For some reason, our shows around here are all clustered together. We just had the Greenberg show last weekend, and the first week of December is the Hub Division NMRA show. Then, nothing major until Springfield at the end of January, and then another cluster of shows in the spring. After that, nothing much until next fall.
As a customer, I'd rather have shows spaced around the calendar a bit more, and I'd imagine that the same would be true for a vendor. I have much less interest in the December show, having just been to one last week, and I probably will skip it.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
I went to a local train show and i made some good deals i bought a Bachmann plus sp daylight AB unit for 30 bucks some cars for 4 each a box of track and selectors and other stuff for 15 i think i did good and i went after lunch
I live for the one big show in Timonium, MD four times each year. (~36,000 sq ft of vendors and trains) Prices are very low on the stuff I need. Far lower than any mail order house. Plus, the added benfit of stopping by M.B Klein, (Model Train Stuff's store), only 4 miles away is also good. I can place an order on Wednesday and tell them I will pick it up on Saturday and save the shipping.
As noted before, The Greenburg shows are the pits for me as there is always zero narrow gauge stuff. Thus, I never travel to get to them. However, I do go to the Greenberg show here in Richmond just to pick up common supplies, scenics, tools, etc.
My town is pretty dead so far as NG modelers are concerned. ( I have asked the local hobby shops if they know of any NG people and always get "no" for an answer.) The two local clubs are just not for me either. I do agree that train shows are a great event in and of themselves and you meet a lot of interesting dealers and MR's in general.
Richard
If I can't fix it, I can fix it so it can't be fixed
The "good" large shows are not in Indiana, the show once a month at the Wheaton fair grounds in IL is excellent, but not the same show it was a few years ago, used to be nothing but a swap meet, long waiting list to get a table. Now there are layouts and empty tables many times. The show at the Hare Arena in Dayton OH is good, and the large multi building show just south of Cleveland is good. But all are a major haul from where I live, 3 hours to Dayton, 4.5 to Wheaton and 5ish to Cleveland. Here the smaller shows are better for bargains, estate sales on 1 or 2 tables. The large shows in the midwest come with much higher tables prices and if its a 2 day show, the added cost of a hotel and more meals if the dealer is from out of state. So you loose the smaller guys blowing out a collection or thinning down. The small shows get them and the usual good prices they have. I gave $60 for this FM H12-44 with original box, you would never see this kind of pricing at a large show in our area. Ebay, when you think about it, is a 24/7/365 train show with an audience no show could ever approach. But I refuse to be stuck in the house all winter, espcialy infront of a computer screen. So even a bad show for buys can be a fun day out of the house. We always go do other things after the show, railfanning, stopping by the LHS's in the area and going to a nice dinner somewhere. So when you add it all up, its worth it still. If the show is great, I make sure to thank the club/organizers as we go out the doors and wish them luck, if I have suggestions on making it better, I let them know in a constructive way. If we dont patronize the shows, ebay will be all we have left someday. Mike
Silly NT's, I have Asperger's Syndrome
As some have already stated. Only the big shows are worth it, especially if your interests are not standard gauge HO or N. Narrow gaugers, true hi-scale O and G gaugers need the big shows. Most big shows are two day affairs.
As a buyer and seller at these types of events be they model trains, or amateur radio hamfests, if you aren't there in the early AM on Saturday,...... You lose, bigtime!
Sunday afternoon you are only getting after church tire kickers, hauling around the wife and kids who don't have two nickels to rub together and if they do, you are not going to see them.
Sunday afternoons, I tend to follow my cat's lead.
riogrande5761 EDZ I went to a show here in Masachusetts this weekend that put the final nail in the coffin for shows for me. $7.00 to get in, 25 dollars in gas, a 90 minute drive and it was 90% used junk. There's junk, then there's JUNK... and this wasn't the good junk. Except for the distance and gas consumption, I used to visit the Syracuse November show at the New York State Fair Grounds before I left "lake effect snow" and high unemployment behind. That show for the last 8-10 years I went was basically a used junk train show, mostly toy train junk on tables. Why people wast their time and rent tables to sell stuff that should be dumped into a land fill - it's enough to make you want to wear a "beam me up Scotty, there is no intelligent life down here" T-shirt. I know people don't want to part with their junk for less than $XX but at some point reality has to set in. The last Timonium show the day before Hurricaine Sandy was the closest I've seen to Syracuse junk train show - I just nearly ran past all the junk plastic toy train tables trying to find a few decent tables - which will hopefully be back in Februrary! Lots of stuff was severely overpriced. I understand that people need to profit. But when people are selling Tyoc used freight cars with plastic wheels and horn hook couplers for 10-11 dollars, I draw the line. There is this thing called delusion - and there are a lot of deluded people still trying to sell plastic toy train junk for far more than it is worth. I think there was this rumor going around back in the 80's on how plastic trains would be worth something some day, and they would appreciate and there would be a demand. Well, some people act as if it is so, and faithfuly haul that junk back and forth and display it. HelloOOOOooo!!! It's not worth the gas you spend to haul it to the show. Do yourself a favor and donate it to a charity or a childrens hospital or orphanage where some kids will get some enjoyment and at least you can put yourself out of your/our misery and maybe get a little tax deduction. Problem solved! Wait, I see eye's open but no comprehension.
EDZ I went to a show here in Masachusetts this weekend that put the final nail in the coffin for shows for me. $7.00 to get in, 25 dollars in gas, a 90 minute drive and it was 90% used junk. There's junk, then there's JUNK... and this wasn't the good junk.
I went to a show here in Masachusetts this weekend that put the final nail in the coffin for shows for me. $7.00 to get in, 25 dollars in gas, a 90 minute drive and it was 90% used junk. There's junk, then there's JUNK... and this wasn't the good junk.
Except for the distance and gas consumption, I used to visit the Syracuse November show at the New York State Fair Grounds before I left "lake effect snow" and high unemployment behind. That show for the last 8-10 years I went was basically a used junk train show, mostly toy train junk on tables. Why people wast their time and rent tables to sell stuff that should be dumped into a land fill - it's enough to make you want to wear a "beam me up Scotty, there is no intelligent life down here" T-shirt. I know people don't want to part with their junk for less than $XX but at some point reality has to set in. The last Timonium show the day before Hurricaine Sandy was the closest I've seen to Syracuse junk train show - I just nearly ran past all the junk plastic toy train tables trying to find a few decent tables - which will hopefully be back in Februrary!
Lots of stuff was severely overpriced. I understand that people need to profit. But when people are selling Tyoc used freight cars with plastic wheels and horn hook couplers for 10-11 dollars, I draw the line.
There is this thing called delusion - and there are a lot of deluded people still trying to sell plastic toy train junk for far more than it is worth. I think there was this rumor going around back in the 80's on how plastic trains would be worth something some day, and they would appreciate and there would be a demand. Well, some people act as if it is so, and faithfuly haul that junk back and forth and display it. HelloOOOOooo!!! It's not worth the gas you spend to haul it to the show. Do yourself a favor and donate it to a charity or a childrens hospital or orphanage where some kids will get some enjoyment and at least you can put yourself out of your/our misery and maybe get a little tax deduction. Problem solved! Wait, I see eye's open but no comprehension.
I agree 100%. Some think because the guy 4 tables down is selling Digitrax DCC systems for $600.00 that his used Tyco DC transformer is a bargain at $79.00, lol. Some other guy is selling Kadee or Intermountain RTR cars for $29.00, so my cheap plastic junk is worth $11.00 or more.
Hello? Along with delusion is this other thing called reality.
-Ed
"We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act but a habit." -Aristotle
MisterBeasley EDZI went to a show here in Masachusetts this weekend that put the final nail in the coffin for shows for me. $7.00 to get in, 25 dollars in gas, a 90 minute drive and it was 90% used junk. There's junk, then there's JUNK... and this wasn't the good junk. If it was the Greenberg Show in Wilmington, I went to the same one. I went on Sunday, arriving just before lunch and staying a couple of hours. None of the vendors were packing up, and many seemed to be doing a brisk business. I go to these shows for entertainment, mostly, but I came home with some odds and ends and a few new boxcars. For me, this show is only a 20 minute drive, so its shortcomings are more tolerable. This show, and the one in the spring, has a huge amount of tinplate, S-gauge and O-gauge. Some is just someone's attic cleanup, but most of it is just scales I don't happen to be interested in buying. I do, however, wax nostalgic when I see stuff I had had on my Lionel layout as a kid, like the rocket launchers, pumping oil well or a GG-1. Two of my favorite vendors were not there, which surprised me, but they may be skipping this one and going to the Marlborough Hub Division show in December instead. This used to be billed as a "Train and Dollhouse" show, and you still see some of that. More, though, there are Power Rangers, lots of Thomas, and Star Wars stuff. I walk by, but it helps pay for the hall, after all. And, absolutely the happiest person I've ever seen at a train show was a little girl walking around with a Barbie Princess package. To each his own, I guess.
EDZI went to a show here in Masachusetts this weekend that put the final nail in the coffin for shows for me. $7.00 to get in, 25 dollars in gas, a 90 minute drive and it was 90% used junk. There's junk, then there's JUNK... and this wasn't the good junk.
If it was the Greenberg Show in Wilmington, I went to the same one. I went on Sunday, arriving just before lunch and staying a couple of hours. None of the vendors were packing up, and many seemed to be doing a brisk business. I go to these shows for entertainment, mostly, but I came home with some odds and ends and a few new boxcars. For me, this show is only a 20 minute drive, so its shortcomings are more tolerable.
This show, and the one in the spring, has a huge amount of tinplate, S-gauge and O-gauge. Some is just someone's attic cleanup, but most of it is just scales I don't happen to be interested in buying. I do, however, wax nostalgic when I see stuff I had had on my Lionel layout as a kid, like the rocket launchers, pumping oil well or a GG-1.
Two of my favorite vendors were not there, which surprised me, but they may be skipping this one and going to the Marlborough Hub Division show in December instead.
This used to be billed as a "Train and Dollhouse" show, and you still see some of that. More, though, there are Power Rangers, lots of Thomas, and Star Wars stuff. I walk by, but it helps pay for the hall, after all. And, absolutely the happiest person I've ever seen at a train show was a little girl walking around with a Barbie Princess package. To each his own, I guess.
I went on Saturday, just before lunch. There was a lot of Lionel, as you said, but that's always been the case with this show from what I remember. Obviously, it's where the profit is. I saw a used passenger station that wasn't in the best of condition with a price tag of $895.00 on it. Lionel is interesting and nostalgic, but because I model HO I'll glance at it, but keep moving on.
I was looking for some Scenic Express ballast, but the only vendor that had it was charging a lot more for it than I can buy it for elsewhere.
I was looking for some rolling stock (can you ever own enough? ) but as I said earlier, you have to draw the line when the prices hit the stratosphere for stuff you'd be apt to find in a dumpster.
I wanted to grab some Kadee stuff, but that vendor I've dealt with in the past wasn't there.
Even the number of modular layouts were down from previous years.
It was a real disappointment. I go looking for bargains, but expecting to probably pay a little more than I'd typically pay when I find something that catches my eye. But I'm just not going to pay admission plus gas to get hosed, lol. There's a small show coming up in Haverhill that I'll probably hit because it's 15 minutes away, but I'm done with Greenberg.
Train shows are like hobby shops, if you don't support them, the will go away.
I would ask the OP was this a train SHOW, with layouts set up along with vendors, manufacturers booths, and local hobby shop booths?, or a SWAP MEET, where only individuals and club member sellers had tables set up. There's a bit of a difference between the two.
I guess it depends what your local shows are like. As a newer layout exhibitor I have now been to 4 full blown 2-day shows, two GTEs (all scales) and two SWGRS's (large scale only). My experience has been that the vendors at each show didn't start clean up until about a half hour before the scheduled end of the show. There was still a good amount of folks walking around even that late on a Sunday.
Saturdays are for the modelers, that's the day they generally show up in numbers to do the major league shopping. Sundays are almost always families who come to look at the train layouts, they also buy but generally much simpler stuff or starter sets. The vendors know this already so Sunday is always a much more relaxed atmosphere.
I cannot imagine people starting take-down at a full blown train show 2 hrs before the scheduled end of the show, for one thing they wouldn't even be able to start moving product out to their trailers until after the show closed and they opened the truck loading doors.
Have fun with your trains
I'm afraid that the internet has seriously damaged the quality of train shows. I have been in western Colorado for 14 years and shows out here are non-existent. I have to travel 200 miles plus to attend a show with 25 to 30 tables. In Ohio there were lots of shows with 100+ tables less than an hour away. Since I usually had lots of extra stuff, I would always get a table. That allowed me in the door well before the public to cherry pick the best buys, well worth the $10 to $15 investment.
Even when the show sucks, we dont travel that far, its a 45min drive with traffic to the Indy shows from my place in Kokomo. Gets my friend and I out of the house and even amoung the junk and overpriced items, you might still find a gem! Getting all negative isnt helping things, just dont go back to that show, although if thats the only show in your area it would totaly suck. I dont like the Manual HS show, but then its more geared to Monon and NKP modelers. We usualy combine our weekly hobby shop trip if we go to that show. The NMRA shows have been our best for buying the trains we both like, ie: older brass diesels or steam, craftsman kit freight cars or older Athearn/MDC ect car kits. I have been fortunate that both places I have lived had good shows atleast once a year. The Kokomo show has gone down hill in recent years, mainly because the orginizer is clueless unless it pretains to Lionel. Doesnt even advertise it beyond that group. Last year it was lots of N scale and Lionel, Blah! One of the nicest venues I have been to, indoor unloading for dealers even! Super nice as the show is in early Feburary so weather is usualy pretty nasty. Last year was one of the first I didnt set up my little portable layout. Maybe I will try and get it running again for this year. Mike
Rio Grande. The Action Road - Focus 1977-1983
emdmike To give my view of the yin and yang of train shows, Back in October I attended the Great Train Expo in Indy, very high prices, even on used stuff, no crowd to speak of and we were there for a couple hours early on the first day, arrived at the time the show opened. You could have rolled a bowling ball down the isles and hit nobody. Yesterday we went to the fall NMRA division show in Danville Indiana. Great prices, many bargains. Plenty of trains and little to no non-train items, brass, N scale ect. The place was packed within 1 hour of the door opening. Granted the show was free to get in and free parking as they are trying to rebuild this show from it being near death. The GTE show had $5 parking as it was at the state fair grounds and $7 to get in the door for adults. I also believe table prices are way to high for the GTE show, I know of several dealers that refuse to do that show, not enough margin or sales to recoup table costs, plus fuel and hotel costs as its a 2 day show. Lots of extra costs to dealers to do a 2 day show, so most do NOT like 2 day shows. Prefer a 1 day show and prefer it on Saturday, then they can recouperate on Sunday before back to the day job on Monday. Yesterdays show was a ray of light compared to the doom and gloom of the other shows I have gone to this year. So many show organizers are clueless when it comes to advertising and putting on a good show. Glad to see someone that takes a general interest in how well the show goes. Cheers Mike
To give my view of the yin and yang of train shows, Back in October I attended the Great Train Expo in Indy, very high prices, even on used stuff, no crowd to speak of and we were there for a couple hours early on the first day, arrived at the time the show opened. You could have rolled a bowling ball down the isles and hit nobody. Yesterday we went to the fall NMRA division show in Danville Indiana. Great prices, many bargains. Plenty of trains and little to no non-train items, brass, N scale ect. The place was packed within 1 hour of the door opening. Granted the show was free to get in and free parking as they are trying to rebuild this show from it being near death. The GTE show had $5 parking as it was at the state fair grounds and $7 to get in the door for adults. I also believe table prices are way to high for the GTE show, I know of several dealers that refuse to do that show, not enough margin or sales to recoup table costs, plus fuel and hotel costs as its a 2 day show. Lots of extra costs to dealers to do a 2 day show, so most do NOT like 2 day shows. Prefer a 1 day show and prefer it on Saturday, then they can recouperate on Sunday before back to the day job on Monday. Yesterdays show was a ray of light compared to the doom and gloom of the other shows I have gone to this year. So many show organizers are clueless when it comes to advertising and putting on a good show. Glad to see someone that takes a general interest in how well the show goes. Cheers Mike
Mike,
I was at both the October GTE and the Danville NMRA show. Your description of the issues are dead on.
Saw the stuff you got at the show that you posted in your thread. I saw that grain elevator at the table....then not. You must have snagged it as I was just making my first pass through the tables.
All of the other local shows near Indy are good shows, with my two favorites being the Naptown MR club show at Manual High School and the CID NMRA show in Noblesville.
But I like all train shows so I can't really complain about any of them.
- Douglas
Each year this show has slipped. It's more toys, Thomas the tank engine, RC stuff, etc than ever before. Good luck to them, I won't be back.
trainman3 I just returned from my div annual show,Icouldnot make it till 1.00 the show was 9.00am-3.00pm ,I live an hour away ,when i got there I made a round around the show to see what was there etc. When i went back around to by some things over half the tables where disasembling or were gone @ 1.35 pm.People were still coming in @ they were still collecting money @ door.I now that some of the people have to travel but at least they could have the courtisy to stay till at least 2.30 needless to say I probly will not go again for a while.Just venting guys thanks
I just returned from my div annual show,Icouldnot make it till 1.00 the show was 9.00am-3.00pm ,I live an hour away ,when i got there I made a round around the show to see what was there etc. When i went back around to by some things over half the tables where disasembling or were gone @ 1.35 pm.People were still coming in @ they were still collecting money @ door.I now that some of the people have to travel but at least they could have the courtisy to stay till at least 2.30 needless to say I probly will not go again for a while.Just venting guys thanks
It gets wearisome reading threads started by those who choose to point the finger at others and not take responsibility for themselves for their contentment. Most of us know how things are with shows - yes they pack up early so if you come at the "11th hour" thats how it is. You knew this and went late anyway - and aren't happy. Hello, you knew this would happen so why complain to us?
I've been their too, I went to the last Timonium show when Hurricaine Sandy cause all of the vendors to run away screaming much earlier than normal and I couldn't get their until about 11:30am. I knew it would be like it was - it was a choice. My wife and I went with our eyes open, had a nice enough time for what it was, had our taco salad and yes the day was cut short, what little we had of it. Who can I complain to? Nobody. I"m not going to punish the Timonium show for my own expectations not being met. I just know next time, if at all possible, go early and go on Saturday for the best experience. I tried to do that in October but had to spend Sat with my car in the repair shop costing me a grand in unexpected repairs.
Anyhow, don't blame others. Make your plans knowing what is best to do and if you "know" you are going to be disappointed, then act accordingly - don't go if you are going to be disappointed and have to come into forums and complain. Just sayin...
cacoleMy part of the country has very few shows to go to that are within a reasonable commuting distance --
Dr. Frankendiesel aka Scott Running BearSpace Mouse for president!15 year veteran fire fighterCollector of Apple //e'sRunning Bear EnterprisesHistory Channel Club life member.beatus homo qui invenit sapientiam
Now i run a train show in wisconsin for three years now. But have been part of the show since around 1995. My show is a 2 day show which runs 10-4 both days. Most years you would see the train people who want to buy come right away on saturday to get the best stuff. So the vendors say most of the saturday sales were between 10- 2:30. We also have some vendors who are at our show for one day. They pay more for the tables but they say they make the most money on saturday so thats when they want to be at the show.
Now this year we started tv advertising. We had more people through the door and the vendore were happy also. Sales on sunday were up for the vendor i talked to. They were surprised. What surprised me was usaly sunday people are about half of saturday but this year saturday and sunday were close in totals.
justin
My part of the country has very few shows to go to that are within a reasonable commuting distance --
Same here.
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My part of the country has very few shows to go to that are within a reasonable commuting distance -- 70 miles minimum. I only go every other year because the same vendors with the same products seem to be at every show, with increased prices each year.
A local who has been a vendor a a couple of shows said he didn't even sell enough to pay for the table rental, which also has gone up annually.
jrbernier I understand the issue of staying open, but if all of the good deals are gone and everything has been picked over by the 9 AM crowd - I would not waste my time to go after lunch. The early bird does get the worm! Now this was not a 'train show' - it was a selling event without large display layouts.
Jim,My policy for years has to be there when the doors open..I won't bother going to a show after lunch since as you noted the good deals are gone or picked over.
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
Well, I have given up going to all but the Amherst RR show in January. Too many of the local shows just have people showing junk, and a lot of them advertise "Train and Hobby" show, and you go, only to find tables of games, puzzles, and cheap RC toys, and rarely a train item in sight.
Even in my less cynical days, though, if I couldn't get to a show within an hour of its opening, I wouldn't go.
Connecticut Valley Railroad A Branch of the New York, New Haven, and Hartford
"If you think you can do a thing or think you can't do a thing, you're right." -- Henry Ford
Some of the larger show require vendors to stay set up until 30 minutes before closing - Or they cannot get tables next year. The truth is that many of the larger shows have not been filling all their tables. Smaller events like your Div Show many times cannot get a lot of vendors and have to put up with all of the above.
My Division show this fall had 2 hobby shop vendors and 4 guys selling used HO stuff for outrageous prices. I just returned from a large show that had a gym filled with vendor tables. I got 2 tables about a week ago, and they just sold the last table the night before the show. This one started at 9 AM, and ended at 2 PM. Business was very good until about 12:30 PM - Then lunch time set in and most of the buying public was out of money or had seen everything. There were folks trickling in over the next 2 hours, but I made my sales in the first hour or so. About 1:30 they said to pack'em up and we were out the door.
I understand the issue of staying open, but if all of the good deals are gone and everything has been picked over by the 9 AM crowd - I would not waste my time to go after lunch. The early bird does get the worm! Now this was not a 'train show' - it was a selling event without large display layouts. If you run a 'train show' - then at least keeping the displays/layouts operating through the published hours is a good idea. I remember a number of years ago I attended one of these 'flea market' train sales, and a family bought tickets, wandered around and then wanted a refund as there were no train layouts to see! They did refund them their money after they were educated on the difference between a Saturday swap meet, and a Sunday show to take your family to...
Jim
Modeling BNSF and Milwaukee Road in SW Wisconsin