mlehmanI was trying to think of when all my CRS could come up with was "1950"
Mike
Funny how that CRS creeps up on you. Prety soon I will be able to hide and hunt my own Easter eggs. I just wish I can forget the crap I don't want to remember.
Sorry to the OP but I had to laugh at the CRS.
Pete
I pray every day I break even, Cause I can really use the money!
I started with nothing and still have most of it left!
doctorwayneActually, the Southern Railway was a big proponent of 36' cars, and between 1922 and 1926, they took delivery of almost 15,000 such cars when most roads were ordering 40'-ers. The SU-class cars had four truss rods and steel underframes, and lasted until after WWII, when scrapping began in earnest, although some were still running in the '50s on shortlines. I built one using an MDC reefer as the starting point:
Nice model, Wayne.
In fact, these Southern cars were the ones I was trying to think of when all my CRS could come up with was "1950" for a rough cut-off point when these cars went from revenue to rarities. I think I remember reading an article in one of the mags about the Southern cars and how they were the last class of 36' cars commonly encountered, truss rods and all, right through WWII into the postwar period. Can't remember where it was, but it was a long time ago (late 1970s-1980s?)
Mike Lehman
Urbana, IL
cjcrescentMany RR's had 36'-40' wooden boxcars in service in the 1930's. Most of these got worn out during the traffic demands of WWII. By the end of the 1940's, the vast majority of these cars had been scrapped and were being replaced by steel 40 & 50' cars.
Actually, the Southern Railway was a big proponent of 36' cars, and between 1922 and 1926, they took delivery of almost 15,000 such cars when most roads were ordering 40'-ers. The SU-class cars had four truss rods and steel underframes, and lasted until after WWII, when scrapping began in earnest, although some were still running in the '50s on shortlines.I built one using an MDC reefer as the starting point:
Another popular 36' car was the Dominion Fowler single sheathed boxcar. Canadian Pacific began acquiring them in 1908, and between 1909 and 1915 ran the total to over 33,000, while Canadian National (and its predecessor roads) accounted for another almost 17,000. In all, over 75,000 were produced for use in both Canada and the United States. CP and CN used theirs at least well into the '50s, and with that many cars in service, they would have been seen regularly within the U.S.Here's a modified version of the Proto1000 model:
Wayne
Another 1943 shot of the C&NW rip tracks. The cars in the back with the big white X on them had loads of amunition. A short time later they realized that the big X was a target for saboturs.
http://www.shorpy.com/node/2696?size=_original#caption
Sorry for the incorect location of the previous picture. It is Bensenville yards outside of Chicago.
Here is a 1943 picture of Proviso yards. Notice a steal 36 foot L&N box car. Also notice the different roofs of the reefers.
http://www.shorpy.com/node/6969?size=_original#caption
36 ft cars were built less after 1900, but the cars continued in service for a couple decades. A few lasted in revenue service into the 1940's or 1950's with rebuilt steel underframes. Between 1890 and 1900 they were the "standard" length of a boxcar and then between 1900 and 1910 they fell out of favor and construction transitioned to 40 ft cars.
The superstructures would have lasted about 20 years or so and as those that were in need of heavy repairs came in many roads retired them rather than rebuild an obsolete car. That would mean that the cars built in the 1900 era would start falling out around 1920-1930. The requirement for steel underframes would have killed off many of the early cars that survived.
Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com
With the geat merger of 1906 that created the Pacific Fruit Express a massive fleet of 36 foot reefers from numerous private operators were also conveyed, due to a variety of factors they were quickly stricken from the roster with several ancient relics from the days when Central Pacific owned and operated reefers being re-sold to the SP for company ice service, one example survived in this restricted capacity until worn out the early fifties.
Dave
Thanks guys. That helps a lot to answer my questions. The reason this came up in the first place was because I have several undated black and white photos in one of my old train books showing 36' reefer and box cars mixed into the consists of various trains. I own a few of these cars and wanted to make sure of the era they were from before I added them to any of my trains. I like being correct about such things if you know what I mean.
Yep, the 36' boxcar was obsolete (despite the NH) at the start of WWII, but persisted largely because of the Great Depression's effects on industry. War demands wore out the remainder. Although likely not extinct, there were very few left after the war and probably all gone by 1950 due to replacements finally catching up with need.
As others have mentioned, 36' meat reefers remained common and probably were only finally gone when icing ended in the early 70s(? I know this depends on routes and destinations) although I'd say show the pic to prove they were still around that late. Early 60s definitely, though.
A 40' reefer would probably have less than 36' inside length, probably closer to 32', between wall thickness, ice bunker, and the grating separating it from the load space.
Good point on non-revenue reuse of these cars persisting longer. The reefers usually made good ice cars for MOW gangs, although I'm not so sure about old meat reefers. That might make your ice water taste funny...
Many RR's had 36'-40' wooden boxcars in service in the 1930's. Most of these got worn out during the traffic demands of WWII. By the end of the 1940's, the vast majority of these cars had been scrapped and were being replaced by steel 40 & 50' cars.
The SRR had thousands of the Murphy, or Murphy styled boxcars that were wholesale replaced after the war. Several hundred were used as MOW cars into the late 1950's. On some RR's they lasted even longer. I remember that about 2x a year up until the late 1970's, early 1980's a L&N work train would come to Selma, Al, my hometown, and there were bunk cars builts out of old wooden boxcars in that train, and they still had archbar trucks on a couple of cars.
Carey
Keep it between the Rails
Alabama Central Homepage
Nara member #128
NMRA &SER Life member
In 1940 most of New Havens boxcars were 36' wooden ones and they had 17,000 boxcars at the time!
Depending on the railroad, some are proubly still in use. Most don't know that the billboard reffers were still around in the 60's, though very rare and not in interchange buisness unless captive and very upgraded. Last date for interchange on theses was 1938.
Depends what you mean. Construction of new 36' cars lasted from about 1890 to the 1910's. By the early 1920's most new boxcars were 40' long, although like the earlier 36' cars they were normally 8-1/2' high. The 40' long - 10' high "standard" boxcar didn't come along until 1936 or so.
Freight cars with archbar trucks and without steel underframes (that is, wood underframing and trussrods) were banned from interchange service in the 1930's. Many 36' boxcars at that time were old enough that it wasn't worth the work to add steel underframes and change the trucks, so I'm sure many were scrapped then. (Plus of course, railroads needed fewer cars during the Depression years, and tended to use their newest cars - since those cars were still being paid for.)
I know the DM&IR had 36' cars in on-line-only service into the 1950's or even 1960's. But seeing a 36' boxcar after WW2 was pretty rare.
For reefers, I know some meat packing plants were built with door openings spaced to serve strings of reefers at a time. Since many of these plants were built 100+ years ago, they generally had doors spaced for 36' (or 38' ?) cars. Because of that, shorter than 40' reefers were used in meat service into the 1950's or 1960's.
[quote user="Tracklayer"]
Hi gang. Could anyone please tell me when 36' box cars and reefers were phased out by the railroads. I've done a little research but so far haven't come up with much more than just the histories of the cars but not when they were retired. Thanks.
Tracklayer
Around 1900 they were being phased out. Don't remember an exact date to no longer being used in freight operation. Probably MOW use for a while.
Rich
If you ever fall over in public, pick yourself up and say “sorry it’s been a while since I inhabited a body.” And just walk away.
Sometimes 36' reefers are called that because of their INTERNAL dimensions. Externally, they're the same length as a 40' boxcar. Sometimes.
Ed