Sojourner wrote - "Can I ask a nooby question please...."
I do not know the answer to your question. However I would like to take the oppurtunity to invite you to Jeffries trackside diner where we talk on and off topic. Stop in and I will treat you to a cup of Joe.
YGW
Yes, I certainly appreciated that feature. Back then (I think it was the late-80s, but not certain) Life Like wanted to offer features that other model railroad manufacturers didn't have. Unfortunately the spinning fan feature on the Alco FA had its problems and, of course, didn't come on or spin in a prototype fashion.
As I mentioned above, the openable doors on the hood units had incorrect dimensions as well as oversized hinges. The openable doors on the cab units, were closer to prototype dimensions. I do remember that prototype modelers were complaining and eventually that feature was eliminated.
If Paul Cutler checks this thread, he may post more info regarding the issues.
As for me personally, I appreciate prototype detailing but am flexible. I enjoy the door features which is one reason why I'm hanging on to all of my P2K units.
basementdweller I read the comment about about running their loco with the doors open, what a great idea and very realistic. I alwayes wondered why LL bothered to have opening cab doors and spinning fans etc.
I read the comment about about running their loco with the doors open, what a great idea and very realistic. I alwayes wondered why LL bothered to have opening cab doors and spinning fans etc.
"I like my Pullman Standards & Budds in Stainless Steel flavors, thank you!"
The older Life Like came in light blue boxes with a flap that opened up, the shell and chassis were separate in the packaging. The Walthers Proto 2000 I believe say "Walthers" on the box.
I would not pay any more than $60 for a Life Like P2K GP7. Bear in mind it could have the old cracked gears, an easy fix but test run it first. BB Athearn axles are a drop in replacement. Also bear in mind the older LL locos have a little more involved in switching them to DCC. No more work than an old Athean but not a plug and play loco either. I would haggle down the price some.
Can I ask a nooby question please. Does the box have to say Walthers on it, or just Proto 2000? I was looking at a GP7 in my train store and it seemed very reasonably priced ($60) for a new unit. Seeing some of the other prices has me wondering though.
AntonioFP45 Just remembered something that is "pesky" about the LL E units...... Any of you ever lose a bearing cap ot two on the trucks? Any solutions for replacing them? BTW: Joe, just curious. Couldn't you have replaced the motor with a Mashima unit?
Just remembered something that is "pesky" about the LL E units......
Any of you ever lose a bearing cap ot two on the trucks? Any solutions for replacing them?
BTW: Joe, just curious. Couldn't you have replaced the motor with a Mashima unit?
A few years ago I bought an LL E8 that was missing a a couple of bearing caps. LL replaced with no charge. Perhaps Walthers will at least sell you the parts.
Dante
I don't know of any sources. I bought an undec e8 and use it for parts. Find one that's not too expensive.
There is a considerable difference in weight. The Walthers proto units are much lighter.
AntonioFP45BTW: Joe, just curious. Couldn't you have replaced the motor with a Mashima unit?
I considered that but it also had some bad gears and I was considering the end result. I also wanted to try a new unit with the helical cut gears, which is a big improvement. The new chassis also has an area over each truck for speaker placement which was perfect for the Titan decoder to emulate the dual motors of the E unit.
Darth,
Interesting point. On the E-units is the weight difference between the Walthers P2K and LL P2K significantly noticeable? To me, my LL E-units feel like miniature bricks when I pick them up. Explains why they can pull long trains.
I don't own any Walthers P2K units, but would like at least one (better yet, a few shells that can be adapted to the LL P2K drives would do nicely for me!).
Darth Santa Fe ....................................a lot of manufacturers are sacrificing weight for big speakers and electronics. If they're going to keep doing that, they should start making the bodies themselves metal and forget the internal weights.
....................................a lot of manufacturers are sacrificing weight for big speakers and electronics. If they're going to keep doing that, they should start making the bodies themselves metal and forget the internal weights.
My P2K E7 is a pretty smooth and hefty runner, but it's also a bit older. The only electronics inside are on a small board in back, and they operate the gyralight in front, which is an interesting 2-filament bulb that alternates back and forth. Dual 1" flywheels!
I've noticed a lot of manufacturers are sacrificing weight for big speakers and electronics. If they're going to keep doing that, they should start making the bodies themselves metal and forget the internal weights.
_________________________________________________________________
I not a big fan of the PK 2 E-7 and 8's because of the low gear set and they have half the pulling power of the E-6's that I started with. I have one E-7 with sound and it is a lite weight when it comes to pulling.
I loved my old E-6's but the trucks where a pain in the Caboose to work on!
Cuda Ken
I hate Rust
Ken, I had an E unit that started to make a racket and found that in addition to cracked gears it also had a motor that was going bad. So I headed to the LHS and found them to be out of the pieces to re-motor and repair the unit. After some counseling from the dealer I came upon the conclusion to re-body the unit into a new Walthers/Proto Chassis. (they do not have much SP stuff in North Carolina). I installed a QSI Titan decoder and now I have a great, quiet locomotive with front and rear sounding engines. I'll rebuild the old one when parts come in but for now the new units are great. I used the QSI Programmer to set up the decoder.
Hope this helps, Joe
AntonioFP45 I'm aware of the issue of the inaccurate nose contour of the E7/8/9 that, understandably, bothers some modelers. Although I consider myself a prototype modeler the nose discrepancy doesn't really leap out at me, especially once a unit is detailed and weathered.
I'm aware of the issue of the inaccurate nose contour of the E7/8/9 that, understandably, bothers some modelers. Although I consider myself a prototype modeler the nose discrepancy doesn't really leap out at me, especially once a unit is detailed and weathered.
The more I look at photos of EMD E and F units, including photos I have taken myself, or see the prototypes "live," the more I start to wonder if there really was "a" bulldog nose contour. There have been almost as many versions of modeled EMD nose contours as there have been models, and while surely they cannot all be correct I do have my doubts about some of the grand pronouncements that this or that model gets it wrong.
Dave Nelson
CudaKen,
I'm so glad and grateful to see your post!
Like you, I have a sizable fleet of Life Like Proto 2000 locomotives, including 11 E-units. The E's are heavy smooth runners and pull long trains with ease. I'm aware of the issue regarding the inaccurate nose contour of the E7/8/9 that, understandably, bothers some modelers. Although I consider myself a prototype modeler the nose discrepancy doesn't really leap out at me, especially once a unit is detailed and weathered. Performance wise, I actually like the higher gear ratios on the older LL E's since it allows them to reach 90+smph speeds (like the prototypes).
My SCL hood units run well (although several did need their axles replaced). To the bane of some prototype modelers I like the openable cab doors. In Florida, back in the 70s, some SCL engine crews operating slow locals tended to leave the doors propped open due to the humid weather in the summer. I enjoy imitataing that feature and the door dimensions being off by a scale 2" or so also does not bother me. However, the windshield wipers are noticeably thick so I will replace them as each unit gets serviced.
I have no plans to sell or trade any of my LL P2Ks. All units will be DCC /sound equipped (Loksound).
With the above said, the new Walthers P2K diesels are beautiful, smooth runners and I wouldn't hesitate purchasing units if finances permit it. I do wonder about the E-units since they're geared lower than the LL versions and, from what I've read, can only reach a top speed of approximately 60smph. SCL long distance passenger trains were still running 80mph speeds right up to the beginning of Amtrak.
cudaken I swear by and at my Protos! Most of my Protos run pretty quite, but a few are racket makers. Mainly my SD 7's and 8's. Have a couple GP 30's and one like to hum to me. My PA's and E units are very quite. Now that Walthers own's the Proto Name, are they better or the same as when Life Like made them? My LHS still has a lot of the LL Protos, but they have ran out of road names I want. Thanks in advance for the coming answers, Cuda Ken
I swear by and at my Protos! Most of my Protos run pretty quite, but a few are racket makers. Mainly my SD 7's and 8's. Have a couple GP 30's and one like to hum to me. My PA's and E units are very quite.
Now that Walthers own's the Proto Name, are they better or the same as when Life Like made them?
My LHS still has a lot of the LL Protos, but they have ran out of road names I want.
Thanks in advance for the coming answers, Cuda Ken
I enjoy running Proto 2000 power. The GP30, GP20, GP7/9 and SD9 are my favorites.
Have replaced all the original wheelset gears. What a pain!
Great lookers and nice runners. They are fussy, as far as needing lube jobs.
The newer Walthers are an improvement. They should be for the price.
Non Profit Train Video Review Information.
William
Main thing I wondering about is the motors. My SD 7's, 8's and GP 30's motors are copys of the old style Athearn motors and they are the ones that are loud. My Proto 1000 use a can motor, and while quiet I have about 4 of there motors go bad. I do run them a lot and pull long trains so I cannot complain.
My PA's on the other hand sill run great and have a lot of track time.
Thanks for the answers folks.
Ken
I have 6 Walthers/Proto F-7s with sound. Good locos, the new gears are the schiznitz. You'll probably never have a problem with them. They run well and quiet AFAIK considering they do make sound. I'm not a fan of programming the QSI decoders in them, but they do sound pretty good.
Mike Lehman
Urbana, IL
Give Walthers credit for trying to keep available replacement wheels for both the E units and the GPs, BL2 etc from the original LifeLike P2K line that often suffered from cracked gears and noise. Last I looked 920-584494 for the E units and 920-585508 for Geeps and BL2s were in stock.
LOL Larry ! No its pipe is cracked !
Sorry Ken. Had to chime in couldnt pass that one up.
cudaken Have a couple GP 30's and one like to hum to me.
But,can it carry a tune?
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
Walthers has completely redesigned the drive mechanism and now uses a helical gear on the axles, so the Athearn gears no longer fit the newer models.
Cracked axle gears that plagued the LifeLife P2K models should be something that you will no longer have to be concerned with.
The shells seem to have more detail added, too; and you can get them with sound.