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Bachmann ALCO S4 - DCC Sound Value

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  • Member since
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Posted by John_APW on Friday, November 19, 2021 7:10 AM

Thanks for the update. I was asked to upgrade a friends S4 to DCC, which was easy, but I've found the loco hesitates in tight turns. I'm new to HO locos, but have been 20 years in N-scale and have done over 300 decoder installations into dozens of types/manufacturers/production runs. 

It looks to me that the S4 is losing contact from the trucks, but I have not yet determined if it's the wipers, or the wire lead. 

An important step, of course, is opening the truck and checking the tension/pressure of the wipers, the cleanliness of the axle's gears and cups, etc.

So I totally appreciate your initial inquiry, and fully understand your switch to the Atlas RS1. 

I'm open to further guidance or suggestions anyone might have on improving the S4 performance! 

Thanks,

-John

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Posted by John_APW on Friday, November 19, 2021 7:01 AM

I'm thrilled to have found this thread, and the information about disassembling the truck sideframes etc. 

Have been looking for it online and this is the only discussion I've found.

Who cares how old the thread is - I appreciate that there's a searchable record, that captured good info that stands the test of time.

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Posted by richhotrain on Thursday, November 18, 2021 8:56 AM

zstripe

What I see in this thread rivival........ How many of our RIP forum friends are in it........where is the time going???

Tis true!

Rich

Alton Junction

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Posted by zstripe on Thursday, November 18, 2021 6:13 AM

What I see in this thread revival........ How many of our RIP forum friends are in it........where is the time going???

My Bachmann S-1's/4's will outlast Me!

Take Care! Smile, Wink & Grin

Frank

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Posted by richhotrain on Wednesday, November 17, 2021 9:22 AM

I am the OP of that thread. As it turned out, I took a pass on the Bachman S4 and bought an Atlas RS1 without sound instead. The RS1 that I bought matched the prototype Santa Fe switcher that I was looking for. The S4 didn't cut it for me.

Rich

Alton Junction

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Posted by John_APW on Tuesday, November 16, 2021 11:25 PM

I'm thrilled to have found this thread, and the information about disassembling the truck sideframes etc. 

Have been looking for it online and this is the only discussion I've found.

Who cares how old the thread is - I appreciate that there's a searchable record, that captured good info that stands the test of time.

  • Member since
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Posted by HO Hobbyist on Monday, May 27, 2019 4:57 PM

Geared Steam

 

Yep, sound value is a smart business decision by Bachmann, I'm pretty happy with my "sound value" 2-6-0's. Thumbs Up

 

 

 

Same here! I have a 2-6-0 and am quite happy with her. Great little runner.

Modeler of the Lehigh Valley Railroad in Bethlehem PA, 1971 and railfan of Norfolk Southern's Lehigh and Reading Lines of the modern day.

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Posted by HO Hobbyist on Monday, May 27, 2019 4:56 PM

BRAKIE

 

 
Motley
For $99 I say thats a hell of a deal and go for it Rich. Worst case scenario? Replace it with a Tsunami.

 

Replace a Tsunami with a Tsunami?

The S4 comes with a Tsunami sound decoder..

Now if the regular Tsunami decoder is different from the one Bachmann uses I know not.

 

 

Bachmann DCC/Sound Value on Board locos are not Tsunami decoders, despite being made by SoundTraxx. The Sound Value only has a bell, a few horns, and one or two more sounds (aside from the prime mover).

Modeler of the Lehigh Valley Railroad in Bethlehem PA, 1971 and railfan of Norfolk Southern's Lehigh and Reading Lines of the modern day.

http://hohobbyist.weebly.com

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCIYnPo26Y8nsXyKhtpvSWwA

http://instagram.com/lvrr_hoscale

http://twitter.com/lvrr_hoscale

"When railroading time comes you can railroad...but not before."

- Robert A. Heinlein

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Posted by richg1998 on Friday, March 8, 2019 9:07 PM

Interesting thread but a little old.

Rich

If you ever fall over in public, pick yourself up and say “sorry it’s been a while since I inhabited a body.” And just walk away.

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Posted by BRAKIE on Friday, March 8, 2019 7:02 PM

Harpo1me
They do not top coat the paint so the lettering and stripes ect will rub off and distort.

Indeed..I removed the Santa Fe and relettered it for SSRY as their #7 spot.

Six years later my S4 is still going strong...No complaints here since its been a great engine and has given me hundreds hours of switching service over those six years.

Larry

Conductor.

Summerset Ry.


"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt  Safety First!"

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Posted by Harpo1me on Friday, March 8, 2019 12:25 PM

Bachmann as you know made a few variations of these .They have really good molds and railings,But that is the end of the quality. They do not top coat the paint so the lettering and stripes ect will rub off and distort.The motors fail easily if they come equiped with the larger flywheels since the motor bearings cannot carry the load weght of the flywheel and fail  so badly the motorsarmature hits the glued in magnets with no brackets otherwise to keep them in place. The small flywheel version is ok ,but hit or miss if it sounds like a coffie grinder and drowns out the sound value decoder with a 13 mm speaker that will blow easily at higher volumes to compensate for the loud motor. The metal wheels are pressed on a metal axle using a plastic isolater that falls out of the wheel from poor factory qc not pressing them in the wheel strieght. This causes the wheels to fall off the axle.Then the wiring they use is thin and brittle andconstantly brakes at the wheel pickup solder joint. If it is resoldered it breaks again. Wiring needs replacement with a soft flexable wire to cure this issue. Besides these issues it is a nice lco once all these issues are fixed. Had 2 of themand had both completely rebuilt in this way with the aid of Bachmann warranty for the parts. Now after not giving up on Bachmann and fixing them myself  they are great. Bachmanns warranty is great ,but their factory QC is pathetic.

 

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Posted by Geared Steam on Sunday, February 9, 2014 12:25 PM

BRAKIE

 

 
mobilman44

Well, I didn't want to bring it up, but ................

The Bachmann "DCC Sound Value" moniker may mean that it is not of the same sound quality as an equivalent BLI (or Genesis, etc.) ATSF switcher.   I realize there is a good $60 - $80 difference in price, and wonder what those extra dollars gives us in the BLI - as compared to the Bachmann.

Of course, beauty, sound, & performance are in the eyes of the beholder.........................

 

 

 

We talking about a $99.00 engine that sounds and runs good and that makes a good value for those that has a limited hobby budget that can't really afford the extra money and the DCC/Sound equipped Genesis and BLI is roughly twice the amount of the Bachmann engine.

Yep, sound value is a smart business decision by Bachmann, I'm pretty happy with my "sound value" 2-6-0's. Thumbs Up

 

"The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination."-Albert Einstein

http://gearedsteam.blogspot.com/

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Posted by Doughless on Sunday, February 9, 2014 8:01 AM

Yup, one piece sideframe/truck cover.  Don't know if Bachmann sells that part separately or not. 

Glad to see the progress.

- Douglas

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Posted by Thommo on Sunday, February 9, 2014 5:08 AM

I did manage to remove the cover, it goes off together, in one piece, not only sideframes. Similar as on Proto 2000 trucks, plastic cover snaps on front and end of metal truck housing.

I really hate this snap-on truck covers, older Roco with screws is pleasure to work on compared to this. Bang Head

Now I need to solder the wire and off she goes.

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Posted by Doughless on Saturday, February 8, 2014 3:11 PM

Thommo

Hello all!


I have two questions:

1. How to remove the darn plastick truck covers from the truck bottom?? I can see the one wire on front truck is disconnected, so the sound is sporradic whenever decoder loses power.

I need to remove the plastic cover to get to the wire and solder it back to the truck.

2. Can I order ARR type truck covers from Bachmann, to switch them on my S4 an make it little more correct? If somebody have link or email, I'd be very greatfull.

I had the same problem with a poorly soldered wire coming loose and causing running problems.

I seemed easier for me to solder the wire with the truck still on the locomotive, removing the side frames to get to the wire. I think there were too many wires needing to be restrung under the shell if you remoive the trucks.

Most trucks have a cover plate that snaps on the bottom of the truck.  I think the Bachmann s2/s4 cover is attached to the sideframes and is one piece, and if I recall, it pops off like a cover plate typically does, from latches underneath.  You'll just have to look for yourself to find the best place to slide a small screwdriver blade.

Since you'll be handling the locomotive upside down, I would remove the shell first to keep it from getting damaged.  It slides off the frame after you remove the coupler boxes.

As far as replacement sideframes, check Bachmann's website or google search.  I'm sure that you can buy a whole replacement truck but maybe not just the sideframes.

 

 

- Douglas

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Posted by Thommo on Saturday, February 8, 2014 2:59 PM

They have the AAR sideframes, those are Bachmann S4:

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Posted by rrinker on Saturday, February 8, 2014 12:10 PM

 Looks like the solder point is that little tab sticking out right above the brake cylinders.

As for the sideframes, looks like they clip together in the front and back. Dunno if Bachmann has proper sideframes for that model - sounds more like they took the the path that, hey, the S2 and S4 are the same..

              --Randy

 


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by Thommo on Saturday, February 8, 2014 11:25 AM

Hello all!

I have an PRR Alco S4 with sound (it is marketed as S2, but the number #8432 and long hood are from PRR S4 engine). But, sadly, the truck is Alco "Blunt", as the S2 did have.

I have two questions:

1. How to remove the darn plastick truck covers from the truck bottom?? I can see the one wire on front truck is disconnected, so the sound is sporradic whenever decoder loses power.

I need to remove the plastic cover to get to the wire and solder it back to the truck.

2. Can I order ARR type truck covers from Bachmann, to switch them on my S4 an make it little more correct? If somebody have link or email, I'd be very greatfull.

Thanks!

This is the truck I need to dissasemble, its the photo from web, mine trucks are still connected to the engine.

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Posted by BRAKIE on Sunday, August 25, 2013 11:07 AM

mobilman44

Hi,

I also have two Stewart ATSF Zebra scheme switchers - a VO-1000 and a DS 4-4-1000.   Both were DCC ready and I applied NCE decoders.  Putting the details on was not easy, but the end result was well worth it.  These locos are outstanding runners - due to the Kato mechanisms of course.

 
I had one of the old timers with the Athearn drive..It was one of the seven engines lost in the '07 flood.

Larry

Conductor.

Summerset Ry.


"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt  Safety First!"

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Posted by mobilman44 on Sunday, August 25, 2013 9:29 AM

Hi,

I also have two Stewart ATSF Zebra scheme switchers - a VO-1000 and a DS 4-4-1000.   Both were DCC ready and I applied NCE decoders.  Putting the details on was not easy, but the end result was well worth it.  These locos are outstanding runners - due to the Kato mechanisms of course.

ENJOY  !

 

Mobilman44

 

Living in southeast Texas, formerly modeling the "postwar" Santa Fe and Illinois Central 

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Posted by zstripe on Saturday, August 24, 2013 4:26 PM

I did not mention this before,for I had no reason to..I have two,Baldwin DS4's,1000's,made by Stewart Hobbies,with Led's,,,,,They are DC,,but very quiet runners,,they are zebra stripes,,heavily satisfied with their performance,,,not made in China,,but South Korea..

Cheers,

Frank

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Posted by BRAKIE on Saturday, August 24, 2013 1:59 PM

Doughless
Its not the sound QUALITY...its the number of sound FEATURES...that is less than the full-blown Tsunami...also, probably the ability to customize them heavily. 

 As far as selection what I said is what you get-not very much but,enough for a $99.00 engine.

DCC decoder features all CV sittings including 127 speed steps..

Larry

Conductor.

Summerset Ry.


"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt  Safety First!"

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    December 2008
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Posted by Doughless on Saturday, August 24, 2013 1:27 PM

Guys,

Its not the sound QUALITY...its the number of sound FEATURES...that is less than the full-blown Tsunami...also, probably the ability to customize them heavily. 

The quality of the sounds you get are very good.

As far as running noise, they are not Katos.  If you run mine at 30 scale mph and above it does tend to have a drive train noise, probably the motor, but who would run an ALCO S4 faster than 30 mph?  After breaking in for about 10 minutes, mine quieted down considerably

It comes detailed with thin hand rails and cut levers.  Lift rings are just nubs.  The most glaring omissions are wire grab irons and windshield wipers.  

IMO, Its the lack of details and electronic features that keeps the price down, not so much the build quality or the engineering of what you get.

 

- Douglas

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Posted by BRAKIE on Friday, August 23, 2013 7:26 PM

Geared Steam
Sound Value" doesn't have all of the features of the standard Tsunami. 

Ok..Thanks for the information..Thumbs Up

The Tsunami Bachmann uses has three horns(I selected the chime horn instead one of the two fog type horn) and three bell rings(slow medium and fast)..You have the long and short horn blast and rule 17.

I also found both lights stay on regardless of direction-push 0 on the Tech 6 to turn the lights on or off and 7 for dim or bright..

Larry

Conductor.

Summerset Ry.


"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt  Safety First!"

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Posted by Geared Steam on Friday, August 23, 2013 6:25 PM

BRAKIE

Motley
For $99 I say thats a hell of a deal and go for it Rich. Worst case scenario? Replace it with a Tsunami.

Replace a Tsunami with a Tsunami?

The S4 comes with a Tsunami sound decoder..

Now if the regular Tsunami decoder is different from the one Bachmann uses I know not.

"Sound Value" doesn't have all of the features of the standard Tsunami. 

"The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination."-Albert Einstein

http://gearedsteam.blogspot.com/

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Posted by BRAKIE on Friday, August 23, 2013 5:46 PM

Motley
For $99 I say thats a hell of a deal and go for it Rich. Worst case scenario? Replace it with a Tsunami.

Replace a Tsunami with a Tsunami?

The S4 comes with a Tsunami sound decoder..

Now if the regular Tsunami decoder is different from the one Bachmann uses I know not.

Larry

Conductor.

Summerset Ry.


"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt  Safety First!"

  • Member since
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Posted by Motley on Friday, August 23, 2013 3:40 PM

I have a Bachmann Spectrum EM-1. I replaced the Bachmann sound decoder with a QSI. You all know how well these sound. Yes I can tell the difference in better sound and motor control.

I also have a BLI 4-8-2 with Sound. It runs and sounds great. Very similar to Tsunami or QSI.

I like Bachmann, I plan on buying more of their stuff. For $99 I say thats a hell of a deal and go for it Rich. Worst case scenario? Replace it with a Tsunami. You're still only be in it $200.

The difference between a $99 Bachmann and $200 BLI, is not just better sound. Better motor, smother running, and more details and a nice paint job. BLI have absolutely the best low speed I've ever seen.

Michael


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Mile-HI-Railroad
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Posted by mobilman44 on Friday, August 23, 2013 3:23 PM

Ok, I'm not trying to start a bash Bachmann thread, and Yes, I do have Bachmann locos and several BLIs as well.

What I am interested in is the sounds.......  Is the extra $80 or so for the BLI going to give me better sound?

 

ENJOY  !

 

Mobilman44

 

Living in southeast Texas, formerly modeling the "postwar" Santa Fe and Illinois Central 

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Posted by jeffrey-wimberly on Friday, August 23, 2013 3:04 PM

Athearns are noisy too. Doesn't hurt their sales much.

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