Trains.com

Subscriber & Member Login

Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more!

Large Flanged Rivarossi Cab Forward?

4147 views
17 replies
1 rating 2 rating 3 rating 4 rating 5 rating
  • Member since
    May 2008
  • From: Levenworth, WA.
  • 156 posts
Large Flanged Rivarossi Cab Forward?
Posted by SP4460 on Friday, November 8, 2013 1:06 PM

Is there any update fix kit thing that I could get to swap out the old deep flange running gear? I have looked but I could not find anything.

  • Member since
    January 2010
  • From: Chi-Town
  • 7,706 posts
Posted by zstripe on Friday, November 8, 2013 1:54 PM

You can find,the year made, maybe model # and get in touch with, NWSL (North West Short Line:

http://www.nwsl.com  

Cheers, Drinks

Frank

  • Member since
    February 2004
  • From: Knoxville, TN
  • 2,055 posts
Posted by farrellaa on Friday, November 8, 2013 7:36 PM

Rivarossi made the Cab Forward in the later runs with RP25 flanges. I have watched Ebay for one but they ususally want more than I will pay. That's probably the only way to replace them.

  -Bob

Life is what happens while you are making other plans!

  • Member since
    August 2011
  • From: A Comfy Cave, New Zealand
  • 6,106 posts
Posted by "JaBear" on Saturday, November 9, 2013 3:05 AM

This is sorta thinking out loud, I have turned down freight car metal deep flanged wheels using a battery drill, a sharp file and vernier calipers. Happily my old Cab forward doesn't have pizza cutter wheels,but if it did would I be brave enough to put it upside down in a servicing cradle, apply power and gently turn down the flanges using a file????Hmm

Cheers, the Bear.

"One difference between pessimists and optimists is that while pessimists are more often right, optimists have far more fun."

  • Member since
    January 2010
  • From: Chi-Town
  • 7,706 posts
Posted by zstripe on Saturday, November 9, 2013 3:16 AM

Bear,

Possibly, a good idea! But only,one flaw, where are the filed shavings going to end up? Smile

Cheers, Drinks

Frank

  • Member since
    August 2011
  • From: A Comfy Cave, New Zealand
  • 6,106 posts
Posted by "JaBear" on Saturday, November 9, 2013 3:32 AM

Gidday Frank, with care, not around the 3 pole motor. Whistling To be honest it may not actually be a good idea, its just my warped thought processes.( from being upside down all the time)  Wink

Cheers, the Bear.Beer

"One difference between pessimists and optimists is that while pessimists are more often right, optimists have far more fun."

  • Member since
    January 2010
  • From: Chi-Town
  • 7,706 posts
Posted by zstripe on Saturday, November 9, 2013 3:39 AM

Bear,

Believe it, or not, I was not even thinking, about the upside down thing, but now that you mention it,,,Laugh Laugh

BTW, On another Thread, Chuck, basically said the same thing, but with the Loco, on it's side,with a shop-vac,positioned, on the file.

Cheers, Drinks

Frank

  • Member since
    January 2004
  • From: Canada, eh?
  • 13,375 posts
Posted by doctorwayne on Saturday, November 9, 2013 3:39 AM

I turned down the flanges on this IHC Mogul using a cut-off disc in my Dremel.  After removing the boiler/cab assembly,  masking tape was applied over the motor and a shield of writing paper and masking tape was created around the open gears.
Clip power leads to the motor, and while holding  the loco upright, apply power until it's running at about half speed.  Lightly touch the face of the running cut-off disc to a wheel flange - don't use the edge of the disc.   Maintain light pressure, and don't work overly-long on one wheel, as you don't want to overheat it.   I worked with my shop vac's nozzle right next to the drivers, and had no problem with filings in the mechanism, but if that happens, disassemble the loco and clean it out.  For the lead truck, I simply replaced the wheelset.


Wayne

  • Member since
    September 2004
  • From: Dearborn Station
  • 24,073 posts
Posted by richhotrain on Saturday, November 9, 2013 4:49 AM

doctorwayne

I turned down the flanges on this IHC Mogul using a cut-off disc in my Dremel. 


How the heck do you keep the wheels from going out-of-round?

Or, maybe the more precise question is, how do you keep the flanges round?

Rich

Alton Junction

  • Member since
    July 2009
  • From: lavale, md
  • 4,649 posts
Posted by gregc on Saturday, November 9, 2013 5:37 AM

doctorwayne
I turned down the flanges on this IHC Mogul using a cut-off disc in my Dremel.


Clip power leads to the motor, and while holding  the loco upright, apply power until it's running at about half speed.  Lightly touch the face of the running cut-off disc to a wheel flange - don't use the edge of the disc.   Maintain light pressure, and don't work overly-long on one wheel, as you don't want to overheat it.

I recently took doctorwayne's advice to remove flanges on the inner wheels of a brass engine using this approach and was very happy with the results.

I used a grinding drum, not a cut-off disc.   As he said, by keeping the wheels turning and working slowly, you should be able to turn them down to the size you need.

greg - Philadelphia & Reading / Reading

  • Member since
    September 2004
  • From: Dearborn Station
  • 24,073 posts
Posted by richhotrain on Saturday, November 9, 2013 5:51 AM

Still, I cannot imagine that you can maintain perfectly round flanges with this technique.

Rich

Alton Junction

  • Member since
    October 2005
  • From: Detroit, Michigan
  • 2,284 posts
Posted by Soo Line fan on Saturday, November 9, 2013 7:26 AM

You do not need perfectly round flanges Rich, but you do need perfectly round wheel treads which is what the locomotive rides on. The process Wayne mentioned does not change the tread. This has been done on old pizza flanges for a long time.

Jim

  • Member since
    September 2004
  • From: Dearborn Station
  • 24,073 posts
Posted by richhotrain on Saturday, November 9, 2013 7:35 AM

OK, thanks, Jim.  I kinda thought that but I needed to hear that, or read that, or whatever.   Smile, Wink & Grin

Rich

Alton Junction

  • Member since
    January 2004
  • From: Canada, eh?
  • 13,375 posts
Posted by doctorwayne on Saturday, November 9, 2013 10:13 AM

The turned-down flanges, as explained, don't affect the wheel treads at all, only the flange depth is altered.  The remaining flanges are, however, no longer thin-edged, and the more flange removed, the thicker the edge - this has no effect on tracking qualities, though, as the contact area of the tread and flange isn't changed.  
As long as the wheels are turning as you work, and only light pressure is applied, the amount of material removed is pretty uniform around the circumference of the wheel.  It's unlikely that the flange depth is exactly the same on all wheels, as I simply removed material until it "looked about right".  Smile, Wink & Grin 
The whole operation is pretty easy, with the most difficult part shielding the motor and gears from the filings.  While it would not be adviseable to submerse the motor, if you suspect that the operation has put filings into the gears, disassemble the loco and place the parts in the sink with some warm water and dish detergent, and use a toothbrush to clean out the gear teeth, bearing surfaces, etc.

Wayne

  • Member since
    September 2008
  • 7 posts
Posted by bitlerisvj on Monday, November 11, 2013 12:07 PM

Hi Rich,

Generally speaking if the wheel is already round, the grinding down of the flange will pretty much keep it round.  If it is not round to begin with, then I agree that the grinding process will just follow the original contour of the flange.  Besides, the flange being maybe .001" (or for that matter more) off will absolutely not affect the running capability.  I do like the Dremel cutoff wheel approach used on the flat side.  If you ever tried using a file on these, you would find out that it would take many hours to cut them down.  But as Dr. Wayne said, just move from one wheel to the next so they do not overheat and distort or get destroyed.

Regards, Vic Bitleris

  • Member since
    May 2008
  • From: Levenworth, WA.
  • 156 posts
Posted by SP4460 on Monday, November 11, 2013 2:32 PM

I sent a Email to NorthWest Short Line, and they may have had a special run done way back when, but do not have any now. They can help with leading and training trucks though... so there is that. Looks like the cutoff wheel is going to be my best friend when I get the Cabforward.

  • Member since
    January 2010
  • From: Chi-Town
  • 7,706 posts
Posted by zstripe on Monday, November 11, 2013 5:29 PM

SP4460,

Well at least you got part of the parts,from NWSL. Good Luck! on the drivers, I believe,you'll be OK, just take your time. I would try Wayne's method.

Cheers, Drinks

Frank

  • Member since
    August 2003
  • From: Alabama
  • 1,077 posts
Posted by cjcrescent on Tuesday, November 12, 2013 1:35 AM

Greenway Products sell substitute drivers for many steam locomotives. Have you checked with them?

Carey

Keep it between the Rails

Alabama Central Homepage

Nara member #128

NMRA &SER Life member

Subscriber & Member Login

Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more!

Users Online

There are no community member online

Search the Community

ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT
Model Railroader Newsletter See all
Sign up for our FREE e-newsletter and get model railroad news in your inbox!