing layout on a budget. It's going to take time and you won't have all the bells and whistles of, for example, a club layout, but you can still do it. I've been doing it for 15 years.
I was. My first (and only, thanks to its poor performance) Life Like engine was a ATSF F unit from a train set. Most of it outlived the engine.
Dave,
I have little knowlege of those. I stear well clear of anything you find on the shelves of a department store or general toy store, unless I have evidence to prove otherwise that it is a good performing item. I just wanted to make sure the OP wasn't steared away from some of the highest quality trains in the hobby.
Andrew
BMMECNYC:
I agree that the Life Like P2K locomotives are good runners, but I believe that tinplatacis was referring to the older Life Like toy train set stuff that preceeded the P2Ks.
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
tinplatacisWhen it comes to locomotives, 70's-80's TYCO is no good. Ditto on Life-Like, MDC, and another brand I have had issues with but I cannot remember.
Life-like Proto 2000s are some of the best performers I own (2 SD60s, SD9, BL2, GP9, 3 E7s). They may require tune-up out of the box but on the whole they are well detailed and the above absolutely knock the socks off of anything else I own (for a comparable price.
Back to the OPs topic, getting into the hobby. The most important part in my opinion is determining what is most important to you. Everyone is different. Some are builders (build many layouts/modules in their life time) they enjoy the getting to the final product part. Some are operators, they enjoy running a layout prototypically according to the real railroad rules. Others enjoy watching a train run throught an excellently detailed scene. There are many other types, and you cant really put us all into neatly defined boxes.
The most important part is deciding what you want from the hobby. I personally enjoy running wayfreights or locals. They switch out cars at industries along the railroad line. I built several layouts that had a continous circle before I understood that. My best advice to you is to think outside of the 4x8 box. Look at the track plans on this website and others to get an idea. Do your homework first. Others suggested figuring out what your interests are, what appeals to you. Maybe right now you cant afford to build your dream layout (in time, money or space) but you could build a component section of your dream layout. Leave connections in your track plan for expansion. Make your layout semi portable (you're young like me, dont build a layout you cant take out your front door). In my case my benchwork and legs are recyclable into a new layout incase I have to move. I will definitely have to remove some track to move the layout, but most should be salvageable.
Additionally, my layout is around the walls: my television, book cases, dvd racks, magazine racks and my computer desk are all under my layout. A model train layout makes great use of blank space for storage. I am in the fortunate few who have a significant other who also enjoys the hobby.
A note about that ebay 300pcs of nickel siver track you found. In addition to the shipping cost bit, check to see what is actually included in the track. If it is a bunch of short pieces you might want to identify if the total linear length of track. If you are paying more than $2 a foot you are not getting a deal. (Atlas code 100 flex track runs between $5.50-6.25 for a 3ft piece of track). The majority of my model railroad is flextrack and turnouts, with the occaisional piece of sectional track where I needed absolute rigidity in a very short distance.
G Paine Xterminator I had been looking into it on Ebay. With Ebay deals, be sure to include the shipping cost in your eveluation; sometimes an item is priced low, but the shipping is high
Xterminator I had been looking into it on Ebay.
With Ebay deals, be sure to include the shipping cost in your eveluation; sometimes an item is priced low, but the shipping is high
Always seems like basic common sense with any purchase made. I always look at the shipping cost as part of the total cost when I decide if something is worth it or not. There have been a few cases where shipping was $10 or a bit more but I still bid because if I could win the item at or near the cost listed, the price was low enough to offset the higher shipping and make the win worth it to me.
Rio Grande. The Action Road - Focus 1977-1983
Build a 4x8 and have fun! I got back into the hobby 2 years ago (hadn't done anything with it since my early teens and Tyco train sets) and -- having a little too much space and enough funds to be stupid -- built something beyone my ability. Bad track plan, bad solder joints/connections, bad trackwork, I made a LOT of mistakes. 2 months ago I tore down that entire layout and am now starting over (oddly enough with no regrets -- more on that later).
New layout is not much smaller than the first, but I learned a lot with that first attempt, and there's nothing I could not have learned had I stuck to a 4x8 with that first try, regardless of space or funds. The most surprising thing I found is how relaxing this hobby is. There's no time limit, no real end-game, no finish line unless you impose one. Go down to the train room and mess around for awhile. Did you accomplish something? If so, great! If not, so what, tomorrow is another day. Like I said earlier, no regrets on the mistakes I made first time round, its just part of the fun. I'm sure I will make plenty of mistakes this time around, but hopefully planning and trackwork will be done to a level that they are not key problems.
These forums are a great resource. 95% of the answers you need are already here (hint: instead of using this site's search funtion, use google and search cs.trains + whatever you are looking for).
As far as cost, it is what it is, and it is what you make of it. I'm not much of a poster (this is #2, haha), but I read these forums often. And it seems most of the "too expensive" whiners want to run huge articulated steamers in a basement size layout for less budget than they pay for internet and cable every month. Stick with your current space and budget reality and you will be fine. You can always buid bigger or or move to high-end equipment later. The Broadway Lion (frequent poster her) has done amazing thing on a shoestring budget.
An side, heal fast & well, Brother Lion! I had a hip replacement this summer and feel your pain!
Lots of people get into this hobby and unfortunately, some leave it. So take it slow with the spending.
A 4x8 can be a great space saver if you put it on casters and shove it against the wall. When you want to work on the back side, roll it away. The other half of the room can be used for whatever.
Pick a road name and era and try to stick with it. It helps keep you focused and avoid buyers remorse.
Use ebay to find great deals. Lots of great running and looking equipment can be found. Buy good quality and avoid junk.
Jim
As you can see, lots of opinions on this forum - which means lots of people who want to help. I've gleened much info from here and I've been involved with model railroading for most of my life. My dad (as with many others here) got me started with his Lionel trains, and bought me my first HO train. If you can do this with your dad that would be great. Many of us are old enough to wish we could build our layouts with our dads, but unfortunately cannot.
As far as costs go, you can do much with little - but as many have said, make sure your trackwork is well done. I've put a lot of time into an N-scale layout that has poor trackwork - and that is not fun.
Model railroading is an excellent hobby - no matter what size layout you start with. I encourage you to follow some of the great advice you've received here and keep exploring.
Xterminator,
First, a big .
I, will, (regrettably possibly) counter something posted earlier:
If your current locomotive can be made to operate smoothly, keep it. Many of us started with "cheap" Life-like, Tyco, Bachmann, etc... equipment. If a cleaning and tune-up makes it run smoothly, use it. You will save some money this way. Nothing is wrong with that.
Once you decide to upgrade, you can, but do not feel you must right away if it can perform reliably and smoothly.
Same could be said of the track, clean and polish properly, replace rail joiners as needed, and if it operates smoothly and reliably, there is nothing wrong with saving money that way either.
What I will emphasize however: Smooth and reliable performance. This is not an area you want to compromise on. The "fun" factor goes away very quickly when reliable and smooth operation is missing.
Once you have smooth, reliable equipment, it does not matter if that equipment cost you $5 or $5000. It will bring more enjoyment than a $30000 paperweight.
Ricky W.
HO scale Proto-freelancer.
My Railroad rules:
1: It's my railroad, my rules.
2: It's for having fun and enjoyment.
3: Any objections, consult above rules.
XterminatorI had been looking into it on Ebay.
There is lots of track plans on the Model Railroader site; you may have to be a subsciber to access them however
http://mrr.trains.com/how-to/track-plan-database
http://mrr.trains.com/track-planning-operation
George In Midcoast Maine, 'bout halfway up the Rockland branch
Xterminator First of all, I would like to thank everyone for their replies and input, I'm amazed by how many people chimmed in and how willing to help you all are. :) I have already learned some new things and gained some ideas based off of people's suggestions.In response to the few people who questioned my intentions when making the thread to begin with, I want to clarify some stuff: I didn't make the thread to have people make the decision for me because as you stated, pretty much everyone here will be at least a bit biased. Really I was just looking for information and viewpoints/experiences from people who have had experience with the hobby, because I have very little knowledge of it as a whole. Now to just clarify a couple things I neglected to mention in the original post... I live in Colorado, however at the moment I am living kind of in the middle of nowhere so unfortunately train shows or clubs are out of question right now. As for finding deals though I have looked on ebay quite a bit and spotted several good deals (or at least what I think is a good deal) on some things. Also, I'm in my early 20s so eyesight and precision aren't a problem right now. I'm actually pretty inexperienced in this realm so right now I'm just trying to learn as much as I can before I decide to jump in or not, hence this thread. :pIn terms of budget, I'm pretty limited but can spread out the purchasing of things over time as people have suggested. I also have access to a lot of the actual materials for things because my dad does tons of carpentry/electric work etc and I live near by. In fact I'm hoping to perhaps start this up with him, but that remains to be seen. HahaAny other info or opinions or anything is greatly appreciated! Also any info or tips you can on the pricing of things would be very helpful because I'm not actually sure what really is a good deal or not at this point. I saw someone mentioned code 100 track, and in fact I had been looking into it on Ebay. Is a lot of like 300 pieces of code 100, nickel silver track at like $50 a good deal or no?Anyways thanks again everyone, I look forward to participating on these forums since I find the hobby fascinating regardless of my decision. Oh, one last thing. How exactly do I tell the difference between a toy train loco/rolling stock and none? I saw some brands mentioned, but don't those brands make non-toy things as well, or do they not?P.S.Yes the Sante Fe locos are diesel, and the powered one works "okay" but I think the wheels or track need cleaning for it work properly. The track does have just black plastic roadbed, and personally I'm not a fan of it, I prefer the look of the track without it.
First of all, I would like to thank everyone for their replies and input, I'm amazed by how many people chimmed in and how willing to help you all are. :) I have already learned some new things and gained some ideas based off of people's suggestions.In response to the few people who questioned my intentions when making the thread to begin with, I want to clarify some stuff: I didn't make the thread to have people make the decision for me because as you stated, pretty much everyone here will be at least a bit biased. Really I was just looking for information and viewpoints/experiences from people who have had experience with the hobby, because I have very little knowledge of it as a whole. Now to just clarify a couple things I neglected to mention in the original post... I live in Colorado, however at the moment I am living kind of in the middle of nowhere so unfortunately train shows or clubs are out of question right now. As for finding deals though I have looked on ebay quite a bit and spotted several good deals (or at least what I think is a good deal) on some things. Also, I'm in my early 20s so eyesight and precision aren't a problem right now. I'm actually pretty inexperienced in this realm so right now I'm just trying to learn as much as I can before I decide to jump in or not, hence this thread. :pIn terms of budget, I'm pretty limited but can spread out the purchasing of things over time as people have suggested. I also have access to a lot of the actual materials for things because my dad does tons of carpentry/electric work etc and I live near by. In fact I'm hoping to perhaps start this up with him, but that remains to be seen. HahaAny other info or opinions or anything is greatly appreciated! Also any info or tips you can on the pricing of things would be very helpful because I'm not actually sure what really is a good deal or not at this point. I saw someone mentioned code 100 track, and in fact I had been looking into it on Ebay. Is a lot of like 300 pieces of code 100, nickel silver track at like $50 a good deal or no?Anyways thanks again everyone, I look forward to participating on these forums since I find the hobby fascinating regardless of my decision. Oh, one last thing. How exactly do I tell the difference between a toy train loco/rolling stock and none? I saw some brands mentioned, but don't those brands make non-toy things as well, or do they not?P.S.Yes the Sante Fe locos are diesel, and the powered one works "okay" but I think the wheels or track need cleaning for it work properly. The track does have just black plastic roadbed, and personally I'm not a fan of it, I prefer the look of the track without it.
When it comes to locomotives, 70's-80's TYCO is no good. Ditto on Life-Like, MDC, and another brand I have had issues with but I cannot remember. In terms of cars, they are all fine in my opinion, but you might find that some wheelsets might need to be replaced for better operation. If you are interested in operation and looks over detailing of the models, as before I am tempted to steer you in the direction hi-rail modeling if you build a 4'-8'. However, I saw that some peeps had pointed out that if it is a spare room, an around the walls would work better, in which case HO is excellent. If you are an empire builder, however, either HO or an On30" industrial layout (logging or mining being the first that come to mind) would work better, as there is more potential in building models on that end of the spectrum.
Something that has not been mentioned is that one of the best ways to keep costs down is prototype/era discipline. If (and its' a big if) you can indentify what it is about model railroading that interests you it can be a big help. A lot of money can be wasted buying one of everything that catches your eye. That can be a way to enjoy the hobby but if your funds and space (and time) are limited, buying things that fit into a cohesive whole can really help with the overall budget. Reading and planning at this stage to try and identify what really attracts you to trains is time very well spent. As an example, if what you like is tunnel motors through Moffat Tunnel, then purchasing a wooden caboose does not further your goal. Setting up a 4 x 8 starter layout does not need this kind of goal setting but the sooner you can move in a specific direction the more it helps in keeping you going in the hobby.
Perhaps ask yourself what is it about this hobby you're most interested in seeking. Some might disagree, but the size of the layout really doesn't matter. What matters far more is flawless execution of the trackwork and the layout. Some enjoy having a train go around in circles. Others, like replicating a realistic operation of trains picking up or dropping off cars. Still other esteemed colleagues prefer something in between or totally different.
Reading on the forums, getting books, and talking to people are great ways of getitng into this hobby. I too was quite hesitant to start this hobby after worrying that it was a time and money sink. Instead, you can go quite far in this hobby cheaply without the layout looking toy-like.
Feel free to contact me privately and I can see about helping further. You might decide to build a layout and discover a novel way of doing something. Goodness knows that's happened to me. Whatever joy you get from this hobby, those who see your work will get more.
mobilman44 Well, may I add........... I find it "odd" that one would seek others input concerning whether they should enter a hobby or pasttime.
Well, may I add........... I find it "odd" that one would seek others input concerning whether they should enter a hobby or pasttime.
Honestly I do not find it odd at all. A little research might keep one from "buyers remorse". While I can't speak for others, I can attest to the fact that my wife and I have both made investments into hobby (jewelry making, scrap booking, woodworking) supplies that are quite literally collecting dust...
Cheap or expensive matters not, if one does not feel as though they have gotten something out of the investment, than one will not feel that investment was wise.
As for advice, I agree that asking those who have a passion for the hobby in question may result in a rather biased response, but I would say the responses so far have been rather good. I too would advise the following:
Find a train show - this gives you the oppurtunity to see both cost and quality, and may help solidify your intrest in things like scale or prototype.
Purchase the following; x-acto knife, styrene cement, tweezers, nail files (the double sided foam backed kind), small screwdriver set, one basic freight car kit (for instance in HO Accurail, Bowser, and Atlas Trainman have basic kits), and one basic building kit (in HO the Atlas signal tower is what I usually recommend)
Purchasing a beginer's book tailored to your chosen scale is a good investment, but you can also check online for how-to videos, some of which are very well done.
Now give it a try! Even if your intention ends up being the use of all "ready to run", you will still need the basic skills that building a couple of basic kits can give you. If the model railroad bug bites, that's great! You can look into purchasing a train set, or putting together a set yourself. But if you find this hobby's not for you, no harm no foul. You are only out the cost of two kits and maybe one book. The tools can always be used elsewhere.
mobilman44 If I am going to get into something, the main drive would be my want to do so - and not from the encouragement or discouragement of others.
If I am going to get into something, the main drive would be my want to do so - and not from the encouragement or discouragement of others.
I wholeheartedly agree with this, and would suggest the OP keep this in mind as they make their decision.
No matter what, HAVE FUN! Thats what ALL hobbies are supposed to be about!
EDIT: Just to be clear, I am aware of the fact the OP already has model building experience. The advice above is what I give anyone who asks me how to get started in model railroading.
Chris Ballinger
Modeling the Clementon Branch of the Pennsylvania-Reading Seashore Lines in HO scale
Xterminator, whether you get into the hobby will probably depend on how much time you have to devote to it and your state of health and mind. For me, its a great retirement outlet for creativity and many of the skills I have picked up over the years. Like others I built craftsmen car kits and some structures when I first got into the hobby and my kids were really small. Along came kids sports and more job demands and the model stuff all went into storage for roughly 40 yrs. When I retired from general contracting I was ready to get back into the hobby. I have limited financial resources so model railroading is a budget hobby for me. Hand laying all track and scratch building all switches which I find fun and rewarding. Spend as you have extra funds and have fun.
The comments about visiting a club or train show are good advise. Highly recommend at least trying to go to a local NMRA event. Most are held monthly. Regions are not to large so it is feasible to attend a meeing in a day without having to pay for a motel room.
Good luck on your decision. Everyone needs some type of hobby.
Well, may I add........... I find it "odd" that one would seek others input concerning whether they should enter a hobby or pasttime. If I am going to get into something, the main drive would be my want to do so - and not from the encouragement or discouragement of others.
If the OP is interested in pursuing the hobby, then get some how to mags and go to it. He will soon find out if it is for him or not.
ENJOY !
Mobilman44
Living in southeast Texas, formerly modeling the "postwar" Santa Fe and Illinois Central
Kind of a strange thread, in my opinion. Of course we are all going to encourage participation in the hobby since we are model railroaders. And, now we are backing into forbidden territory - - a discussion of the high cost of the hobby, or not.
If the OP wants an objective, unbiased opinion on whether to enter the hobby, he might be best advised to inquire elsewhere. Now, I am sure that some will disagree with my stance on this, but if I were in that position, I would be more inclined to talk to friends about their hobbies and whether they are costly, whether they hold their interest, whether they have any regrets.
Rich
Alton Junction
IRONROOSTER Well the bad news is that a 4x8 fully decked out will cost over $1000. The good news is that you can spread the cost way out over time. <snip> Good luck Paul
Well the bad news is that a 4x8 fully decked out will cost over $1000. The good news is that you can spread the cost way out over time.
<snip>
Good luck
Paul
Now don't go freaking the guy out. Good grief!
For what it's worth, I built the basic benchwork for my 10x18' layout between $300-400 - that includes wood, legs, drywall screws, sub-roadbed and homasote. It's got two levels on one side to include staging. I mean a sheet of 7/16" OSB is only $8 at home depot - homasote $26. Of course it doesn't have to be packed with expensive buildings and stuff. so it doesn't have to be bad news. Use Atlas turnouts to and flex to keep costs down or get track at train shows and Ebay - doesn't have to be anywhere near 1 grand for a simple 4x8. Just sayin ...