Upgrading my rolling stock to new Kadee 58 couplers

[Anonymous]

Does anyone have any advice for someone who is finally taking his childhood HO scale trains and rebuilding a new layout as a grown up!
All of my rolling stock is from the 70's and 80's and has the old style couplers between the cars. I have just purchased a new locomotive AC4400 by KATO and found that the couplers are scale now. It was suggested to me to buy kadee 58's to convert my stock but I am finding this is not an easy task.
Any suggestions, comments [?]
Thanks
Ray

[Anonymous]

Hi Ray, I would suggest a visit to your Local Hobby Shop. Bring along one each of the different brands or types of your cars.Your dealer can help you select the correct coupler for the cars you have. Kadee couplers come in many variations. The part that attached to the car body is where you will find the biggest differences. Kadee makes their couplers with a variety of special shanks to fit into most brands of mass produced HO cars produced in last 40 years. The other diffference is in the offset height of the coupler grip itself, relative to the shank. These height variations allow you end up with correct coupler height, from the rail head, regardless of the car being a bit higher or lower overall. Kadee used to have a booklet that described all the variations and shank details for typical coupler mounting pockets on different brands of cars. I am sure that they still offe something in the way of comprehensive instructions. Some modelers grind/cut away the factory coupler mounting pocket system, and mount a new pocket from Kadee on the carbody. If you are starting with cars that have couplers mounted on the trucks, you may choose to do this, as well as remove the old pocket from the trucks. I model in On3, thats O scale, 3 foot narrow gauge ,and use both Kadee On3 couplers, AND several of the HO couplers, which are a bit smaller. In O finescale , and On3 we have far fewer options for easy coupler mountings. HO scale is the best in this regard.

This project is a perfect one to illustrate the value of developing a good relationship with the folks at your local hobby shop, and also for joining a club that has some 'old timers' that have 'been there-done that'.

GOOD LUCK on your new layout project too.

Jennifer

[Anonymous]

Ray,

58's rock!!! I can't see why everyone isn't using them. Question: What are your old cars equipped with now? If we are talking horn hooks, then I would look carefully at which cars in the bunch you want to upgrade...

Keep in mind that 58's are mean't to be a more prototypical, better looking replacement for the classic #5's. Depending on the age and brand of your old stuff, 5's should easily fit in the old coupler pockets, this means 58's will fit in these cars as well. If you have lots of 5's already, 58's will work with them just fine. As for truck mounted couplers: Jennifer is right about all ofd the different styles KayDee makes to fit these. My question would be : How much do you like the car. The new stuff out there is great and it might not be worth the effort to convert old cars unless they have sentimental value or are something you can't get in a new version.

You will also need a coupler height gauge and a few other items would be nice to have: graphite coupler grease, trip pin pliers and maybe a some coupler spring tweezers. Kaydee couplers work great and are well worth the time and expense to set up.

Guy

[rexhea]

Ray,
If you have a new Walthers catalog, page 263-266 has a Kadee coupler conversion list that has many manufacturers and their products listed. Jennifer has the best suggestion, but this might give you some idea.

REX

[mcouvillion]

Hi Ray,

If you are just getting started converting to knuckle couplers, by all means consider the prototypical size #58s. The #5s are a little large but have many years of proven performance. You might try a few cars equipped with #5s and a few with #58s to see if there is a functional difference (or rather preference) on your part. The #58s may be a tad harder to operate.

I don't have any #58s 'cause I have #5s on too much rolling stock to want to change, but if I was just starting, .... I'd probably go with the 58s.

Mark C.

[ckape]

I personally don't see upgrading from regular Kadees to 58s to be worth the hassle, but it sounds like you've got horn-hook couplers, which I would definitely suggest replacing.

The main suggestion I've got is to look into getting McHenry couplers, they offer scale couplers as well, but they've got bulk packs, whch seems like it might be convenient in your case, and they've got the built-in centering spring, so you don't have to worry about that extra component when installing your couplers. The possible downside is that the McHenry couplers are plastic instead of metal, which means they might not be as durable, but I've never run into problems with them.

[mcouvillion]

ckape,

I've tried the McHenrys, the Accumates, the whatever-else-is-out-there, and the most dependable I have found are the KaDees. I was thrilled when the McHenrys were introduced because of the built-in centering spring. Since I weight my cars, they can hit pretty hard when coupling. After knocking the knuckles off cars while switching, I wrote to the manufacturer, and included some of the damaged couplers. They were most gracious, and they improved the design of their couplers, but they still don't hold up as well as KaDees. I decided that I did not want to have to revisit replacing couplers on my rolling stock so I pretty much stick with KaDees. I use a few of the others in specific situations, but they are the exception.

My 2 cents.

Mark C.

[novacoach]

Ray
I have Kadees universally. I have tried others but in terms of durability, reliability and switchability they are way ahead of the opposition. However I do find that I occasionally feel the need to change the few 58s I have back to 5 as the 58 seems less reliable in use and will spring apart sometimes over magnets - I have a switching layout and enjoy the operational element that KDs bring. By the way I cannot change all of the 58s because the few KD cars I have have a smaller box for the coupler

Hope this helps

Chris
modelling New England in the Old one..

[Anonymous]

http://www.nmra.org/beginner/couplers.html
http://www.kadee.com/conv/list.htm

Recommended tools.
http://www.kadee.com/htmbord/page120.htm
http://www.kadee.com/htmbord/page160.htm

MR did a review on the AC4400CW back in may 97 "Although it will go around 18" curves,
the chassis mounted couplers may cause derailments because of the swing on curves. The
AC will operate much better on 22".

What's your radius?

This particular 1997 review recommended Kadee #27 but their site for the dash 9 recommends
http://www.kadee.com/conv/pdf/k153.pdf

[cacole]

If that rolling stock is Athearn or Model Die Casting, conversion is very simply a matter of removing the old and putting in the new coupler. If the stock is Tyco, early Bachmann, or others with truck-mounted couplers, you're in for a real challenge. In some cases, I have been unable to find anything that can be done with truck-mounted couplers except to leave them on the shelf and not attempt a conversion. It's advisable to change wheels to metal as you change the couplers, too, but this can't be done on some of the models with truck-mounted couplers because they used blunt axles.

[Anonymous]

Kadees are possibly one of the best things about modelling US-outline HO scale - they look right, allow hands-off operations, and seem pretty reliable - the prices are pretty good too. I have a mix of #58s (mainly on passenger cars) and #5s - I can say that the #58s are a lot less tolerant of bad trackwork. Personally I'd stick with the #5s and other couplers as that way they will all look alike - there's no offset coupler with a scale-size knuckle as yet, so cars that need offsets will have the standard size knuckle. www.kadee.com has plenty of useful info and diagrams on fitting the couplers - what types fit which locos/cars and how to do it.

Hope this is of help!

[willy6]

I'm using #58's,without any major problems.but you cannot buy them in bulk like #5's.

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the information. I am finding that most of my old rolling stock is older TYCO and changing all the couplers might be harder than I thought. Theybare of the hook horn style right now. Thanks AgainRay

QUOTE: Originally posted by locomotive3

http://www.nmra.org/beginner/couplers.html
http://www.kadee.com/conv/list.htm

Recommended tools.
http://www.kadee.com/htmbord/page120.htm
http://www.kadee.com/htmbord/page160.htm

MR did a review on the AC4400CW back in may 97 "Although it will go around 18" curves,
the chassis mounted couplers may cause derailments because of the swing on curves. The
AC will operate much better on 22".

What's your radius?

This particular 1997 review recommended Kadee #27 but their site for the dash 9 recommends
http://www.kadee.com/conv/pdf/k153.pdf

[Anonymous]

i just finished up installing kadees on all the tyco/bachman stock i have. takes more time to do and the hardest part would be getting the placement of the coupler rght before glue dries.

might help some but a few pics of how i did all my bachman/tyco truck mounted couplers.also i used kadee #5's

first i assemble the coupler in the provided coupler boxes then glued them to the bottom of the car centered


then i cut the truck mounted coupler assembly off the truck as far back needed so there is no touching the new coupler box


after that i snap the truck back onto the car and check the coupler hieght 99.8% i manage to be right on the height. if the coupler comes out to high cut a piece of styrene and redo the glueing process repeat step till couple is right hieght. If they come out to low i have no clue how to raise the car to get a good hieght for the coupler unless you manage to screw the truck into place then u could use tiny washers.

[Anonymous]

Kadee offers washers Tallerin mentions in two sizes to give you the option of raising the car to adjust coupler height. .010 and .015. It's best to get both. Some of my cars only need one washer on one end. Some have needed a mix of both on both ends. Some are best fixed with the underset of overset couplers.