dstarr Ah yes, the exception to the rule. There's always an exception to the rule. I am aware of the big "superpower" steamers which appeared in the 1930's. They were designed to do everything, passenger, fast freight, drag freight, all in one locomotive. They were all fine looking steamers, often the pride of their owners.
Gidday Dave. It was not my intention to try to "Teach my Grandmother how to suck eggs", far from it.
What I immediately thought of when I saw your original comment was of the" New Zealand Government Railways" and their purchasing policies after 1900. Including the "Q" s the first class of 4-6-2 Pacific's in the world , introduced 1901 and the "X" 4-8-2 s arguably the first "Mountain" class to go into service anywhere, introduced in 1908, out of the 24 classes totaling 486 locomotive introduced until the demise of steam in 1972, only 4 classes, comprising of 96 locomotives did not have 4 wheel trucks. ( 13 were 0-6-2T for branch line general service; 41 were 2-6-4T for suburban passenger; 18 were 2-6-4T for main line freight and the final 24 were 2-6-2 "Shunting" (Switching) Locos.
Now as that thought entered my head, I also wondered about the relevancy of a small obscure narrow gauge railway on the other side of the world to your observation, and ( here's a sweeping statement for you) while no self respecting modeler that I personally know modelling the US "Transition Period" doesn't have at least one "Mike" or "Decapod", (personally I wish I could justify having one of those "handsome" Nickel Plate Berkshires), I did also think about the reasons in the development of the "Mountains" and "Northerns" in the US, thus making my post.
What I think I'm really trying to say, is that, "one mans exception to the rule can be anothers' normalcy", and that generalisations are just that!!
Cheers, the Bear.
"One difference between pessimists and optimists is that while pessimists are more often right, optimists have far more fun."
I can only think of one railroad, the CP, that regularly and intentionally used hudson class locomotives for freight service. Where there any others? I've seen pictures of a Santa Fe hudsons on strings of reefer cars but that was only after being displaced from passenger service. It was never an intended service.
mbinsewi Thanks Stix, and Larry, I know my loco is not an exact of any prototype, but I just had to measure the drivers, and they are 70". I guess it will work well on my excursion / dinner trains. Mike.
Thanks Stix, and Larry, I know my loco is not an exact of any prototype, but I just had to measure the drivers, and they are 70". I guess it will work well on my excursion / dinner trains.
Mike.
Mike, NKP 2-8-4s was built for high speed freight service that's why they had 69" drivers..These Berks wasn't the only freight engines built for speed.
Today the 765 can still sprint down the track pulling a excursion train..
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
Thanks for your input, Crandell.
Since I model current times, and this is the only steam loco I have that is not in pieces, I mix and match from my selection of passenger cars, and run excursion / diner / tourist trains, or maybe a business train. Sometimes when the cars I use are modern type, I add a diesel loco behind the steam loco to act has the HEP to supply the needed power to the cars. I started the thread to learn more about the loco I have, and what the prototype may have been used for.
With all of the excellent information I have received from all of you, and the links provided to learn more, I am learning a lot about steam locomotives. Something I previously did not know about. Being born in 1949, I just missed the end of the steam era, and my memory as a kid, on grandpa's farm, next to the Soo Line (WC and now CN) I seen F units and GP 7's and 9's.
Thanks for the great schooling guys!
My You Tube
There were many steam locomotives intended for freight service that had drivers well above 63". The Union Pacific Challengers, for example, had 69" drivers, and the Santa Fe's 5001 and 5011 Class 2-10-4's had 74" drivers.
Perhaps we should talk about intended service, because there was such a thing as fast/express freight, say in silk, fruit, mail, and meats, whereas coal drags were expected to be slow grinding service.
Crandell
"JaBear" dstarr Passenger steamers had 4 wheel pilot trucks. Freighters had 2 wheel pilot trucks. The pilot truck guides the locomotive into curves and turnouts. The higher speed of passenger locomotives required more of the engine's weight on the pilot truck to exert enough force to steer the engine. The extra weight needed extra wheels to support it. Gidday Dave , while the development of the 4 wheel pilot truck may have originally been for faster passenger service, I'd respectfully point out that some of the "modern steam locomotives in the 4-8-2 "Mountain and 4-8-4 "Northern classes were built for both passenger and "fast freight" service. http://www.steamlocomotive.com/northern/ Cheers, the Bear.
dstarr Passenger steamers had 4 wheel pilot trucks. Freighters had 2 wheel pilot trucks. The pilot truck guides the locomotive into curves and turnouts. The higher speed of passenger locomotives required more of the engine's weight on the pilot truck to exert enough force to steer the engine. The extra weight needed extra wheels to support it.
Passenger steamers had 4 wheel pilot trucks. Freighters had 2 wheel pilot trucks. The pilot truck guides the locomotive into curves and turnouts. The higher speed of passenger locomotives required more of the engine's weight on the pilot truck to exert enough force to steer the engine. The extra weight needed extra wheels to support it.
Gidday Dave , while the development of the 4 wheel pilot truck may have originally been for faster passenger service, I'd respectfully point out that some of the "modern steam locomotives in the 4-8-2 "Mountain and 4-8-4 "Northern classes were built for both passenger and "fast freight" service.
http://www.steamlocomotive.com/northern/
Ah yes, the exception to the rule. There's always an exception to the rule. I am aware of the big "superpower" steamers which appeared in the 1930's. They were designed to do everything, passenger, fast freight, drag freight, all in one locomotive. They were all fine looking steamers, often the pride of their owners.
David Starr www.newsnorthwoods.blogspot.com
Thanks Ulrich for the info. Since this is the only steam loco I have, I figured I better find out what is all about.
Oh, and by the way Ulrich, I stick my head in the dinner once in a while, and wifey and I wish you best with everything.
Thanks Bear,
Thanks for the info, and that link was great. I took a little journey learning about steam locos.
Richard,
I think they run great. When I got the first box of the collection, it was the loco and power pack, and I immediately had to take the shell off, seeing it was a Bachmann, and I was impressed! as these are from the Bachmann Plus series. I expected the usual pancake motor and one truck driving. I also like the way Bachmann designed the trucks and couplers on the 89' dome cars, to handle the tight radius.
wjstix Another way to spot a passenger engine is to look at the drivers. Freight engines needed small drivers to create more torque and slow-speed power, so had drivers around 63" diameter or less. Passenger engines used large wheels which enabled greater speed, usually 70-80" diameter, sometimes larger.
Another way to spot a passenger engine is to look at the drivers. Freight engines needed small drivers to create more torque and slow-speed power, so had drivers around 63" diameter or less. Passenger engines used large wheels which enabled greater speed, usually 70-80" diameter, sometimes larger.
Mike,
your loco is called a Hudson, having a 4-6-4 wheel arrangement, meaning a 4-wheel pilot truck, 6 drivers and a 4-wheel trailing truck. Having a 4-wheel pilot truck does not necessarily make it a passenger engine - it is the diameter of the drivers who determine the type of use for a railroad. Freight engines usually had wheels of a smaller diameter, as they were designed for pulling power and not for speed. Hudsons were commonly passenger engines, so your are fine using it for an excursion train.
Mehano locos are quite sturdy and smooth running, but certainly not the most detailed ones. This is quite OK, especially if your grandson likes to run it - you don´t have to be afraid of him breaking off any delicate parts.
Your loco does not follow a specific prototype and it is certainly not following a correct UP prototype. UP #2003 was a Mikado, i.e. 2-8-2 built by Baldwin in 1911. But does that matter?
Have Hawthorn Village Red Sox set. Ran the full set once on current 4x6 HO layout. Cat chasing it's tail. Several of the cars displayed the need for coupler attention.
When I get a larger layout it may get exercised in full again.
Did run the F unit loco recently. It is very heavy and the fuel tanks are very low. It found some flaws in the track work that I was unable to find with other methods. So much for long cars, long steamers and 6 axle diesels finding the problems.
Have fun,
Richard
Richard, on my Christmas layout, that's how I run it, as an excursion / dinner train, and because I use a mix of more modern Walthers and Rapido passenger cars, I put an F40ph (dummy) right behind the steamer for HEP. On the second track, running in the opposite direction, I use the F7 (Hawthorn Village Green Bay Packers set) with a decorated Christmas train. I probably won't get around to repainting it, as I have a ton of projects as it is!
Dave, thanks for answering my question, as to the difference between passenger and freight locos.
Thanks guys,
mbinsewi Thanks Jim. How do you tell it's a passenger loco? Uhmmmm...maybe I'll find a picture of a Milwaukee Road, and repaint it. Mike.
Thanks Jim. How do you tell it's a passenger loco? Uhmmmm...maybe I'll find a picture of a Milwaukee Road, and repaint it.
If your grandson likes it like it is, why change it? Using it as power for an excursion train on a more modern layout, many locos have been rebuilt and changes made, so there's no reason it can't fit, unless you are a person who strives for as prototypical as possible.
It is a 4-6-4 passenger engine. I am no UP expert, but I doubt that UP had any them. They did have 4-6-2 & 4-8-2 passenger engines and went to 4-8-4 engines, then diesels in quick order. I have a similar one I picked cheap at a train show and re-painted into Milwaukee Road - at least the Milwaukee had 4-6-4's, but like most steam engines they were very company specific in details.
Jim
Modeling BNSF and Milwaukee Road in SW Wisconsin
I will admit I know "0" about steam locos, other than the obvious. I do have 1 steam loco that sees a lot of run time on the Christmas train I set up every other year or so, when the grandson is staying with us. I got it from an old time friend, for helping him do some misc. carpentry work.
What I know:
It's a Mahano, it runs excellent, forward and reverse, with great s-l-o-w speed, and it has run flawlessly for up to 5 or 6 hours during holiday gatherings. My grandson LOVES it. He puts his face right down next to the track, and adds "sound" as it goes by (what a great kid, hey?)
My questions:
Was there such a prototype? Did the UP run any? Is it passenger or freight?, and how do you tell the between the two?
I have a few heavy weight passenger cars, and some old time frieght cars, and I would like to run a steam train every once and while.
Pictures:
Looks like I need to clean my lens, sure came out fuzzy, sorry about that. Mike.
Looks like I need to clean my lens, sure came out fuzzy, sorry about that.