CA or Model Cement

[richardksmith]

Is it better to add detail parts to Locomotives, (stanchions, steps etc,) with crazy glue or old time testors model cement??? It's been a long time away from this hobby[?]

[Big_Boy_4005]

For parts with small surface areas, or dissimilar materials, I like CA. For straight styrene bonding Testors is a good choice.

[Anonymous]

I find that I am using CA for more things now.

[BentnoseWillie]

I use Testors or Tenax liquid plastic cement for styrene-to-styrene joints (Testors is stronger, Tenax is faster); CA for most other joints; and JB Weld for those spots where I'm really serious about strength. [:)]

[nfmisso]

And for "impossible" situations: Cool Chem's Cyanopoxy:
http://www.mrhobby.com/Cyantips.html

[Isambard]

QUOTE: Originally posted by richardksmith

Is it better to add detail parts to Locomotives, (stanchions, steps etc,) with crazy glue or old time testors model cement??? It's been a long time away from this hobby[?]

CA is great stuff for quickly and strongly bonding parts, but as some readers of this forum from my recent posts know, handling and applying it can be tricky. Thin CA (as compared to gap filling CA) flows very freely on surfaces and wicks into joints very quickly, including if your not careful places where you don't want it, including fingers, tools and other surfaces. Surprise your bonded! I now carefully squeeze a very small amount from the container nozzle onto a piece of aluminum foil and carefuly use the thin end of a toothpick to dip and apply a small amount of the CA to the two surfaces I want to bond.
Working on joints where the joint is going to be visible needs particular care to avoid CA spreading where it shouldn't. Some paint finishes and plastics are sensitive to CA. Acetone or nail polish remover containing acetone can be used to remove CA, but at risk of damaging surfaces.
As an alternative to CA, when bonding plastics such as styrene, butyrate, abs and acrylic (lucite or plexiglas) another very quick and strong bonding agent you can use is a liquid plastic welder such as Ambroid's ProWeld, which comes in a bottle with a a brush applicator. Again like CA it wicks and spreads very quickly and has to be applied with care.
I've also used Lepage's two-part five-minute epoxy on my recent locomotive detailing project (comes in small tubes and you can make up in tiny amounts on a piece of foil) again using a tooth pick as an applicator. Epoxy is more easily controlled, takes a few minutes to bond to a reasonable strength, makes a bulkier joint (blobby if too much) and may not take some paint too well.
I use Testor's model cement on plastic kit parts when either CA or ProWeld would be tricky to control.
[:)]

[dharmon]

I'll take the model cement...you can have California............[:D]


I use both, and it's situational dependent. Dissimiliar materials almost always CA. Styrene to styrene usually cement.

[Anonymous]

it really depends on the situation, if its a joint that needs strength, i prefer CA. if it is a tiny detail part where the adhesive could be visible, i use proweld. i find it dries almost invisible and if you can see it, just work it into the weathering[swg]

[Anonymous]

I believe that CA was first used for surgical sealing of flesh. That is probably why it likes to bond skin.

I use CA where I can get away with it. I try to get a 20-40 second formula from the LHS. It is not too fast or too slow.

On parts I deem dangerous I will use the Testor's It is safer and stronger over time.

One thing I do is carry a bottle of CA "Debonder" once in a while I feel the CA start to bond on me and a squirt of the debonder puts things to rights rather quickly. IT is even useful for the rare occasion of actually breaking up a mis bonded part.

For me using CA is the high point of the day when I must be very watchful and careful. I never use it when my wife is not home. And the cell phone I keep nearby is voice activated so I can call if there is a serious problem.

Overall the CA is fast, effective (As long as air is low humidity) and handy for getting those pesky parts to stay together. I have learned to put a dot of CA in a spot or two and back it up with Testors thru the rest of the joint.

I avoid the orange tube model glue with the toulene. I used it alot as a kid and do not care to repeat the problems due to fumes with the threat of gas fired appliances.

Lee

[cwclark]

i use both depending on the situation...i apply both by squirting some out on a scrap piece of wood and apply it to the joint to be glued with a toothpick..that way you can control the amount of glue needed so that there aren't any "blobs" of glue on any parts and the chances of glueing your fingers together with the CA glue is reduced significantly....chuck[:D]

[AntonioFP45]

Isambard, I'm with you on this one.

On an Athearn FP45.

After cutting open the roof radiator fans I decided to go a step further and cut out the plastic side radiator grill panels so I could install metal "See Thru" grills. I spent a lot of time shaping the openings with detail files. I applied Ambroid to the openings and installed the metal grills. Everything was looking good! I then noticed that the grills were still a little loose. Since this was metal on plastic I went ahead and came back with liquid CA............WHAT A DISASTER!!!![B)][:0]

Even though I had applied masking tape to the surrounding edges, the CA leaked through the tape and damaged various spots on the roof area and ahead of the radiator. So now I have a spare FP45 powered chassis as the body is now "Kitbash Fodder". I've been fortunate to get a dummy off of Ebay. Chance to start over, fresh. [:)][:D]

Lesson learned: Be patient! If you're in a hurry or anxious, don't do it! Wait til you can make the time too work slowly. I was feeling good but was a little anxious to get it done and enjoy the results.[8)] [:p]

BTW: Guys/Gals, if any of you have successfully used something other than CA to glue metal or brass to plastic locomotive bodies, please post it! [;)][:)][:D]

Cheers!

[nfmisso]

QUOTE: Originally posted by HighIron2003ar

Overall the CA is fast, effective (As long as air is low humidity)

CA needs humidity (moisture) to bond, it will not work well in extremely low humidity, and it will work underwater.

[Anonymous]

CA's affinity for water is why it loves to bond skin to skin so readily. Takes the water it needs right out of your hide.

[Anonymous]

look at the parts you're cementing:
Styrene, acrylic, PVC... are somewhat similar and respond to solvent cements - Tenax for one...
solvent for these contain methylene chloride...

Testors, etc are thickened versions of the above... will fill small gaps - or gunk up small details, depending on your skill level (grin)

CA adhesives work on CLOSELY mating surfaces of MANY (not all) dissimilar materials - make sure there's no gaps (or look for the newer gap-filling CA) and not all materials respond. CA will work better in tension than in shear - if the parts can slide across each other before gluing, the chances are good tht this joint will fail.

don't expect adhesives to work on Polypropylene, Polyetheylene or Delrin- these plastics are engineered to be resistant to attack by acids and solvents... I liken gluing them to using an adhesive on parrafin-- it'll hold for a while, until stress is applied.

An excellent source for info on adhesives is "Modern Plastics", a trade publication (is it still McGraw Hill?) whick publishes an annual "Modern Plastics Encyclopedia"

[Isambard]

QUOTE: Originally posted by AntonioFP45

Isambard, I'm with you on this one.

On an Athearn FP45.

After cutting open the roof radiator fans I decided to go a step further and cut out the plastic side radiator grill panels so I could install metal "See Thru" grills. I spent a lot of time shaping the openings with detail files. I applied Ambroid to the openings and installed the metal grills. Everything was looking good! I then noticed that the grills were still a little loose. Since this was metal on plastic I went ahead and came back with liquid CA............WHAT A DISASTER!!!![B)][:0]

Even though I had applied masking tape to the surrounding edges, the CA leaked through the tape and damaged various spots on the roof area and ahead of the radiator. So now I have a spare FP45 powered chassis as the body is now "Kitbash Fodder". I've been fortunate to get a dummy off of Ebay. Chance to start over, fresh. [:)][:D]

Lesson learned: Be patient! If you're in a hurry or anxious, don't do it! Wait til you can make the time too work slowly. I was feeling good but was a little anxious to get it done and enjoy the results.[8)] [:p]

BTW: Guys/Gals, if any of you have successfully used something other than CA to glue metal or brass to plastic locomotive bodies, please post it! [;)][:)][:D]

Cheers!

I used Lepage's two-part 5-minute epoxy to bond several brass parts to the plastic loco body of a Spectrum 2-8-0 in retroffitting it with an Elesco feed water heater. I was encouraged to do so after reading MR's Steam Locomotive Projects and Ideas, compiled by John Pryke. Pryke rates the effectiveness of various bonding mechanisms, epoxy being good on styrene, zinc casting and brass, marginal on flexible plastic, subject to being messy to use, with thick visible bond even when painted. Again, as others have said, care and patience in applying pays off, whether epoxy, CA, liquid cement or Testors. Like painting, don't do it when you're feeling impatient, pressed for time or tired and crabby.
[:)]