Trains.com

Subscriber & Member Login

Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more!

question on roundhouse design

1670 views
9 replies
1 rating 2 rating 3 rating 4 rating 5 rating
  • Member since
    August 2003
  • From: Collinwood, Ohio, USA
  • 16,367 posts
Posted by gmpullman on Monday, August 31, 2015 6:55 PM

Here's a few grab shots of my setup. I think I recall hearing the term "garden tracks" too, as Tom mentioned.

I had the nine stall roundhouse but room for more track so I decided on this for visual interest. Right now the "rotary" is there so, as mentioned, the boiler can be kept hot ready for a quick fire-up when needed. With "house" steam available, the blower could be used to make a good draft and a fire could be hot and ready in less than an hour. Many engines had a pipe connection at the smokebox to feed steam to the blower (venturi jet) which would induce the draft through the grates.

As the other Ed mentioned, the girders make a great way to mount light fixtures, too. These are made from Walthers conveyor parts.

There's really no problem running steam and water lines outdoors. The plant I work in has (or had) thousands of feet of steam, water and chemical lines running all over, mostly above ground. Heat trace, in the form of copper tubing usually 3/8" or 1/2" would be wrapped tight against the pipe then insulation and a metal jacket was placed over that. Today there's electric heat trace but back then we ran miles of copper. There would invariably be lines that would freeze but we would just get out the steam hose and start thawing.

Mike points out that not all roundhouses had these outdoor tracks and space constraints played a role. I have seen many overhead views of roundhouses and by the 1940s many had been expanded with extra stalls that there wasn't enough room for any outdoor tracks. The NYC's Collinwood roundhouse had been added on to about five times, with each addition being longer to accommodate the growing size of the locomotives.

Fun Stuff! Ed

  • Member since
    May 2004
  • 7,500 posts
Posted by 7j43k on Monday, August 31, 2015 5:40 PM

Howard Zane

 I will have attachments for all three....steam, air and power. 

Well, there's electrical power for tools, which will show up mostly as outlets on the posts about 4 feet off the ground.

BUT.

There's a real opportunity to put up some lighting!  At least, if there's a swing shift at the shop.

 

 

 

Ed

  • Member since
    July 2006
  • 685 posts
Posted by Howard Zane on Monday, August 31, 2015 5:19 PM

Hey folks,

Many thanks! I now know how to model these structures. I will have attachments for all three....steam, air and power. I know they are not mandatory, but they sure add quite a bit to the overall scene.

HZ

Howard Zane
  • Member since
    August 2013
  • 3,006 posts
Posted by ACY Tom on Monday, August 31, 2015 4:33 PM

I've heard the open radial tracks called "garden tracks".  The terminology may have varied from RR to RR, just as there was a lot of variety in names for that little red (usually) car at the end of a train.  I agree the pipes are steam lines, but you don't see them at every roundhouse location.  Apparently a lot of roads used steam lines inside the roundhouse only, or closer to the ground.  First time I saw them modeled was in photos by a modeler in the S.F. Bay area.  Might have been Paul Jansen(?), ca. early 1960's.

Tom 

  • Member since
    July 2006
  • From: Chamberlain, ME
  • 5,084 posts
Posted by G Paine on Monday, August 31, 2015 2:41 PM

mlehman
It also made it possible to slope the line so when shut down, the condensate in it would either drain back toward the boiler plant or outward to a draincock.

The steam lines would have to slope a bit anyway; if it is saturated steam, there would usually be a bit of condensate due to heat loss to the enviromemt. Even with superheat, there could be some condensation when the line is idle - think of the steam cocks on the cylinders of a locomotive.

There would be a tee with a bit of verticle pipe, then a steam trap. A steam trap is kind of a thermal valve that allows condensate to go to a drain system without loss of steam pressure. It also lowers the pressure from steam pressure to atmospheric pressure. The condensate could be collected and pumped back to the shop boiler or allowed to go to a storm drain or sewer. Pumping back is best so a lot of energy (heat) and boiler feedwater is not lost.

George In Midcoast Maine, 'bout halfway up the Rockland branch 

  • Member since
    September 2003
  • 10,582 posts
Posted by mlehman on Monday, August 31, 2015 12:06 PM

Yes, the pole stucture was for steam and air. Water would be underground, if available, in most areas to protect from freezing.

Steam lines expand and contract a bit, so putting them up on poles helped deal with that. It also made it possible to slope the line so when shut down, the condensate in it would either drain back toward the boiler plant or outward to a draincock.

John Allen modeled this arrangement, so you can check the many pics of his roundhouses available to see how it was done.

Not all roundhouses would have this. Depended on how much space under roof vs need, a need for running repairs that could be accomplished outside, etc.

BTW, I see the term fan tracks being used. I use "finger tracks" myself. Both could well be right or I could just be wrong. Anyone know more or any other terms for them?

Mike Lehman

Urbana, IL

  • Member since
    January 2004
  • From: Canada, eh?
  • 13,375 posts
Posted by doctorwayne on Monday, August 31, 2015 11:03 AM

I think that Ed's got it right - steam lines for pre-heating boilers from a stationary steam plant.

Wayne

  • Member since
    August 2003
  • From: Collinwood, Ohio, USA
  • 16,367 posts
Posted by gmpullman on Monday, August 31, 2015 11:00 AM

Howard Zane
Is is  for air, sand, electricity or whatever?

I modeled this at my roundhouse. There was a name associated with this setup, like gallery tracks or something to that effect. Piping and utilities were supported on girders spanning the radial tracks.

Essentially it was an area where locomotives could be quickly serviced that didn't need much attention and they could be sent back to the ready tracks and on to an outbound train that much faster.

I don't believe there was any sand available but air, steam and water for sure. Often when a fire was dumped the engine (boiler) was connected to the house steam line to keep pressure and heat at the ready.

I'll try to get a photo of my setup posted soon...

Ed

 

  • Member since
    May 2004
  • 4,115 posts
Posted by tatans on Monday, August 31, 2015 11:00 AM

If you notice photos of OLD tuntables you will see electrical cables to the top of the tower, this sends power to the motors that turn the table, remember, the table is turning so how do you send power on a spinning platform, the pivot point remains stationary on top of the tower, also, not all turntables had these towers, how power was transferred to the table is a mystery.

  • Member since
    July 2006
  • 685 posts
question on roundhouse design
Posted by Howard Zane on Monday, August 31, 2015 9:42 AM

Folks,

I could use some help. I'm kind of embarrased that after all of these years in the hobby, I don't know the answer............

I have installed several rounhouses with turntables on my pike. I have seen in photos along and over the outer perimeters of fan tracks, a structure than consists of vertical beams with overhead lintels or beams. I can build these easily, but I have no idea of the function. Is is  for air, sand, electricity or whatever?

Help will be greatly appreciated.

Many thanks,

HZ

Howard Zane

Subscriber & Member Login

Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more!

Users Online

There are no community member online

Search the Community

ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT
Model Railroader Newsletter See all
Sign up for our FREE e-newsletter and get model railroad news in your inbox!