Yeah, I've been looking at lots of pics of Frisco diesels - lots of nice stuff there. I especially like the looks of VO-1000 #200 after she was rebuilt with the 567 prime mover.
Alex V. The Soundtraxx tidbit is a nice plus. I'm thinking more and more that I may wait and hone my modelling skills on a few SLSF diesels before I tear into the two steamers. Thanks for all the tips, everyone!
The Soundtraxx tidbit is a nice plus.
I'm thinking more and more that I may wait and hone my modelling skills on a few SLSF diesels before I tear into the two steamers.
Thanks for all the tips, everyone!
There's lots of fun projects you can do with diesels--RS2Ms, reengined Baldwin VO-1000s and Alco FA-1s, or just detailing/painting/decaling. There are a few diesels you can get RTR for the Frisco, but you may have to roll your own, even with something as simple as an F7 (no doubt soon to change).
Gary
Alex V. Thanks for the comparisons. I'm getting confused LOL. I'll have to get my model in here at the computer, then look at pics of 1500, 4300, and 4400 class engines and see which is closest. I'm partial to 1522 (live about 100 miles from where it's stored) so a 1500-class would be nice. Heck, I may get ambitous and do 1522 herself!
Thanks for the comparisons. I'm getting confused LOL. I'll have to get my model in here at the computer, then look at pics of 1500, 4300, and 4400 class engines and see which is closest. I'm partial to 1522 (live about 100 miles from where it's stored) so a 1500-class would be nice. Heck, I may get ambitous and do 1522 herself!
Well, not to add to your confusion...
The Frisco 1500-class mountains came in two groups, 1500-1519 and 1520 and up. The earlier group had Baker valve gear; the latter had Walschaerts, which is why the the air reservoirs got moved to the top. You can choose to add the torpedo tubes if you want to model 1522. I'm not good enough with valve gear to know what type is on which model, so if you choose to ignore it, that's fine with me. Some other items to change for 1522 would be:
Soundtraxx Tsunami Heavy Steam sound decoder has recordings of 1522, so that's also something to consider...
Alex V. True, Andre - but the ones that used the Laird crossheads had other-than-spoked drivers. My USRA Mountain has spoked drivers and an alligator crosshead, so I want to keep the drivers even if I do have to change the crosshead. That limits me, pretty much, to #4416 or #4421, both of which had spoked drivers. My Decapod was a Christmas gift from a cousin a few years ago, so I didn't really have much say. I see Bachmann is making a SLSF Decapod again -sure would like to have one of them.
True, Andre - but the ones that used the Laird crossheads had other-than-spoked drivers. My USRA Mountain has spoked drivers and an alligator crosshead, so I want to keep the drivers even if I do have to change the crosshead. That limits me, pretty much, to #4416 or #4421, both of which had spoked drivers.
My Decapod was a Christmas gift from a cousin a few years ago, so I didn't really have much say. I see Bachmann is making a SLSF Decapod again -sure would like to have one of them.
Yes, the decapods are nice--even have a tender doghouse.
The USRA Mountain is probably closer to a 1500-class mountain than a 4400-class, which were recycled by the Friso from the spot series 2-10-2s. I thought they all had Scullin disk drivers; I'll have to look at 4416 and 4421. Hmmm... here's 4416:
http://thelibrary.org/lochist/frisco/friscoline/images/photos/p01478.jpg
and 4421:
http://thelibrary.org/lochist/frisco/friscoline/images/photos/p01479.jpg
I suppose the tenders are closer to the USRA mountain.
Here's 1512, by comparison:
http://thelibrary.org/lochist/frisco/friscoline/images/photos/p01556.jpg
There are some Frisco modelers who are using Bachmann mountains, both heavy and light, as the basis for 1500-class mountains, although the Bachmann USRA light mountain looks very close to 1500-1519, but came lettered for the 4400-class, for some reason.
You can get Laird crosshead guides and crossheads from Yardbird Trains. The ones you probably want are part M7104C which are for the Shifter (the ones for the Mike and Pacific have valve gear hangers as part of the assembly). You'd need to carefully remove the Shifter main rod from the crosshead so you can rivet the 4-8-2 main rod to the crosshead.
http://yardbirdtrains.com/YBSMparts.htm See bottom of page.
The biggest problem with the Laird guide will be mounting the rear end. You'll need to mount the rear of the crosshead guide to to something sticking out from the frame (the Mantua engines had cast mounts). If you check out this instruction sheet for the Mantua Pacific, you'll see what I mean about the cast mounting (between 1st and 2nd driver).
http://yardbirdtrains.com/YBM755kit.htm
Hope this helps.
I think it would be easier than swapping crossheads/guides between engines.
Andre
Alex V. I'm going to be trying (key word there) to superdetail two of my steamers (Bachmann Spectrum HO 2-10-0 Russian Decapod and 4-8-2 USRA Heavy Mountain) to Frisco 1600 and 4400 class engines. I think I can handle most of the things that need to be changed/added except one - the crosshead guides. The guides on my Decapod (it was originally lettered for WM) are the "hanging" type, if you'd call it that - the crosshead rides back and forth on a single bar mounted above the crosshead. The USRA Mountain's crosshead rides in two tracks - one on the top, one on the bottom. A bit more common arrangement, I think. The Frisco 1600-class decapods had the two-track crosshead guide, and the 4400-class Mountains had the "hanging" type - the opposite of my models of each. Is it possible, and/or easy, to change the crosshead styles between the two engines? Thanks.
I'm going to be trying (key word there) to superdetail two of my steamers (Bachmann Spectrum HO 2-10-0 Russian Decapod and 4-8-2 USRA Heavy Mountain) to Frisco 1600 and 4400 class engines. I think I can handle most of the things that need to be changed/added except one - the crosshead guides.
The guides on my Decapod (it was originally lettered for WM) are the "hanging" type, if you'd call it that - the crosshead rides back and forth on a single bar mounted above the crosshead. The USRA Mountain's crosshead rides in two tracks - one on the top, one on the bottom. A bit more common arrangement, I think.
The Frisco 1600-class decapods had the two-track crosshead guide, and the 4400-class Mountains had the "hanging" type - the opposite of my models of each. Is it possible, and/or easy, to change the crosshead styles between the two engines?
Thanks.
Actually, the 4400's also used the Laird crossheads. http://thelibrary.springfield.missouri.org/lochist/frisco/friscoline/images/photos/p01474.jpg
BTW, what was the reason for not getting the Frisco version of the Decapod. It's already correct for the Frisco.
Most are a simple press fit - grasp each, in turn, firmly with pliers and pull straight back.
Wayne
Thanks for the specs, Chuck. So, it appears that the strokes aren't too different?
Anybody have any idea how the crosshead guides come out of the cylinders on either of these engines?
Alex V. Thanks for the advice, guys. The stroke on each engine appears to be somewhat similar - haven't measured yet. I probably won't be tearing into it any time real soon, but when I do I'll be back with more questions, I'm sure.
Thanks for the advice, guys. The stroke on each engine appears to be somewhat similar - haven't measured yet. I probably won't be tearing into it any time real soon, but when I do I'll be back with more questions, I'm sure.
Just checked the stats on the prototype locos. The Decapod has 25x28 cylinders, while the 4-8-2 has 27x32 cylinders. Thus, there should be a 4 scale inch difference in the strokes of the two models. The actual difference may be greater or less, depending on which way the manufacturers tweaked the metric measurements for machining convenience.
OTOH, lengthening a piston rod is no big thing, and shortening one is the easiest game in town.
Enjoy,
Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964)
It should be as simple as swapping the crossheads of your two locos, then altering the cylinders to accept the proper guides. Make sure that the piston rods of both locos are about equal in length - you can trim the length if they're too long, but too short may cause trouble. Best way is to dis-assemble both locos, then use each cylinder block as a pattern for drilling the guide holes in the other. If the two cylinder castings are the same, other than the type of crosshead guides, you could just swap them, then exchange crossheads.
Since I'm not familiar with either the models in question or your skills as a micromachinist, I can't begin to guess how 'easy' making the change would be for you. After decades of kitbashing and detailing 1:80 scale locomotives (and HO before that) I have the skills and the tools, so I doubt that it would exceed 2 on the 1 - 10 difficulty scale - but, that's me, not you. (If Mel Thornburgh or Carl Appell were still present, either would consider it about a 0.1 - but both were master machinists.)
Incidentally, a bit of nomenclature:
I assume that the single-guide crosshead was invented by someone named Laird. I seriously doubt that the type of crosshead first used by James Watt was influenced in any way by an alligator...
Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - with, mostly, Laird crossheads)