Well, I think we've been around the block enough on this topic. Since neither side is going to convince the other side of thinking any differently, let's move on. Thanks.
Tom
https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling
Time...It marches on...without ever turning around to see if anyone is even keeping in step.
Then if you don't like them then try one or two different kits---maybe a craftman's kit?---and see how they work out. Enjoy----
Any argument carried far enough will end up in Semantics--Hartz's law of rhetoric Emerald. Leemer and Southern The route of the Sceptre Express Barry
I just started my blog site...more stuff to come...
http://modeltrainswithmusic.blogspot.ca/
wm3798 I still dispute that the walls would have been significantly out of square. The only possibility in my mind is that there was a packaging error, wherein the rear wall from a wider kit was included in the kit you had. Again, this is something that could be caught by inspecting the clear ziplock packaging before buying. Lee
I still dispute that the walls would have been significantly out of square. The only possibility in my mind is that there was a packaging error, wherein the rear wall from a wider kit was included in the kit you had.
Again, this is something that could be caught by inspecting the clear ziplock packaging before buying.
Lee
Kinda hard to do when I wasn't there when it was bought (as indicated in the original post). Were I there I wouldn't have bought it. As far as "K-mart" Model Power kits go, I don't think Jeff or I said we actually buy that brand. I also never said DPM kits were over-priced or that I expected the highest quality for the cost of a DPM kit. I simply said the quality I've encountered so far in the 3 kits I've built (including this gift, an N scale furniture factory and a freight house) has been poor, and I stand by the statement.
Semi-related question...where is the best place online to buy DPM kits? Most LHS's near me only carry the modular stuff, I would like to pick up a kit to work on this winter.
While I have never built a DPM kit in N scale I have built several in HO scale and have always found them quite acceptable. Sure there are quirks and such but with some imagination they turn out to be very nice buildings. And if you get a corner that you just can't get flush, well, a little ground foam or turf makes great vines to cover it up.
Just my.
Mainetrains
'there's something happening here, what it is ain't exactly clear' Modeling the Hard Knox Valley Railroad in HO scale http://photos.hardknoxvalley.com/
You can get bad quality products in most anything these days. Sorry to hear the original poster is having so much trouble. Like most have stated here, the DPM's I have obtained have been free of defects. They are a kitbashers' dream,reasonably priced , available & fun to work with . Chances are , try another kit & it'll be ok. Either way it was a gift. so I wouldn't complain too much.
Years ago I bought the Woods Furnature kit from DPM in N scale after reading the review in MR. That kit went together very well and I enjoyed building it. No issues here.
Since my previous post was deleted, I'll try again without being "sarcastic"!! As 90 something percent of the previous posters seem to agree that DPM make a good product, the OP must know something the rest of us don't.
Far from bashing theier quality, I just would like for them to release some of their N scale kits in HO... I'm a sucker for buildings with turrets on them. They make a nice one that way in N scale but it isn't part of their HO line. : (
dlm
I've got one of their kits that's pretty out of square. More of a parallelogram than a rectangle. It is the correct parts and they were put together correctly. Can't really tell once it's built unless your looking for it.
WIAR CNJ831 I would have to agree with Lee that it sounds like you assembled the model improperly. A 2' deviation from square is by no means likely for a properly built DPM model. In fact, I consider DPM as one of the great innovations in hobby kits introduced in the past quarter century, with regards to their quality and price (they started out at $7.98 as I recall). Most of the other available kits for similarly detailed buildings today run several times the price of DPM kits and usually require considerably more work to complete correctly. CNJ831 Nope. The kit was assembled quite correctly. The rear wall fits inside the two side walls (the rear wall has no texturing on the ends while the side walls do have brick texturing. There's no valid reason for the rear wall to be that much wider than is correct. As for the earlier post regarding the suggestion to skip the step of sanding the rear wall's edges to make it perfectly square, that suggestion is stated in the instructions as I indicated in my original post. Instead of producing a better casting, DPM simply opted to instruct the builder on how to correct their mistake (which I suppose is cheaper than actually fixing their molds). Fellas, if you're OK with poor quality at a low price, then fine - knock yourselves out. I like a challenge (and as far as that goes I've worked with more difficult kits than this one with 4 walls and a roof), and this one is turning out well enough to pass muster. I'm simply stating for those who might be considering buying a DPM kit that you will have plenty of work to do to make it look right.
CNJ831 I would have to agree with Lee that it sounds like you assembled the model improperly. A 2' deviation from square is by no means likely for a properly built DPM model. In fact, I consider DPM as one of the great innovations in hobby kits introduced in the past quarter century, with regards to their quality and price (they started out at $7.98 as I recall). Most of the other available kits for similarly detailed buildings today run several times the price of DPM kits and usually require considerably more work to complete correctly. CNJ831
I would have to agree with Lee that it sounds like you assembled the model improperly. A 2' deviation from square is by no means likely for a properly built DPM model. In fact, I consider DPM as one of the great innovations in hobby kits introduced in the past quarter century, with regards to their quality and price (they started out at $7.98 as I recall). Most of the other available kits for similarly detailed buildings today run several times the price of DPM kits and usually require considerably more work to complete correctly.
CNJ831
Nope. The kit was assembled quite correctly. The rear wall fits inside the two side walls (the rear wall has no texturing on the ends while the side walls do have brick texturing. There's no valid reason for the rear wall to be that much wider than is correct.
As for the earlier post regarding the suggestion to skip the step of sanding the rear wall's edges to make it perfectly square, that suggestion is stated in the instructions as I indicated in my original post. Instead of producing a better casting, DPM simply opted to instruct the builder on how to correct their mistake (which I suppose is cheaper than actually fixing their molds).
Fellas, if you're OK with poor quality at a low price, then fine - knock yourselves out. I like a challenge (and as far as that goes I've worked with more difficult kits than this one with 4 walls and a roof), and this one is turning out well enough to pass muster. I'm simply stating for those who might be considering buying a DPM kit that you will have plenty of work to do to make it look right.
The taper on the ends of the rear wall is necessary to allow the wall casting to be released from the mold. You will find this on thicker resin and plaster cast walls in other kits from other manufacturers as well. Check out a Chooch retaining wall or a Woodland Scenics tunnel portal, and you'll find an ever-so-slight taper of the same variety and for the same reason.
This requirement to sand the rear wall ends has nothing to do with DPM not wanting to "correct their mistakes" and everything to do with the physics of releasing very thick castings from molds. You won't find these issues in Model Power kits because the walls are so thin.
...and I'm fine with having to sand walls when necessary. It's a valuable skill in model railroading, up there with soldering.
Modeling the Rio Grande Southern First District circa 1938-1946 in HOn3.
Route of the Alpha Jets www.wmrywesternlines.net
WIARCNJ831 I would have to agree with Lee that it sounds like you assembled the model improperly. A 2' deviation from square is by no means likely for a properly built DPM model. In fact, I consider DPM as one of the great innovations in hobby kits introduced in the past quarter century, with regards to their quality and price (they started out at $7.98 as I recall). Most of the other available kits for similarly detailed buildings today run several times the price of DPM kits and usually require considerably more work to complete correctly. CNJ831 Nope. The kit was assembled quite correctly. The rear wall fits inside the two side walls (the rear wall has no texturing on the ends while the side walls do have brick texturing. There's no valid reason for the rear wall to be that much wider than is correct. As for the earlier post regarding the suggestion to skip the step of sanding the rear wall's edges to make it perfectly square, that suggestion is stated in the instructions as I indicated in my original post. Instead of producing a better casting, DPM simply opted to instruct the builder on how to correct their mistake (which I suppose is cheaper than actually fixing their molds). Fellas, if you're OK with poor quality at a low price, then fine - knock yourselves out. I like a challenge (and as far as that goes I've worked with more difficult kits than this one with 4 walls and a roof), and this one is turning out well enough to pass muster. I'm simply stating for those who might be considering buying a DPM kit that you will have plenty of work to do to make it look right. If we're not supposed to say anything about bad quality simply because it's no worse than what you could get "back in the old days", or because it's cheaper than other brands, than I guess nothing is ever expected to improve in the industry. Forget about getting better products at a lower price - as long as the price is low quality can be overlooked. Sorry, but I get somewhat worked-up when people start questioning a person's skills as a modeller because they raise an issue with a particular brand.
If we're not supposed to say anything about bad quality simply because it's no worse than what you could get "back in the old days", or because it's cheaper than other brands, than I guess nothing is ever expected to improve in the industry. Forget about getting better products at a lower price - as long as the price is low quality can be overlooked.
Sorry, but I get somewhat worked-up when people start questioning a person's skills as a modeller because they raise an issue with a particular brand.
Well....you and Jeffery have fun building your model power "pre-colored" K-mart buildings. As for me, I'll stick with DPM.
Yes
I got another poor DPM kit cause I dont know how to assemble it....... :-(
Diversity is such a wonderful thing---but seriously, if one combines a questionable quality product( in this case a ' warped' DPM kit) with someone who may not have the skills of G.Selios for example wouldn't this kind of mess this whole thing up? I still think it could be both and as others have said, you do get what you pay for---but is the modeller going to be able to work better with a more expensive kit? Or is that going to frustrate the fellow more?
Mind,I still think that DPM makes good product as I still do not have issues with them----
I have several , and I have had no problems , in fact I use them alot for scratch building and kit bashing . Granted they take a little work but isn't that half the fun !
Driline jeffrey-wimberly I haven't touched a DPM kit in years. Model Power's quality is better and that's being generous. You must be kidding. Model Power is is the "K-Mart" of buildings compared to DPM. I've built at least 20 DPM buildings and I must say they are more realistic than most other kits after you paint and weather them. Our local HO club has hundreds of DPM wall, and structures littering the layout. This layout was almost featured in MR about 15 years ago.
jeffrey-wimberly I haven't touched a DPM kit in years. Model Power's quality is better and that's being generous.
I haven't touched a DPM kit in years. Model Power's quality is better and that's being generous.
You must be kidding. Model Power is is the "K-Mart" of buildings compared to DPM. I've built at least 20 DPM buildings and I must say they are more realistic than most other kits after you paint and weather them. Our local HO club has hundreds of DPM wall, and structures littering the layout. This layout was almost featured in MR about 15 years ago.
I agree. I have built N-scale DPM structures in the past and had no serious problems. They make very nice buidlings once finished.
Model Power structures, on the other hand...well... they're cheap and look it.
Oddly my 2 DPM kits went together nicely..
Not so with my Walthers George Roberts Printing.
Here's my song of woe.I been working on that building for the last 3 weeks including painting.The walls came loose-I use glue sparingly so,yesterday I re-glued one of the walls back and let it dry 24 hours and it to failed to stick.So,I will reuse the kit as kitbash fodder or a industrial flat..I usually don't give up this easily but,this building been a pain for the last 3 weeks with its warp window "glass" and walls.
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
WIARFellas, if you're OK with poor quality at a low price, then fine - knock yourselves out.
Well, you certainly shouldn't expect high quality at a low price. You get what you pay for. You want a better-quality model, then prepare to spend some more money on it.
I like the fact that DPM's wall thickness is more prototypical for an early 20th century masonry building. And while the cast in windows are a challenge to work with, they are actually much more to scale and better detailed than many window castings, especially in N scale.
Of course, Model Power buildings do have the advantage of having the parts molded in color...
I'm going to chime in with support for DPM. I work in HO, and have never had a warped or brittle wall. In fact, I've found the DPM plastic some of the most resilent plastic out there. Takes about 5 minutes to square up the walls.
Yes the kits are rather bare, but hay what do you expect for 10 bucks. I can build an entire block of DPM kits for what it costs to buy one new run Walthers building.
Nick
Take a Ride on the Reading with the: Reading Company Technical & Historical Society http://www.readingrailroad.org/
Judging by your use of apostrophes and the word edge is plural, I would assume you are assembling the back wall correctly. I too chuckle at the don't have too sand line, because the bevel left on would leave a gap at the joint. Maybe you were using too small of grit. I know what you mean on the chimneys I have had a couple that just wouldn't match up. And regardless of the price that is frustrating when something will not work.
In DPM's defense. Very few kits of any brand or kind (building, train car or automobile etc), I've assembled did not need a touch with some sandpaper or a file. How about the spru larger than the part? Granted, generally DPM is just 4 walls. An arguement could be made that at least they could get the wall ends square. Most are not, and since you need to sand anyway, it's just a matter of how much. However the four walls that you get are, IMHO, extremely well detailed for the money. I've never experienced a brittle wall or a warped door or anything. DPM is a very well detailed structure or starting point for a scene for the money.
All that being said I model in HO so maybe there is night and day differences between that and N scale. I would say don't buy anymore, but it sounds like you won't and probably wouldn't have this one but she bought it for you as a gift and is probably looking for it when it is done! Been there done that.
Disclaimer: The above comments are based on the writers personal opinions and experiences. Your experience may lead to a much different opinion.
Todd
Central Illinoyz
In order to keep my position as Master and Supreme Ruler of the House, I don't argue with my wife.
I'm a small town boy. A product of two people from even smaller towns. I don’t talk on topic….. I just talk.
Out of square by 2' on both sides? Methinks you were assembling it wrong. Typically on a DPM kit, the front wall is attached to the edges of the side walls, while the rear wall is attached between them...
Also, sanding the proper edges would never affect the cast on details, because the joining edges are always blank. The problem is they might be at a bit of an angle, which is why the light sanding is required to square them up. You should never have to remove more than a millimeter of material.
Maybe you should post a photo of what you did so we can get a handle on why you were having the problems you had with this.
Another possibility would be to suggest what if the area that an out of plumb building is on is soft ground? Example; an area in my city---London ON--- has about 4 houses that are kind of leaning toward/away from each other--in N scale they would look out of plumb noticeably In some of the older parts of town we could see buildings that are not necessarily in good shape so one could model that approach as well---but still if you are going to do any modelling first attempts are not going to be masterpieces. That is why the first pieces I made are in the older, or more delapitated parts of town---or abandoned-- another example would be in places where mine shafts and such would/could have collapsed---I'm thinking about those possibilities as well because these earlier attempts at modelling buildings still would be useful---not make the person crabby at DPM for issues---
WIARLet's keep this in scale, shall we? Yes, were you to wander my house with a square you would indeed find places where corners are not perfectly square. Those out-of-square cases would be a matter of inches, not several feet, they would surely be the result of settling, and were an exact replica of my house as it stands today were to be built, imperfections and all, those imperfections would not be clearly noitceable to the naked eye on an N scale layout. This kit's rear wall, if the sanding were skipped as mentioned in the instructions, would've caused the structure to appear so out-of-square (by roughly 2 ft. on either side) it would've looked ridiculous.
Let's keep this in scale, shall we? Yes, were you to wander my house with a square you would indeed find places where corners are not perfectly square. Those out-of-square cases would be a matter of inches, not several feet, they would surely be the result of settling, and were an exact replica of my house as it stands today were to be built, imperfections and all, those imperfections would not be clearly noitceable to the naked eye on an N scale layout.
This kit's rear wall, if the sanding were skipped as mentioned in the instructions, would've caused the structure to appear so out-of-square (by roughly 2 ft. on either side) it would've looked ridiculous.
Well so much for my attempt at humor.
Now I feel compelled to ask the million dollar question -
why would you skip part of the instructions, and than complain about the outcome? If you don't like the kits, that is certainly your prerogative, but it seems odd to raise an issue with something that they have clearly corrected and defined as a step in their assembly process.
I'm trying to model 1956, not live in it.