Acela026 Hello, I'm just curious to see if anyone has ever attempted to start a model railroad club before. With the closest club an hour away, my family considers it inconvenient (I would have to agree on most occasions) to drive me there and back for an hour or two of modeling....
Hello,
I'm just curious to see if anyone has ever attempted to start a model railroad club before. With the closest club an hour away, my family considers it inconvenient (I would have to agree on most occasions) to drive me there and back for an hour or two of modeling....
I assume the reason for not driving yourself is age - and not something else (there are other possible explanations).
If my assumption is correct, your current situation is not stable enough to start and organize the long term commitment to a true club (complete with layout).
I'm in a similar situation (although much older) - my current life does not lend itself to a commitment to a club. And I don't have the resources (time, money, or space) to achieve what I would like to achieve at home.
What I have chosen to do is to affiliate with a modular group that is located about an hour away. Although I can't attend the biweekly meetings due to my work schedule, I do attend some-to-most of the Saturday work sessions, and will attend most setups. The modular group gives me a chance to build my own modules, and be a contributing member of the group. Using a national standard (I'm partial to Free-mo in the various scales and gauges) means that my modules can be used at the setups of other groups using the same standard, as well as my own home group. And it's given me a chance to meet some great guys and grow in the hobby.
A note of caution based on past experience with clubs - you will run into a few folks who rub you the wrong way. As has been expressed here by others in this and other threads on the subject, documenting agreements is critical. This is especially true for modular groups. It's very easy for undocumented personal preferences to slip into the group's "standards" - that's when the disagreements start.
The other obvious question for clubs, groups, and potential members is "what does the group plan to achieve in the next year? 3 years? 5 years?" This is where most clubs and groups fail - no concrete future goal(s) identified in writing. Nature abhors a vacuum, and so the various group members substitute their own future vision for the group's. And then everybody wonders why all the disagreements are happening between supposedly reasonable people. And it's because they never had a common goal beyond the immediate project in the 1st place.
Whether it's to start monthly prototype operations sessions in 2013, or add 6 more modules to the normal setup by next summer - the goals have the wonderful effect of prioritizing people's efforts, and pointing all in the same direction. Regularly setting a longer term goal avoids the dreaded, "We finished this, what now?" question. Another benefit of written goals is that it gives potential new members a basis for evaluating the group or club. "Will I be content with working towards the club's goals?" is a question that should be asked of every new prospect.
just my thoughts
Fred W
You must purchase your building and today this is quite practical as so much is available at bargain prices and for very low cost financing. Shares may be sold to members, or there are many ways to spread the costs. I've belonged to too many clubs decades back where for one reason or another.....out they went! One such episode I had heard about was a beautiful pike in a church basement. Apparently one member made a serious pass at the deacon's teenage daughter, and then the club and layout had a very short tiime to move. Point......vulnerability!
The other problem is what to use and from who? A good club will have department captains like benchwork, electronics, roadbed, track laying, scenery, structures, and operations. The most proficient in each of these areas should serve as the honcho and all else work under and with him. Other important jobs are fund raising and club manager.
All doable and with the right folks....great fun as sharing the hobby with others is what much of it is about.
HZ
We were a well established club to begin with and we did shows around the Hampton Roads area all year long. Some of shows even caused us to remove large sections of the semi perminate layout. This was all good and we had fun. The club currently has another temp space to set up the modules in and they still do the shows around the area just like before. I have not been able to see the new layout since I dont live there any more but I do stay in contact with a few of the members.
Massey
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SMassey CTValleyRR: Unfortunately, the problem with such "donated" space is that, when a paying customer does come along, the poor MR club often gets unceremoniously evicted. Yes this is the downside of the whole deal. When my modular club in VIrginia Beach got the chance to fill an empty store in the local mall for a few months we jumped on the chance to do it. The store used to hold a hobby store, and the store manager was a member of our club too. We knew the time was limited due to a construction project, but it was great being able to run 70+ car trains over the layout and even at full speed it would take almost 5 minutes to go around once. There were very few times that our club had the ability to bring out that many modules for public shows. We would also open the layout to the public on the weekends while we were there and that helped us gain a couple new railroaders!. The whole deal may be temporary but it could be worth it too. Massey
CTValleyRR: Unfortunately, the problem with such "donated" space is that, when a paying customer does come along, the poor MR club often gets unceremoniously evicted.
Unfortunately, the problem with such "donated" space is that, when a paying customer does come along, the poor MR club often gets unceremoniously evicted.
Yes this is the downside of the whole deal. When my modular club in VIrginia Beach got the chance to fill an empty store in the local mall for a few months we jumped on the chance to do it. The store used to hold a hobby store, and the store manager was a member of our club too. We knew the time was limited due to a construction project, but it was great being able to run 70+ car trains over the layout and even at full speed it would take almost 5 minutes to go around once. There were very few times that our club had the ability to bring out that many modules for public shows. We would also open the layout to the public on the weekends while we were there and that helped us gain a couple new railroaders!.
The whole deal may be temporary but it could be worth it too.
Very true. And that extra exposure may help to attract members to the club, or to the hobby in general.
Too often though, the loss of a space like this means the end of the club, or at least the layout. I guess if you're ever using a location that you can't consider more or less permanent, a modular layout is the only way to go.
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CTValleyRR Unfortunately, the problem with such "donated" space is that, when a paying customer does come along, the poor MR club often gets unceremoniously evicted.
SMassey One other thing to consider as well, if your club is a true NOT FOR PROFIT club and you have the tax documents to prove it some landlords will donate you space so long as you pay the utilities until a perminate paying resident can be found. This is a charitable tax write off for them and it keeps the space they are trying to rent occupied so that it does not develop any strange guests or smells. Empty retail space can be pretty nasty if it has not been occupied for a while. Massey
One other thing to consider as well, if your club is a true NOT FOR PROFIT club and you have the tax documents to prove it some landlords will donate you space so long as you pay the utilities until a perminate paying resident can be found. This is a charitable tax write off for them and it keeps the space they are trying to rent occupied so that it does not develop any strange guests or smells. Empty retail space can be pretty nasty if it has not been occupied for a while.
Thanks for the advice, guys. Unless I win the lottery I don't think much will happen. I might look into the modular club that has been mentioned. Biggest problem is the lack of a LHS. Closest one is an hour away.
Acela
The timbers beneath the rails are not the only ties that bind on the railroad. --Robert S. McGonigal
Organizing and running a formal organization is a huge undertaking. I've been a leader in our local cub scout organization for 9 years now (and they have a national organization to back us up), and helped my wife run a local choir and orchestra for about half that long.
Unless you are prepared for a major investment in time and effort.... fuhgeddabowdit. Because at the end of the day, most of the people out there want to enjoy the benefits without putting in any of the effort. And if I am interpreting correctly that you are a younger person who lives at home and doesn't have your own transportation (and maybe not even your own phone and computer), that will make things even harder.
Setting up what others have called a "round robin", or even a discussion group, that doesn't have their own layout would eliminate many of these issues. For the price of a little bit of advertising, you can probably find some like-minded folks who would want to participate at that level.
But as soon as you start trying to get into a more formal organization, with its own layout, you need bylaws, finances, and organization, and that's where the mess starts. Unless you're lucky enough to find someone to donate space, figure a couple of dollars a square foot (the space, not the layout) for rent, plus about $500 a month for utilities (a lot would depend on how often the lights were on, air conditioning & heating arrangements, security, etc.). Figure a 20x30 foot layout would require about 1000 square feet (aisles, workbench space, storage, in addition to the layout), and your looking at a rent bill of over $2G's a month. Splitting this kind of cost among even 10 people is a pretty big hit, and wouldn't leave much left over for modeling expenses. As someone else pointed out, if you become beholden to one of the members, either for the space, a large capital infusion, or a lot of supplies, be prepared to cater to that person's wishes more than you probably want to.
Not that any of these obstacles are insurmountable. Far from it. But unless you're prepared to invest a lot of time and energy, I'd keep things on an informal level.
Our club in Sebring FL has no fixed location. we have about 30 members of which about 25 will show up for the monthly meetings. We pay a local church a stipend to use one of their meeting rooms for meetings. Our interests run from N thru 71/2 inch gauge. We have a modular HO layout that is housed in members homes and we set it up about 4-5 times a year for public viewing. We hold about 3 social functions a year and those are well attended. We have minimum overhead and our dues are in the $15-$20 a year range. Minimum downside risk and a great group of guys(and gals). Our club has been actually growing the last year or two. Skill level ranges all over the place but at our setups anybody can run whatever their want.The key for us is we don't have a bunch of rules and requirements. We have bi-laws, and officers but ridged we are not. I second the idea of going informal at first and see where that takes you. Having a building and a big layout sounds great but it is a high risk operation. We use the KISS method and it works for us.
There is no club in my immediate area either. I have looked at posts on starting one up and have seen many of the pros and cons mentioned. You could do a Search our Community on the right side of this page to find some of the earlier comments.
I think I would lean toward starting a round robin group, going to see and maybe operate on each others layouts to see how folks get along. The get together and chat and share information mentioned above would work well for starters.
All the people in the group need not have all the same main interests or scale layouts at home. It is helpful to have some that are good carperter, electricians, scenery specialists and the like. That way, with someone to make sure each phase goes well, they can teach others their skills and learn other skills from the others.
To have a formal "organization" can get a bit complicated and takes time. A singing group I am in is working on becoming a formal non-profit, so they can get large (tax deductable) donations from sponsors. The paper work mentioned at our recent meeting is overwhelming. There certainly are model rr clubs that have stuck it out and been very successful.
Good luck,
Richard
Starting a club is like forming a hippie commune. Everybody had better be friendly and gregarious, have similar (if not identical) ideas and all be willing to subject themselves to a little discipline and a lot of peer pressure. The leader, especially, must be an alpha personality, likeable and wide open to the suggestions of others. And it's probably a very good idea for everyone to have been friends, or friends of friends, first.
I have been involved with startup clubs and have been a member of established clubs. I have also run screaming into the night from startup groups and from established clubs which were averse to me and my idea of a good time.
This above all else. A club is a formal, businesslike organization. If what you really want is friendship and fellowship, a loosely-connected round-robin group will be a more comfortable fit than something which has an address, a board of officers and a requirement for dues and assessments. I admit that my own preferences (a foreign prototype in a sub-minority scale, and some inability to suffer fools gladly) color my thinking. Other opinions are sure to differ.
Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - when not howling at the moon)
Years ago I help form a club and I soon learn it takes three things:
1.Dedication to the cause.Without this don't even think about starting a club.
2.Time..Its very time consuming and one must be willing to spend the time needed to keep the ball rolling-you can't half step or you will fail..
3.Planing the goals of the club.This should be discuss and voted on in the beginning by the founding members realizing these goals might require some tweaking along the way.
All members should have a equal voice and vote..
As far as money..Be willing to donate to the cause until the club's treasure is built up.
One more thing and this may seem harsh but,could save a lot of headaches.
IMHO its best to have prospective members to attend several meetings so you will get to know them before allowing membership..It costs nothing and gives both the prospective member and the membership the chance to see how well they will fit in.
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
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There are different types of clubs. If there are four other modelers in your town, you all could get together and form what is known as a Round-Robin group. You would go to each others homes and help with their layout. You would be taking direction from the layout owner. This can be fun with the right people, and you can still learn things, may be faster than in a large club, because you can get individual learning experience.
The other thing that comes to mind for you, is find these other folks and see if you all can form a car pool to go to the larger club that is an hour away. Since you don't drive yet, maybe you could help out with the gas.
Elmer.
The above is my opinion, from an active and experienced Model Railroader in N scale and HO since 1961.
(Modeling Freelance, Eastern US, HO scale, in 1962, with NCE DCC for locomotive control and a stand alone LocoNet for block detection and signals.) http://waynes-trains.com/ at home, and N scale at the Club.
I've been a member of a large, long-established club (est. 1938) for 18 years, and I was in a start-up small club for a few years (for as long as it lasted).
My advice is that you must start with a clear understanding of what is going to happen among all the potential members. You have to clearly define the purpose of the club from Day 1. Things like scale, prototype (if any), era (if any), and a module or permanent layout. Then you have to define if it's going to be a formal or informal club with by-laws or almost no rules at all. The idea here is for all the founding members to agree on a purpose, and then stick to that purpose for the forseeable future. Write the rules down! Give everyone a copy and have them sign it. Post these rules in the club space for all to see, even if the only rule is to "Have fun!" My point is that if the way the club is operated is agreed to by all and it's clearly written down, it tends to avoid incidents and arguments.
Also, avoid egomaniacs. If it's their way or the highway, show them the door. Every good member must realize that they will have to sacrafice for the good of the club. Compromise is the name of the game in a group setting. You will not get your way 100% of the time, and things you will be criticized and commented upon...and not necessarily in a postive way. If someone can't take that, they shouldn't be in any club.
Lastly, you must not give control of the club to any single member. For example, at my old start-up club, we were set up in a building that was owned by the brother of one of the founding members (I'll call him, "R"). What killed the club was when member "R" decided he didn't like something or if he wanted something to happen, he'd threaten to quit. And his brother, the building owner, told us that if his brother "R" quit the club, he'd double the rent. Therefore, we eventually realized that we weren't building our club layout, we were just building a layout for "R". Things went quickly downhill after that, and we all just faded away.
Paul A. Cutler III
Recruiting a membership is the major hurdle. Once you have some members, the other things will sort them selves out. Contact every one you know, even if they are not railroaders, perhaps they have friends who are. Put up a website, Put up a facebook page. Get on facebook yourself and spread the word. Post advertisements in local stores, schools, churches, especially the local hobby shop. Post notices on every model railroad website, including this one. Go door to door. Run an ad in the local paper. Put up yard signs. Run an ad in a model railroading magazine. Go to train shows and distribute flyers. Anything to get the word out. You said you lived in a town of 40,000. If one in a thousand is a model railroader, that's forty potential members.
Plenty of clubs are very successful even without a club layout. Just getting together now and then to talk trains and show off models is fun. A modular layout is obviously lower cost than a permanent club layout. Or, members with home layouts can host meetings.
David Starr www.newsnorthwoods.blogspot.com
[quote user="Acela026"]
I'm just curious to see if anyone has ever attempted to start a model railroad club before. With the closest club an hour away, my family considers it inconvenient (I would have to agree on most occasions) to drive me there and back for an hour or two of modeling. My town is about 40,000 people, about 4 of them (0.0001%) interested. Sure, a cheap ad in the local paper might bring in a few more to an 'informational meeting'.
My main question is: how hard is it to set up and what are the costs? (a bit broad a question, but that's the best way to put it)
Thanks!
The biggest issue in my opinion would be rental space for the club, followed by the utility bills. But this would be for a permanent railroad. If you go the modular route, then you'd be building your part of the railroad either in your basement or the garage. Then the two big expenses disappear, or are really absorbed by your family because you live there anyway. So now your expenses become of a more personal nature because you can spend as much or as little as your budget allows.
Of course when you want to meet to set up and connect everyone's modules, you'll need a place to go. But around here the larger train shows sometimes welcome modular groups to set up, because the show owners want things to attract the public. So you'd get to set up for a day or two at no cost.
Concerning your estimate of possibly interested parties, I think there are a lot of closet model railroaders. Even in my neighborhood of 42 homes, I know that there is one, and possibly two more that are interested. But these are people that don't want to join a formal, permanent, club where there is an obligation to go on a weekly basis to work as a group. But they might be willing to work at home on their part of the whole as time and money become available.
HI ACELA: This is old info, so don't know if it will work for you, as it did for me. People's attitudes, interests, finances, family situations, etc. are probably a lot different now, than they were 24 yrs. ago. In April, 1987, ran ad in local newspaper, stating I was seeking like-minded serious HO model railroaders w/ intention of starting prototypical HO Modular Club. Had 4 folks show up, after they'd called [ my phone # was in ad ]. Only 1 of the 4 stayed interested. Few days later, more folks called, as they'd also seen ad or family member told them about it. We ended up w/ 11 members; all very interested in making new club a success. It lasted over 6 yrs. w/ all original members and a few more after I had to leave due to family illness. T'was a real education, a lot of fun AND hard work. Everyone chipped in with expenses, when buying lumber, screws, plywood, Homasote, track, turnouts, paint, Hydrocal, etc. Many donated mrr supplies they already had; we made out well. Our building sessions were in 2 member's garages. They also stored some of the modules for us, with the rest spread out to other members and we later built a large, covered trailer w/module racks. Most fun was when we got good enough to attend our first train show; could run our trains there. Many friendships have endured to this day. TTFN and GOOD LUCK!....Old Tom aka papasmurf in NH
I would be interested in this topic as well. I would like to start a modular club in the lower Puget Sound area that serves the lower Puget Sound from say Olympia to Dupont. I did a modular club back when I lived in VA and it was more fun than many of the things I have done. The best part is the look of a kid that gets to take the thottle of a train for the first time and run a loop or two around the layout. We had great community support back in VA and the club is still going strong today.