Athearn or MTH Challenger?

[DAVID REED1]

I have a MTH big boy, brilliant sound, transmission not good, drive shaft plastic, uj, steel, shaft wears out very quick,also wont go around sharp curves,good detail, but derail often,made a lot of adjustments to it to get it to run better,

i also have a Marklin Trix, Big Boy, i fitted new Loksound, best loco i have,never derails,goes around sharpest curves, had it 10 years plus, Athearn Clallengers are very good too.  

Dave.

Kieran Orrell

 

Hello

I'm thinking about purchasing a HO 4-6-6-4 Challenger, but am unsure whether to go with the Athearn Genesis or MTH model. My understanding is that the MTH model is more detailed, and the casing is metal, opposed to Athearn's plastic. I do know that MTH uses DCS instead of the industry standard DCC, which is slightly mind boggling. I haven't a clue as far as sound is concerned in either model. I would be able to acquire an Athearn Challenger for almost half the price of a MTH version, which in many ways makes the Athearn model a more attractive purchase. If anyone with knowledge concerning either model could share their opinions about the two versions, I would be grateful.

Thanks

 

[Flashwave]

Allegheny2-6-6-6

A6 Cab Forward, an Erie Triplex, and a Clinchfield Challenger

HO? or O? I didn't think the AC6 was out yet? When was it released?

[Allegheny2-6-6-6]

 Hands down the MTH is a much better model in all respects with one exception the price of course. So you have to ask yourself how important is all the extra hoopla you get with an MTH. I own several of them that I only own because I was in the right place at the right time. Some friend of a friend desperately wanted some antique Harley parts that I had (little did he know I had dozens of what he wanted) and we got to chit chatting and one he told em he was also a model railroader but had lost interest and his new interest was restoring this old rust bucket and trying to prove to himself he was 17 years old again. While looking at his layout I spotted three MTH locomotives and said I'll swap you the Harley parts for those three right there.an A6 Cab Forward, an Erie Triplex, and a Clinchfield Challenger

He looked at me like I just fell off the turnip truck  and said you've got a deal.I wish I had the money or he needed a lot more stuff as I could have walked away with his entire layout for a song. An other example of person with way too much money and very little brains.

They are some truly fine models, are they worth the money well that something only you can say for sure. If I hadn't stumbled across that deal there is no way I could afford those engines.

[Kieran Orrell]

Thanks for the replies. The Athearn challenger I hoped to buy is no longer for sale, so it looks like I will probably just purchase one of the Big Boys Athearn will hopefully be releasing in May.

[Flashwave]

UP 4-12-2

The MTH engine can run on DCC but with some limitations.

One issue with DCS vs. DCC is the swtich from one to DC power. For whatever reason, the DCS decoders don't make an easy jump from DC to DCC, and one ends up with frequent runaways at Notch 9, or arious functions not repsonding when others will. Motor control, sound, certain sounds. (This may have been corrected, but not before the 4449 was released I know.) MTH may be doing the Challenger in DC, it's at least possible since they're doing the SD70s in DC and DCS, in which case it all comes down to pulling power and detail.

As faras MRC decoders go, I'm mixed. The one in my Big Boy runs the engine fine, and the sound isn't bad. Not great, but not bad. I do wish the actual Big Boy whistle was louder, but it is fun running that monster enginearound with a whistle from the Durango and SIlverton Narrow Gauge. The decoder in my P2K 0-8-0 on the other hand, cuts out on switches. This could be due to the 8's wheelbase, not the decoder, but I din't notice the problem when it was on standard DC, or at least that badly. SO I'm inclined to suspect the decoder. It dies it's job nicely enough though, otherwise.

[UP 4-12-2]

Keeping it real--some people have complained about 1 negative with the MTH Challenger:  The electronic indexing of the chuff to the axle revolutions results in a very slight "cogging" effect with every quarter turn of the driver revolutions.  If the sound is turned off, this seems to go away (or mine has just run-in).

Some have found the "cogging" effect can minimally affect coupler slack in the train behind it, and were unhappy about that.

The good news is that after several hours of running--and mine has been run plenty--the "cogging effect" diminishes greatly if not 100% completely gone.

After being the main engine we run, maybe 4 hours per week, over the last 6 months, mine runs incredibly well, and I'd put it up against the best engines I've ever seen in performance on the layout, regardless of price.  It will easily pull a lot more than what I have to put behind it.

Also--the tender axles have spring tension against them, do not pick up power quite as well as the other steamers that were designed by MTH (Challenger was a Lionel design)--but if kept clean, the power pickup is very good, and definitely better than the BLI Paragon 2-10-0 or any of the Blueline mikados that I had owned last year.

In general, I find the MTH steamers to be slightly more tolerant of track dirt than BLI's.

John

[cudaken]

  Far as I know, the Athearn Challenger has a MRC decoder in it.There are few Kind words about MRC decoders. In fact, Athearn has stopped using them in there current engines if that tells you anything.

 I had 2 of the Athearn Big Boys, I took them back when the decoders started acting up. I like they way they sound while they where working, but they lasted a week, 2 at the most before they started acting up. 

      Cuda Ken

[UP 4-12-2]

I own the MTH Challenger, and it is a fantastic model--very impressive in service on the layout!  It runs great--and the articulated sound, illuminated numberboards, classification lights, headlights, red tender warning light, and backup lights are terrific--as also is the smoke should one choose to use it!  It is my 3-year old son's favorite engine--more than 90% of the time he chooses to run it over all other steamers including Gordon, Henry, and the other Thomas engines which we also have.

As far as DCS versus DCC--this has been rehashed many times--but it would be well to remember that at the time MTH developed their DCS system, DCC was not as advanced as it is now.  The DCS system has some nice advantages--such as allowing very easy doubleheading of any MTH motive power--because they all run together at all speed steps.

The MTH engine can run on DCC but with some limitations.

The MTH engine has a nice heavy diecast boiler and tracks very well on the layout.  The deep steamboat whistle is right on the money, and the articulated chuff is way cool.  With plenty of hours on it since September, there is virtually no wear at all on the wheel plating--which is vastly better than any of the BLI engines I owned last year, all of which showed plating loss to base metal very early on.

The Athearn Challenger does in fact have more detailing on it.  If you are a purist craving all the detail possible, the Athearn might be the better choice.

I have not had a chance to run the Athearn one, but did almost buy one.  If I had the money at the present time, and an Athearn was available, I'd get it too--just because I love Challengers.

John

[Railcon44]

You could also contact Steve Gill at Ulrich model trains and ask him about the revolution and he also does installation. Do a search for Ulrich model trains.

[Railcon44]

 I would get the Athearn and than run it for a while and than look into the Qsi revolution sound decoder for an upgrade. I did this with my Trix Big Boy and i'm glade i did. you can see and hear the Big Boy with the Qsi revolution on you tube. I'm really considering on installing the revolution in my Athrean Challenger and my Big Boy.

[PJM20]

I have some athearn lcomotives and they have never failed in anyway. Great sound too! - Peter

[BRAKIE]

I second the Athearn suggestion.

[Anonymous]

 Most of the detail you notice only when your nose is an inch away from the loco - at least I do. Go to your LHS and have a look at both, then decide.

I´d go for the Athearn loco and spend the balance on extra rolling stock, or get another loco!

[Kieran Orrell]

Hello

I'm thinking about purchasing a HO 4-6-6-4 Challenger, but am unsure whether to go with the Athearn Genesis or MTH model. My understanding is that the MTH model is more detailed, and the casing is metal, opposed to Athearn's plastic. I do know that MTH uses DCS instead of the industry standard DCC, which is slightly mind boggling. I haven't a clue as far as sound is concerned in either model. I would be able to acquire an Athearn Challenger for almost half the price of a MTH version, which in many ways makes the Athearn model a more attractive purchase. If anyone with knowledge concerning either model could share their opinions about the two versions, I would be grateful.

Thanks