ATLANTIC CENTRAL The more I learned about trains, the more I became interested in the older ones, not the ones I saw every day.
The more I learned about trains, the more I became interested in the older ones, not the ones I saw every day.
To some degree, that has been the case with me too. I started out buying and modeling pretty much 1980-1995 time frame as that was freshest in my mind and memory. As I've gotten some nice color books and video's on the D&RGW, I pushed back my modeling interests well into the 70's and even succumbed to some stuff as old as 1965, which I've deemed my absolute earliest cutoff. I've sold off nearly everything later than 1990 also. So to some rate, I've become interested in older stuff than what I freshly remember. Even the 1970's memories of the SP in Davis and crossing the causeway to old Sacramento are pretty vague and fuzzy. So in a way, my back dating is a lessor extreme of what you did, and a great deal of it is based on my books and video's, not first hand experiences.
I do have an acquaintance who I knew when I was in graduate school who was of similar age, maybe slightly younger, who decided to model the D&RGW in 1953 - way before either of us were born. It does happen. He was in the unique position of having the finances to afford the brass required to truly model the D&RGW in 1953. Basically there is virtually no correct steam in plastic; the only correct steam were really 2nd hand engines like the UP Challengers and ex-N&W - no proper D&RGW steam. Anyhoo....
Yes, it sure sounds like you have seen enough steam to know what it is about. Strasburg has one very special aspect that is key to its unique atmosphere - it is not a "museum", it is not a "non profit" preservation group, it is not a government park - it is a for profit privately held commerical enterprise that moves freight as well as its "tourist" passengers. It does not just run on "special occasions" or week ends, etc - it runs every day of the week for most of the year, all day long. Durig the busiest season, regularly scheduled steam trains pass other regularly scheduled steam trains 4-5 times a day - that does not happen anywhere else in the country any more - maybe in the world. So, Strasburg, maybe more than any other steam preservation operation, shows us what day to day steam railroading was like. Trains run every hour, on the hour, all day long - and every half hour in the busy season.
So, Strasburg, maybe more than any other steam preservation operation, shows us what day to day steam railroading was like. Trains run every hour, on the hour, all day long - and every half hour in the busy season.
I mentioned Sacramento 1991 because what I experienced was probably like Strasburg on steroids due to the fact that Rail Fair 91 was going on - not the norm for the Sacramento museum. That's why I provided the you tube link so you could see it wasn't just a static museum experience. The thing with Rail Fair at the Sacramento RR Museum that I went to in 1991 is it wasn't just a "static" museum. There was something like 20 steam engines all operating and a few of them you could ride behind. Maybe it wasn't "day to day" operations, but there was a large number of steam engines in operation including western steam!
Anyhow, my wife currently works in a job where she gets no vacation, but hopefully one day we will get up there and see it while we are in the area. Some day I'd like to move back west but that won't be for a few years.
Rio Grande. The Action Road - Focus 1977-1983
ATLANTIC CENTRAL Kyle Did Bachmann ask you if you wanted a different locomotive, or did they just send you another one with a note? I am surprised they didn't send you your old one back too, don't know what they would do with it. Kyle, typically the service department will call or Email you to let you know they do not have a direct replacement. They generally give a choice of serval locos of equal or greater value to choose from, based on what they have in stock at the time. In my case, I sent in several new old stock defective doodle bugs I purchased recently, they called and offered me the new doodlebug and coach combo, in a choice of several different roadnames. My originals were unlettered and did not come with the coaches. But I recieved the new versions with the coach for no charge. Years ago with a different loco, they sent e a different roadname, and returned my old shells for me to make the swap. They do what they can based on what they have in stock at the time. Sheldon
Kyle Did Bachmann ask you if you wanted a different locomotive, or did they just send you another one with a note? I am surprised they didn't send you your old one back too, don't know what they would do with it.
Did Bachmann ask you if you wanted a different locomotive, or did they just send you another one with a note? I am surprised they didn't send you your old one back too, don't know what they would do with it.
Kyle, typically the service department will call or Email you to let you know they do not have a direct replacement. They generally give a choice of serval locos of equal or greater value to choose from, based on what they have in stock at the time.
In my case, I sent in several new old stock defective doodle bugs I purchased recently, they called and offered me the new doodlebug and coach combo, in a choice of several different roadnames. My originals were unlettered and did not come with the coaches. But I recieved the new versions with the coach for no charge.
Years ago with a different loco, they sent e a different roadname, and returned my old shells for me to make the swap.
They do what they can based on what they have in stock at the time.
Sheldon
Just to add a little to what Sheldon said, a few weeks after you send in a defective loco, Bachmann gives you a call to report on the status of your loco. Typically, they will tell you that they no longer stock the parts, so they offer you the option of choosing a replacement, as Sheldon indicated. Most often, they no longer stock the type or road name of the loco that you sent in, so you are left with the choice of selecting a different type or road name of loco or getting your old loco returned, unrepaired. Their policy is not to return the old loco if they send you a new one. As Sheldon indicates, if they have the same type of loco, only in a different road name, you are in a real dilemma. Which do you want , the old one or the new one. I never faced that dilemma because they never had the same type of loco that I had sent in for repair.
Now, all of this applies to locos that they no longer stock, locos that are out of production. If you have recently purchased a defective loco that is still in production, you will have better luck in getting your loco repaired or at least replaced with the same type of loco, if not the same road name.
The problem is parts, or lack thereof. Unlike BLI, who stocks parts for older locos, Bachmann does not.
Incidentally, back when I had to return these locos for repair, I had to send in a check for $20 in each case. That is not a big amount, so I am not complaining. There is a lifetime warranty, but it is not totally free.
In spite of all of my problems with 3 of the 7 steamers that I bought under the Bachmann Spectrum name, I am not anti-Bachmann, but I am not a big fan either. My days of purchasing steamers are over since I now much prefer passenger diesels, but given the choice I would buy a BLI before I would buy a Spectrum.
Rich
Alton Junction
richhotrain ATLANTIC CENTRAL richhotrain Sheldon, don't include me on your "Bachmann bashing" list, I said they were OK. But, I am beginning to think that you are on their payroll as Chief Apologist - - LOL Seriously, though, I go by personal experience and statistics. Proto Heritage - 3 steamers, never had a problem. BLI - 7 steamers, 2 returned for repairs, both fixed. Spectrum - 7 steamers, 3 returned for repairs, never saw them again, of the other 4, the 2-6-6-2 is fine, the 4-6-2 sucks, and I sold the remaining two because they were poor performers. What more can I say? Rich OK, a K4, 2-6-6-2 and thumper - which locos were the others? The first to go was a C&O 4-8-2 heavy mountain. The copper wipers over the drivers were bending and breaking off, causing intermittent power losses. Bachmann claimed to no longer have parts, so they kept it and sent me a replacement. Second to go was a PRR 4-6-2. I misspoke when I said that 3 were sent in, never to be seen again. This one was sent in, "repaired", and returned to me with the same problem, intermittent power losses. It remains a problem. I never it sent it back again because I was told by Bachmann that they no longer had replacement parts so they would have to send a different loco. I didn't want to give it up in that way. Third to go was Thumper, a U.P. 4-8-2 Light Mountain. This little sad sack went back and forth 3 times. On the fourth time, it got replaced with an ATSF 4-8-4 DCC On Board loco that now serves as a paper weight - - - LOL. The DCC on Board stuff is horrific, worse than Spectrum. The C&O 2-6-6-2 is a beauty. I will give Bachmann credit for that one, a Spectrum coal drag. Some day, I want to put sound in that sucker. I had an ICRR 4-8-2 heavy mountain but sold it. My other Spectrum is a DMIR 2-10-2. I must concede that I have not had problems with it. I think that it is a DCC On Board. It replaced the faulty C&O 4-8-2. Rich
ATLANTIC CENTRAL richhotrain Sheldon, don't include me on your "Bachmann bashing" list, I said they were OK. But, I am beginning to think that you are on their payroll as Chief Apologist - - LOL Seriously, though, I go by personal experience and statistics. Proto Heritage - 3 steamers, never had a problem. BLI - 7 steamers, 2 returned for repairs, both fixed. Spectrum - 7 steamers, 3 returned for repairs, never saw them again, of the other 4, the 2-6-6-2 is fine, the 4-6-2 sucks, and I sold the remaining two because they were poor performers. What more can I say? Rich OK, a K4, 2-6-6-2 and thumper - which locos were the others?
richhotrain Sheldon, don't include me on your "Bachmann bashing" list, I said they were OK. But, I am beginning to think that you are on their payroll as Chief Apologist - - LOL Seriously, though, I go by personal experience and statistics. Proto Heritage - 3 steamers, never had a problem. BLI - 7 steamers, 2 returned for repairs, both fixed. Spectrum - 7 steamers, 3 returned for repairs, never saw them again, of the other 4, the 2-6-6-2 is fine, the 4-6-2 sucks, and I sold the remaining two because they were poor performers. What more can I say? Rich
Sheldon, don't include me on your "Bachmann bashing" list, I said they were OK.
But, I am beginning to think that you are on their payroll as Chief Apologist - - LOL
Seriously, though, I go by personal experience and statistics.
Proto Heritage - 3 steamers, never had a problem.
BLI - 7 steamers, 2 returned for repairs, both fixed.
Spectrum - 7 steamers, 3 returned for repairs, never saw them again, of the other 4, the 2-6-6-2 is fine, the 4-6-2 sucks, and I sold the remaining two because they were poor performers.
What more can I say?
OK, a K4, 2-6-6-2 and thumper - which locos were the others?
The first to go was a C&O 4-8-2 heavy mountain. The copper wipers over the drivers were bending and breaking off, causing intermittent power losses. Bachmann claimed to no longer have parts, so they kept it and sent me a replacement.
Second to go was a PRR 4-6-2. I misspoke when I said that 3 were sent in, never to be seen again. This one was sent in, "repaired", and returned to me with the same problem, intermittent power losses. It remains a problem. I never it sent it back again because I was told by Bachmann that they no longer had replacement parts so they would have to send a different loco. I didn't want to give it up in that way.
Third to go was Thumper, a U.P. 4-8-2 Light Mountain. This little sad sack went back and forth 3 times. On the fourth time, it got replaced with an ATSF 4-8-4 DCC On Board loco that now serves as a paper weight - - - LOL. The DCC on Board stuff is horrific, worse than Spectrum.
The C&O 2-6-6-2 is a beauty. I will give Bachmann credit for that one, a Spectrum coal drag. Some day, I want to put sound in that sucker.
I had an ICRR 4-8-2 heavy mountain but sold it.
My other Spectrum is a DMIR 2-10-2. I must concede that I have not had problems with it. I think that it is a DCC On Board. It replaced the faulty C&O 4-8-2.
riogrande5761 I was born in 1959, but didn't start paying attention specifically until I was probably around 9 or 10, which was 1970 or early 70's. At that time I was an Air Force kid living at Travis Air Force Base and the SP mainline traveled past a farm where we stabled a family horse outside the base. From then on it was all SP SD45's, tunnel motors and SD9's in my world.
I was born in 1959, but didn't start paying attention specifically until I was probably around 9 or 10, which was 1970 or early 70's. At that time I was an Air Force kid living at Travis Air Force Base and the SP mainline traveled past a farm where we stabled a family horse outside the base. From then on it was all SP SD45's, tunnel motors and SD9's in my world.
Well I am only two years older than you, and I had the good fortune to have my father build me my first layout at age 10. Pretty big for my age - two 5x9 platforms in an L shape with grades, tunnels, hidden staging, etc. And I started working in the local hobby shop at age 13, joined a well known club at age 15.
Yes, it sure sounds like you have seen enough steam to know what it is about. Strasburg has one very special aspect that is key to its unique atmosphere - it is not a "museum", it is not a "non profit" preservation group, it is not a government park - it is a for profit privately held commerical enterprise that moves freight as well as its "tourist" passengers. It does not just run on "special occasions" or week ends, etc - it runs every day of the week for most of the year, all day long. Durig the busiest season, regularly scheduled steam trains pass other regularly scheduled steam trains 4-5 times a day - that does not happen anywhere else in the country any more - maybe in the world.
And, I like diesels too, but again I am most interested in 1st generation diesels - the one that "did it", the ones that replaced steam.
On my layout, it is 1954, the newest locos are a pair of "brand new" SD9's.
Nice comparing thoughts,
ATLANTIC CENTRALFor me, I am interested in learning about what happened in the world before I got here - I model a time period three years before I was born. I remember trains in the 80's - they bore me silly. I never saw a steam loco in regular service, but they sure do interest me.
As I get older, I find history more and more interesting. But for trains, what I grew up seeing in my teens and twenties, those are what I got all jazzed about. I found them anything but boring - and that seems true for most rail-fans in my lifetime; they enjoy watching real trains that are before their eyes, not trains from picture books or video's before they were born.
Have you been to any place like Strasburg or Cass and watched a real one in operation? You are right down in Virginia right? You should drive up here one day and I will take to Strasburg - where you can watch a regularly scheduled steam train run all day long, every day of the week, for 10 months out of the year. Sheldon
I haven't been to Strasburg but had an experience probably similar at the Sacramento Railway Museum in 1991 - but probably many more steam engines than Strasburg; many steam engines came to Sacramento for that rail fair including from England, and the east coast, and of course UP steam engines.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UlqS3XtbToI
I've seen any number of steam engines in operation since I was a teen in the late 1970's. I got to see the Southern Pacific GS-4 first in Sacramento in 1976 when it pulled the Freedom Train, then a few years later back in Daylight colors when it passed through my home town of Davis California (just west of Sacramento) twice. Mentioned Rail fair 1991. When I was a graduate student in Indiana University I had an opportunity to ride behind the Nickel Plate steam engine from Bloomington Indiana out west to the Tulip trestle and back.
Maybe its hard to imagine if you get to experience it in person why would you not want to model it? We like what we like. I'm 54 and pretty much set in my ways. The "gospel" of steam has been preached to me many times but I didn't convert, although it was very cool to see it in person - they are living breathing beasts but modeling? No. Another reason I don't want to model steam is I don't care for the freight cars steam pulled, I much prefer 70's and 80's freight cars - that's the other major thing that keeps me away from steam; 3rdly it is much more expensive as a rule. I think one of the only reasons I'd want just one steam engine would be to entertain people who come to watch my trains run! How bad is that!
Well I've strayed well off topic long enough. I'm happy for others that Bachmann has improved their game. There are two brands I don't have anything from 1) Bachmann and 2) MTH.
Geared Steam richhotrain Sheldon, doesn;t the sight of Thumper just tug at your heart strings? Rich *a moment of silence please
richhotrain Sheldon, doesn;t the sight of Thumper just tug at your heart strings? Rich
Sheldon, doesn;t the sight of Thumper just tug at your heart strings?
*a moment of silence please
Thank you, GS, for that sign of respect. Thumper would have liked you, beard and all.
"The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination."-Albert Einstein
http://gearedsteam.blogspot.com/
I just always assumed that it was a faulty design. What say you?
Well, personally I would not call it "faulty", but I have nine of them, as well as other Bachmann locos with similar designs, that all work fine for me.
I will admit it is not the most "robust" design. And, I am first to admit that maybe some people need robust, and that generally I don't because I have always seen HO model trains as just that - small, delicate, operating scale models that require careful handling.
And I have seen a wiper or two come out of the box not perefectly positioned - and I have seen some loco owners plop them down on the track and drag them around to put them on the rails in such a way as to insure the wipers would get bent up.
The real irony is that now Bachmann does have a lot of those parts for sale to the consumer to do your own repairs. I don't know how many repairs they choose to do anymore, I know the replacement thing is their main approach to the warranty.
But I think Bachmann locos are no different than your observation about BLI in a recent thread - if it is good out of the box, it's a winner. If not, may not be worth trying to fix and may always be a dud.
But the biggest irony of all is that four of my six BLI steamers now have Bachmann tenders behind them - and in every case it made them run better - getting rid of the decoder and improving pickup.
Here is a photo of my beloved Thumper in its funeral coffin, although I did not realize it as I sent it in to Bachmann. I hope they gave it a proper burial.
ATLANTIC CENTRAL Rich, Why did you dump the ICRR Heavy Mountain?
Rich,
Why did you dump the ICRR Heavy Mountain?
I sold it on eBay. To be honest, it ran fine, but I was trying to slim down my stable of steamers and felt that the road name was out of place on my layout.
ATLANTIC CENTRAL I have to ask, how did the wipers on the Heavy Mountain get out of wack in the first place? There are folks who complain about that design, but I have never had any problems with my nine Heavy Mountains regarding the wipers. And those nine locos, 3 C&O, 6 Unlettered (ATLANTIC CENTRAL), are among the smoothest running locos I own.
I have to ask, how did the wipers on the Heavy Mountain get out of wack in the first place? There are folks who complain about that design, but I have never had any problems with my nine Heavy Mountains regarding the wipers. And those nine locos, 3 C&O, 6 Unlettered (ATLANTIC CENTRAL), are among the smoothest running locos I own.
I cannot answer that question, Sheldon, I just don't know.
I had bought that Heavy Mountain way back in 2004. I first noticed the poor performance called Bachmann. They told me to disconnect the harness from the tender and turn the loco over and carefully inspect the copper wipers. One was bent out of position, and one was missing. At the time, I did nothing about it. When the performance problems got worse, I re-examined the copper wipers and another one was completely mangled, so I sent it in for repairs. Bachmann called me and said that they no longer stocked parts, so pick another one which I did. That was my first experience under the lifetime warranty of gettting a replacement loco different than the one I had sent in. The obvious question is, did I damage the copper wipers? Dunno. I mean, I never played with them, so I cannot say that it was my fault. I just always assumed that it was a faulty design. What say you?
Early production K4, yes its a problem child, get one of the newer ones or get a BLI K4.
Light Mountain - poor thumper - generally those were good locos - its just a shame they did not have another one like it to send you.
The ATSF 4-8-4, again something I would not own, but the newest version of that is much improved over what they sent you.
The 2-10-2's are Spectrum, "DCC on Board" is just their marketing for everything that is DCC but no sound. I have three of the2-10-2's, one did need a few "adjustments", and I added weight to them, but they run nice as well.
As do all the ones you have not tried, 2-8-0, 4-6-0, 2-8-8-4 EM-1, 2-8-4 Berkshire, and I know lots of people with the geared locos, shays, etc, they all love them and have had no or minimal problems.
Rich, one more question, which BLI locos do you own?
And yes, my 4 Proto steamers have been perfect as well.
Well I have to agree about the PRR K4 as also being one of Bachmanns dogs, especially the early production ones. I have never seen a Bachmann J or K4 run really GREAT right out of the box, but, since neither one is a loco I want, no problem for me. I have however seen several modelers make excelent runner out of them with very little work.
As for the ones they could not repair or replace, I understand that too, but I must admit, that my answer is to just buy another one and "convert" whatever repalcement they sent into cash - but I have only had to do that once or twice in 30 locos.
And, as we have discussed at length, I am inclined to just fix minor problems - on any brand - rather than return them. But on that count, Bachmann has done better than BLI for me.
ATLANTIC CENTRAL I remember trains in the 80's - they bore me silly. I never saw a steam loco in regular service, but they sure do interest me.
I was a kid in the 60's, not long after the last of the steam locos were pulled from service. Back then they moved retired quite a few to local parks and I got to "play engineer" on them (it was long before today's safety-conscious society). And that was my introduction to railroad locomotives. I don't think that I ever actually saw a real, full-size steam loco run until I visited the Nevada Northern in Ely a few months ago and then took the full jump to actually operating one. It was actually strange sitting in that same seat almost 50 years later. Eerily familiar though how everything actually worked was all-new to me.
I am fascinated by steam locos, and Bachmann has a good selection of them. Based on what I have seen Bachmann would probably not be my first choice for a good diesel. But considering how cheap they were I am happy with the FA2 and FB2 that I bought- good bang for the buck.
Huntington Junction - Freelance based on the B&O and C&O in coal country before the merger... doing it my way. Now working on phase 3. - Walt
For photos and more: http://www.wkhobbies.com/model-railroad/
Jim,
Complelely agreed, which supports what I have been saying for years, rather than Bachmann bashing, or Genesis Bashing, or BLI praising, EACH product should be judged on its own merrits with little or no concern for the name brand on the end of the box.
If its detail level, build quality, price point, features, prototype, etc, fit your wants - buy it - most of it comes from the same list of factories anyway - just remember - for a long time Bachmann's parent made Atlas locos.........
As to your lack of interest in steam, I understand. Some people are attracted to history, to the past. Others are attached to the here and now, or only to their own personal history and experiances.
For me, I am interested in learning about what happened in the world before I got here - I model a time period three years before I was born. I remember trains in the 80's - they bore me silly. I never saw a steam loco in regular service, but they sure do interest me.
Have you been to any place like Strasburg or Cass and watched a real one in operation? You are right down in Virginia right? You should drive up here one day and I will take to Strasburg - where you can watch a regularly scheduled steam train run all day long, every day of the week, for 10 months out of the year.
ATLANTIC CENTRAL A couple of observations: While Bachmann products have improved dramaticly across their entire product line, their most "serious modeler" oriented products are still Spectrum steam locomotives.
A couple of observations:
While Bachmann products have improved dramaticly across their entire product line, their most "serious modeler" oriented products are still Spectrum steam locomotives.
It has always been like that - the Bachmann Spectrum steamers nearly always got good reviews in the magazines. The Bachmann diesels were routinely dinged. People here in the forums like to bash the Bachmann bashers, but they should know the magazines took Bachmann to task regularly in the reviews - so the reputation was pretty universal. Bachmann diesels for years and years were poor quality both in running and basic dimensional fidelity. The Plus and Spectrum diesel lines were marginal attempts to improve the diesel line and fell far short. Only in recent years has the diesel line shown substantial improvement - which seems to be mainly to the chassis and paint jobs - AFAIK, the shells are still the same. I acknowledge that I've noticed the better looking diesels, and if there was anything in my 70's and 80's profile, I'd give it a look. As I mentioned, they did the GP40 but the graphic on the side looked wrong and I don't need any really.
riogrande5761, I understand that few of their offerings are in your area of interest. For me, I have the same problem with Broadway, Atlas, Kato and others - very little of their loco offerings are in my era or are models I need or want - that fact does not detract from the quality of those products....... I'm a 1954 kind of guy, so that leaves out a whole buch of stuff from a lot of companies........ The only Bachmann diesels I have are the GE 44 and 70 tonners, and the doodlebugs. Other Bachmann diesels are either not in my era, or are not detailed to the levels I prefer, or are not offered unlettered to allow easy painting and lettering for the ATLANTIC CENTRAL - so I choose other brands, mostly Proto2000, Intermoutain, and Genesis, when it comes to diesels. That too does not detract from the vast improvements Bachmann has made to both the detail and running quality of their diesels. I simply will pay a little more for a little more detail. I like Bachmann, I think they do a great job and provide a great value. That does not mean every product they make is something I would choose. Same is true of many other companies. Sheldon
I understand that few of their offerings are in your area of interest. For me, I have the same problem with Broadway, Atlas, Kato and others - very little of their loco offerings are in my era or are models I need or want - that fact does not detract from the quality of those products.......
I'm a 1954 kind of guy, so that leaves out a whole buch of stuff from a lot of companies........
The only Bachmann diesels I have are the GE 44 and 70 tonners, and the doodlebugs. Other Bachmann diesels are either not in my era, or are not detailed to the levels I prefer, or are not offered unlettered to allow easy painting and lettering for the ATLANTIC CENTRAL - so I choose other brands, mostly Proto2000, Intermoutain, and Genesis, when it comes to diesels. That too does not detract from the vast improvements Bachmann has made to both the detail and running quality of their diesels. I simply will pay a little more for a little more detail.
I like Bachmann, I think they do a great job and provide a great value. That does not mean every product they make is something I would choose. Same is true of many other companies.
Right, and it didn't escape me that the majority of this discussion is about steam. Which is well, off topic for me and rather foreign. I keep telling myself some day I will get steamer just to have one but the years keep going by and it hasn't happened.
Jim
richhotrain Bachmann Spectrum steamers are OK, but I would take BLI or Proto Heritage over Spectrum any day. The Spectrum line is overrated by some, namely Sheldon - - - LOL. Rich
Bachmann Spectrum steamers are OK, but I would take BLI or Proto Heritage over Spectrum any day.
The Spectrum line is overrated by some, namely Sheldon - - - LOL.
I realize you may just be poking fun to some degree, but again I would submit that it is unfair to judge a whole product line based on one bad experiance.
I don't judge BLI based on my TWO crappy Mikados I had to rebuild. In fact I would tend to say that BLI production quality is generally equal to Bachmann Spectrum. I still buy BLI locos, even if it only the few that interest me.
My complaint with BLI is not quality, despite the two mikes, but my complaint with them is prices, no DC versions, saying you will make X and it never shows up, OR, in the case of the Pacifics, just going with a generic model after years of promising a proto correct one.
So what makes a BLI Pacific any better than a Bachmann 2-8-0 that is should cost so much more? Nothing that I can see. Both are generic with no road specific detailing, both have been offered with sound, both run good and pull well.
I really love my BLI N&W Class A 2-6-6-4, but if I am honest, every one of my Spectrum locos has better, and finer details. Same holds true for my BLI/PCM Reading 4-8-4's.
OK, Bachmann has made some dogs - the N&W J is a problem child, bad tracking, weak motors, not enough weight, goofy drawbar system, etc - but that is just a few product items in whole line over the last 20 years.
OK, all these companies make duds that get through to the customers - your thumper and my mikados - so what?
I still say BLI skimps on fine prototype detail to pay for sound and then charges too much - not being into sound that sends me in other directions. So does the fact that most BLI locos are the big famous monsters, not everyday medium sized locos - and here is the rub on that - the two "everyday" locos BLI did decide to make, are generic, lower detail, molding on piping, one size fits every roadname models - the Mikado and Pacfic - I still bought them.
But my $100 Bachmann regular line Berkshires are better detailed and run just as well as my $200 BLI Heavy Pacifics and Mikados.
As for Proto2000 steamers, except maybe in the pulling power department, they are a cut above the rest in detail and smooth running - no question about it. BUT how many locos have they offered? Only 5 in 15 years? I'm not restircting my modeling to that selection any more than I would restirct my diesel choices to what KATO has made in HO.
I have fleet of over 30 Bachmann steam locos, they all look good and run good, and the fleet has a dollar cost average purchase price under $150 per loco - more bang for the buck.
My six BLI/PCM steam locos have a dollar cost average price of $225 per loco, and they don't look or run one bit better as a group.
Rich, as much as we have conversed, on and off the public side of this forum, I still don't really know what your prototype interests are? And so Bachmann's other offerings may not be in your area of interest, but trust me, they are a great value for the most part. And for a modeler like me who like to kit bash, freelance and personalize, they are a gold mine of opertunities.
There are currently about 6-8 more Spectrum locos on my shopping list - only one BLI loco on my shopping list..........
csxns Looking at the photos of the new Bachmann ES44AC and SD 70's heritage NS i am thinking different about Bachmann's and if they look that good i will get me some of them.
Looking at the photos of the new Bachmann ES44AC and SD 70's heritage NS i am thinking different about Bachmann's and if they look that good i will get me some of them.
Want to go back 40 years to molded on grabs, poor truck details, giant handrails? I don't so I won't buy and based on the gearing of most of their locomotives they will not be compatable with any of my Proto's, Athearn or Kato units.
I will pay more to get a QUALITY unit!
Rick J
Rule 1: This is my railroad.
Rule 2: I make the rules.
Rule 3: Illuminating discussion of prototype history, equipment and operating practices is always welcome, but in the event of visitor-perceived anacronisms, detail descrepancies or operating errors, consult RULE 1!
Jacon12,
Nice! Photo.
Cheers,
Frank
Love their smaller steam locos... Shay, Consolidation and 4-4-0's, haven't owned one of their diesels or big steamers.
I'll take a Bachmann Spectrum,2-8-0 any day. I have two and they are great! DC.
riogrande5761 As much as an improvement as Bachmann has made, they still haven't produced anything I need or want. The have done some D&RGW stuff but it's all mid-60's and earlier and I'm basically a 70's an 80's guy. So while it's nice they are getting better, so far it's no good to me as my wife would say. For me it's always about - does a company offer something that fits my modeling profile. ok Bachman did makes some D&RGW GP40's but the lettering looked wrong - and I've got GP40's pretty much covered from Atlas, and eventually I expect Athearn Genesis will do some.
As much as an improvement as Bachmann has made, they still haven't produced anything I need or want. The have done some D&RGW stuff but it's all mid-60's and earlier and I'm basically a 70's an 80's guy. So while it's nice they are getting better, so far it's no good to me as my wife would say. For me it's always about - does a company offer something that fits my modeling profile. ok Bachman did makes some D&RGW GP40's but the lettering looked wrong - and I've got GP40's pretty much covered from Atlas, and eventually I expect Athearn Genesis will do some.
Yes, there are/have been some Spectrum diesels, and all their recent diesels are much improved, but they do not even pretend to be trying to compete with Atlas, Genesis, Proto 2000, Intermountain or Broadway in terms of detail or proto specific features when it comes to diesels. They are after a slightly different price point/customer with their diesels and regular line steam.
In the Spectrum steam department, their most recent offerings are very much in the same detail/accuracy class as Broadway and others, if not better in many cases. And even the newer regular line locos are well detailed and reasonably correct. The Bachmann Berkshire is over all more correct than the MTH models, and while not as well detailed as the now imposible to find Proto model, it is still a nice looking and good running loco.
Yes the 2-8-0 remains "generic", and has been moved to the regular line for that reason.
The new B&O EM1 is a top notch model.
riogrande5761,