Actually, if you take a razor saw to the base and the little "grip" things on the top of the trestles, then cut them in half, they make servicable bridge abutments. Other than that, leave 'em out.
The WS foam risers work really well. If you use the foam pins to position them, or even a weak adhesive like rubber cement, you can reposition them at leisure, and you're guaranteed a nice, smooth grade. The only downside is the price.
I have successfully made inclines by cutting a piece of 2x4 to the desired incline using a speed square and a circular saw, and using that as a template to sculpt 2" extruded foam panels. A lot more work, but you have complete freedom on shape and grade.
Connecticut Valley Railroad A Branch of the New York, New Haven, and Hartford
"If you think you can do a thing or think you can't do a thing, you're right." -- Henry Ford
What comany makes the most reliable bridges/kits? I don't mind putting in the time to build a decent bridge, the problem is, I am not that good at building.
Should I just go to a show and look for a really expensive assembled painted bridge and just take my chances with that? Or are there any high end kits you recommend?
I will buy the WS product for the grades, no plastic risers for me.
A2666:
I was referring to the $8.50 Warren truss too. It's a good enough little bridge. The deck-truss version is nice enough, too, although I think it looks more typical if you invert the side members so that the longer chord is on the bottom.
I'm not refering tot he Atlas single track truss bridge kit that sells in the $25 neighborhood but rather the $8.50 special. It has a place a round the Christmas tree ring of horn hooked cars hooked to an 0-6-0.
Hey I am the first guy to understand the lack of funding all railroads seemed to be plauged with and I too look for alternatives but there are just some times your better off keeping the money in your pocket then wasting it.
The Atlas bridge is a decent enough bridge. Your B&B and motive power departments obviously had a miscommunication. Sadly, this is not restricted to models. The PRR ran into a little difficulty once with a borrowed engine whose crosshead was larger than the drawing showed. The trackside structures were exactly where the drawings showed. You can guess the results.
(They were testing the engine...I think it might have been a C&O 2-10-4)
I've seen a bridge somewhere (a plate girder) whose triangular deck gussets had suspiciously aligned scarring. Hmm...
I don't see why the OP can't just plunk stuff down and play with it. It might help him work out a track plan. The roadbed track out there now probably supports itself better on the plastic risers than the old plain track did, if that's what he's using. If and when he upgrades, the bridges are reusable. The wood trestle bents can be made into short culverts or loading ramps with a few added stringers. If he's using the stone Atlas piers, those can go under bridges, or be cut into retaining walls or culverts. Carl Caiati had an article in RMC on that, a few years back. I think it was RMC.
Well if you don't have the paitents or the time to build your railroad maybe you shouldn't. Not trying to be a wise guy but the hobby is supposed to be fun and enjoyable it's not a race to the finish. If you go the rout of running higher end engines on cheap bridges and pastci risers you will get extremely frustrated and disgusted with the hobby. Do you really want to spend a couple or maybe $400 on a high end locomotive to have it fall off an incline made of plastic risers and smash inot a pile of expensive junk? A word on those cheap bridges they are jsut that cheap and trainset quality, have you ever heard the old saying you can dress up a pig but he's still a pig. I thought in the interest of saving a few dollars I would take one of the Atlas single track truss bridges you know the one's you see in the LHS for under $10 and detail it and weather it to make it look more realsitic as I needed a ver short bridge on one section of a branch line spur. So I installed code 83 track where code 100 was and spent some time painting etc. I planted the bridge and ran one of my big articulated pulling a 25 car consist over it. The train slammed to a dead stop and I spent almost 45 minutes checking track work and rolling stock and turnouts cusring up a storm. I could not figure out where I made a mistake. Well I finally figured it out. The triangular support gussets molded into the Atlas bridge were too big and the valve gear of the locomotive slammed right into it stopping the train dead. I ripped out the bridge and threw it in the garbage which I should have done in the first place. So if you want to throw good money after bad go right ahead, I learned my lesson.
A nice thing about the Woodland Scenics products is it makes it easier down the road to make an adjustment...like if you realize by moving the mainline over 3" you'd have room to add another industry. It's a lot harder to do that when you've cut up the plywood base to allow for grades etc.(That's another reason I like Kato Unitrack too!)
Should you use the plastic bridge supports for your track the track will have no support except where the supports are leaving the track to bow under the weight of the train. Usually these systems result in a very steep grade as well. Should you want to use them be sure to support the track between the plastic bridge supports.
The Woodland Scenics grades work very well. The Longview Kelso & Rainier Ry. is built on two inch insulfoam with the grade on the branchline a Woodland Scenics 3% grade kit. Latex Liquid Nails was used to fasten things together. DON'T use any solvent based glue with foam. Cork roadbed was then glued over the grade kit and held with "T"pins until the Liquid Nails had dried.
The layout here in the house is built on wood benchwork and 3/8ths plyboard. A sabre saw was used to cut plyboard subroadbed and cork was nailed to that with 1/2 X 20 wire nails. The grades were mathmaticly figured and risers made for the subroadbed.
markpierce twhite Those WS risers go up FAST! It took me about two days to grade my entire 24x24' garage layout with them, so it should take you, what--an hour? ..... But seriously, don't discount the WS risers. They work like a charm and go in really fast. Never tried WS risers or foam subroadbed. Never had the desire or need. Cutting plywood with a sabre saw works quite well and creates nice vertical curves at grade changes. Now, if for some reason absolutely no carpentry work is possible or I want a base for a small diorama... Mark (a plywood and homasote kind of guy)
twhite Those WS risers go up FAST! It took me about two days to grade my entire 24x24' garage layout with them, so it should take you, what--an hour? ..... But seriously, don't discount the WS risers. They work like a charm and go in really fast.
Those WS risers go up FAST! It took me about two days to grade my entire 24x24' garage layout with them, so it should take you, what--an hour? ..... But seriously, don't discount the WS risers. They work like a charm and go in really fast.
Never tried WS risers or foam subroadbed. Never had the desire or need. Cutting plywood with a sabre saw works quite well and creates nice vertical curves at grade changes. Now, if for some reason absolutely no carpentry work is possible or I want a base for a small diorama...
Mark (a plywood and homasote kind of guy)
Mark:
Agreed. Your technique will produce not only good grades, but a very solid bunch of benchwork. My solution works well for me simply because my carpentry skills are somewhere beteen 'lacking' and 'nonexistant', LOL!
I'd read about the foam base and foam construction in an article in MR, and decided to try it. With a little (well a LOT) of help from my next door neighbor who is good at woodwork, we got the framework accomplished in a couple of days, and then I crossed my fingers as I began laying the 2" Corning foam as the base. This was back when you could GET 2" Corning foam here in California.
I will admit that until I started doing the scenery, the results with the pink foam and the white risers got quite a few comments from my neighbors, who were always dropping by to see the progress on "Tom's strawberry Sundae."
But it's held together very well for me the past 8 years or so. I was amazed at how sturdy foam is when it gets stacked. Can't walk on it, of course--but I haven't had any trouble with expansion, contraction or warpage in the garage. Especially with some of the temperature fluctuations we get here in Carmichael.
So in that respect, at least, it's worked out very well for me. But I certainly don't recommend it for everyone.
Tom
Tom View my layout photos! http://s299.photobucket.com/albums/mm310/TWhite-014/Rio%20Grande%20Yuba%20River%20Sub One can NEVER have too many Articulateds!
Add another vote in favor of the Atlas bridges. I even modified the floor system on one to skew it one panel width, which the prototype would have done where it crossed another track at an angle.
I have used those plastic trestle bents on some very temporary trackage. Used in conjunction with rigid-roadbed sectional track, they produced angular grade changes at top and bottom, where cookie-cut plywood will give a nice smooth vertical transition. My 2-8-2, B-2-B diesel hydraulic and 1-Bo+Bo-1 catenary motor were NOT pleased. Fortunately that line was only used for a short time, by an 0-6-0T and some four wheeled gons full of rail joiners and track spikes. Final verdict? UGLY!!
Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - with, among other things, kitbashed bridges)
Hey thanks guys, I'll definately try the WS risers. Before all we did was measure out and cut wood blocks for risers, then use a circular saw to cut out 'planks' for supporting the track underneath. We didn't do a good job, eventually ripped it down because it came out too steep. The whole project took forever and wasn't worth the effort.
Glad to hear WS risers are easy to install, I'll go with them.
I'll agree wholeheartedly with Mr. Beasley:
Those WS risers go up FAST! It took me about two days to grade my entire 24x24' garage layout with them, so it should take you, what--an hour?
Seriously, the plastic trestle supports are not going to work for you, especially on curves. After a few hours of running, you'll probably have derailments all over the place.
However the Atlas bridges will work just fine, once you get your grades installed. A little painting, a little weathering, they'll look right at home.
But seriously, don't discount the WS risers. They work like a charm and go in really fast.
Best of luck.
rjake4454I really don't have to want to work with woodland scenics grades at this point, (excellent product), but I don't have the time or the patience.
If you are short on time and patience, that's all the more reason to use the WS risers. They are going to give you a solid, reliable, even grade. If you use the train-set trestles and piers, you will be forever dealing with poor trackwork. You can't go around curves well with these things, because they don't provide the right support.
rjake4454 Is this a recipe for frustration and disaster, thats what I would like to know.
Yes, it is.
The bridges are OK, though. I've got several Atlas bridges on my layout, and they look and work fine. Improve them with some paint and weathering, if you want, or just leave them as-bought to get up and running quickly. Just make sure you support the ends well.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
rjake4454 How do you guys feel about those plastic risers they sell for simple layouts with grades?
How do you guys feel about those plastic risers they sell for simple layouts with grades?
You really don't want to know.
...And send us some photos and a self-critique.
Sounds like you know what you want to do. So...just do it!
How do you guys feel about those plastic risers they sell for simple layouts with grades? My brother had a box of these when he was a kid, never got around to using them. Are they somewhat acceptable, or should I stay away from them entirely? I have long steamers and diesels.
I don't have the time for complicated bench work, to make bridges the proper way. My table will be all flat, probably a U shaped configuration or perhaps some kind of large L, (I have tried the donut before, and kind of hated it)
I really don't have to want to work with woodland scenics grades at this point, (excellent product), but I don't have the time or the patience. I want immediate results, that way, if I don't like it, I can just get rid of the plastic risers and keep the layout flat.
I would like to run higher end engines on pretty cheap HO bridges right now (you know, the 'train set' type that sells for $20 or less), to keep it simple. Then if I like it, I can always go forward with WS grades. Is this a recipe for frustration and disaster, thats what I would like to know.