Watery Styrene Cement??

[Roadtrp]

Hi guys...

In my quest to be a 'real' model railroader, I bought my first building kit tonight. Unfortunately, even before getting to Step One I am confused.

The instructions say to "Use watery styrene cement, applied sparingly to assemble this building." Could someone please tell me what type of cement it is I need to buy?

Thanks!! [:)]

P.S. the box says "Easy to Assemble Building Kit", but after opening it I find it has 47 parts and a dozen decals. That doesn't sound too easy to me! Could someone please tell me that I'll do just fine?? [(-D][(-D]

[Anonymous]

Tester's cement in a bottle, with a brush. They're talking about a solvent type cement. Tenax is another mfger. of a similar product, there's another one out there too. Can't think of whom it is, now.

Only 47 parts? You'll be finished in no time! It came with distructions, didn't it? Enjoy yourself, remember to breath, though!

[areibel]

Look for Tenax or something similar, it's very thin. And an easy way to use it is to buy the little applicators to apply it with, they look like little Q tips. Once you start using it, you'll love it! All you need to do is hold the parts together, dip the applicator into the cement and touch it to the joint where ever it's out of site, like on the inside corners of your building. It will flow off of the applicator and wick into the joint, and bang you're done! much simpler and neater than the old thick cement (like Testor's in a tube).
Good luck!

[Anonymous]

By watery, they mean very free flowing. As areibel stated, Tenax 7R is very "watery", as is Testors' Plastic cement. Micro-Mark also sells a tool that dispenses solvent cement with more control than a brush. As the directions say, Roadtrp, the less glue you use, the better. You also want to use a square or 90 degree angle clamp to keep the corners of the building square. This is VERY important!

[fiatfan]

Roadtrp,

Relax. You will do fine. First, the watery styrene cement is available at either your LHS, Hobby Lobby, or as some would call it, the Evil Empire (walmart). I use Testors brand. It comes in a small black five sided container with a spout sticking out of one side. Read the directions carefully. Identify the parts, trial fit them together, use sandpaper or a file to smooth the edges where two pieces join, then apply enough cement to and hold the pieces together but not so much that it runs out between the two pieces. Hold the parts until the glue sets, genreally in about 15-20 seconds. Try not go get it on you fingers. If you do, it may distort the finished surface of the building, leaving a scar. It's a good idea to read all the way through the directions and practice putting the pieces togewther first. You may find that the sequence the manufacturer suggests may not work well.. The two best friends you will have in the project are time and patience.

Good luck!

Tom

[Roadtrp]

Thanks for the help guys!

When I got my little train set for Christmas, I had no idea about the whole new world I was getting into. In just 3 months I have done so many things that I've never done before. I work as a computer geek (database management, application development and reporting) for a living, so the artsy/crafty stuff involved in building a layout is far outside my normal experience.

But it has been more fun than I can believe. I think even my wife is amused to see a side of me that she's never seen before. She accompanies me to the LHS to help me pick out buildings, scenery, etc. I love it -- she encourages me to spend more than I would ever feel justified spending if I went alone.

Although I'm just scratching the surface, I can see already that I will never be done. When I look at all the little details I would like to add to my layout, there are literally thousands of things I want to buy in the future. As my wife said tonight... you've got birthdays and Christmases covered for the rest of your life!

Thanks again. [:)]

[fiatfan]

Roadtrp,

You are more than welcome. I'm glad to see you are enjoying this wonderful hobby. About your wife encouraging you to spend more time, watch out! My wife encourages me but most of the time it's just to get me out of her hair!

Tom

PS in case you hadn't guessed, the part about my wife was humor. We have been married for almost 37 years (25 of those were pretty good ones). You are very fortunate to have a wife who supports your activities!

[areibel]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Roadtrp
[ As my wife said tonight... you've got birthdays and Christmases covered for the rest of your life!

LOL!
Consider yourself lucky, whenever I put train stuff on my list my wife starts rolling her eyes! At least then I can pick out my own present!

[Anonymous]

I use the regular old Testers stuff in the bottle with a brush. I modified the brush, by cutting it down to only 10 15 strands. This produces excellent control of where and how much cement is used.

[jfugate]

Roadtrp:

Welcome to the hobby! I also do software development and DBA sorts of things in my real job.

The Model RR hobby is a nice change from slaving over a hot computer screen all day ... and you'll love building with styrene. Best stuff on the planet for scratchbuilding or kitbashing in my opinion.

[Roadtrp]

Well, I ended up using something different from what you guys recommended, and I'm not sure if that was a wise choice. I went to my LHS and asked for Testor's Styrene Cement, and the LHS guy said "let me get you something much better". He gave me something called "Zap-A-Gap CA+". It is basically CA formulated to fill gaps -- what you are gluing doesn't need to be as absolutely flush as with regular super glue. I made sure he knew what I was going to use it for, and he continued to recommend it as the best glue for my needs.

It worked well enough to build my styrene building, but it did have some of the old super glue problems like gluing your fingers to anything and everything! [:P] Although once I learned how to use it that got a little better.

Since I've never used anything else to assemble a building kit, I don't have any idea whether the Zap-A-Gap stuff worked better than the various alternatives. Have any of you guys tried this stuff (or something similar), and what did you think of it? [?]

[Big_Boy_4005]

CA type cement is good for a lot of different applications, but be careful when using it with palstics, as it tends to leave a white residue. Learning to work with the watery type cement can wait for your next project now, but you should try it, it is not that difficult, and gives great results.

Which store did you visit, Scale Model? And then, who did you talk to? Please don't tell me it was Roundhouse Rick, I'll smack him.[banghead][swg] Rick and I go way back.

[Roadtrp]

No, I live in Eden Prairie, so I try to find LHS on the west side of town. This was at Hub Hobby Shop in Richfield... I didn't get the name of the guy who talked me into "Zap-A-Gap".

P.S. I kind of discovered that a Q-tip soaked in Goo-Gone followed by a Q-tip soaked in water seemed to get rid of white residue problems from the CA+.

[Big_Boy_4005]

Email me if you want, and I'll give you my number, I'm always around and happy to help you with any model railroading problems you might have. I used to work at Hub, but the Little Canada Store.

[DonaldAgne]

Don't know if you guys can get it in the States, but Tamiya makes an Extra Thin cement for styrene that I always use and recommend highly. It comes in the same small square bottle as their regular cement, but it has a green cap.

[Eriediamond]

[#ditto] on bigboy's responce to CA Zap A Gap. This type glue is good for building model balsa wood airplanes, but not for plastic models. The fumes from CA type glues will fog clear plastic and "frost" others. Plastic requires a glue with a "welding" action for maximum strength. The "watery" type glue is designed to "capulate" into the joints and weld the pieces together and works the best if the mating sufaces are completely touching each other and beware that a tiny bit goes a long ways here. Try glueing a couple of scrap pieces with the zap a gap and when it has dried see how much effort is required to pop it apart.

[Big_Boy_4005]

QUOTE: Originally posted by DonaldAgne

Don't know if you guys can get it in the States, but Tamiya makes an Extra Thin cement for styrene that I always use and recommend highly. It comes in the same small square bottle as their regular cement, but it has a green cap.

Some of the better general hobby stores carry the Tamiya line of paints and models and would have that glue, though you wouldn't normally find it in a store that only sells trains.

Being very familiar with the store that Roadtrp shops at, I would be 99% sure that they have that item.

To take Eriediamond's comments one step further, the watery cement doesn't really GLUE the parts together, it WELDS them, by disolving a small layer of the material, and then evaporating quickly. Applying too much can leave you with a gooy mess. CA type glues are great for porous materials.

[Anonymous]

Sounds like you'd be better off listening to the people on this board than your LHS guy. I'v never heard of anyone using Zap-a-Gap for the complete assembly of a plastic model. That's not what that product is intended to be used to do.

[Big_Boy_4005]

QUOTE: Originally posted by ACL Fan

Sounds like you'd be better off listening to the people on this board than your LHS guy. I'v never heard of anyone using Zap-a-Gap for the complete assembly of a plastic model. That's not what that product is intended to be used to do.

BINGO!!! It struck me as the clerk was either lazy about the way he assembles models, ignorant about how to assemble models, didn't understand what Roadtrp was trying to assemble, or wanted to sell him a more expensive product.

In any case it does not strike me as a proper recommendation. I can guarantee that the members here, when asked, will give better answers than that clerk.

Welcome back ACL, no hard freelings.[:D][;)]

[Anonymous]

Although your question has been answered above, I'd like to throw in my 2¢ worth.

Glues come in different viscosities from very thin (watery) to medium (like honey) to thick (like jelly) and everything in between. There is a purpose for each. Your instructions say watery so that the glue will "wick" into the joint rather than just sit there looking at you. [:D]

As an example; If you put a drop of water on a paper towel you can see it soak in (wick) through the fibers expanding the size of the wet spot. If you put a drop of jello on the paper towel you'll see the mositure wick into the paper fibers but jello itself just sits there looking at you.

For you project, If you use a medium or thick type of adhesive you'll end up with more on the outside of the joints than inside where it needs to be.

As a scratch builder I use styrene, wood, metal, paper, cloth, foam, etc. and have a large variaty of glues. You too will build up your stockpile of glues after completing a few of these kits.

As stated above, dry fit the pieces, recheck the fitting, then before making it permenant (gluing) check it once more. What you see when dry fitting is what you'll see once glued. A good fit will reduce the amount of filling needed after it is assembled.

You'll always remember your first kit building adventure. Take your time and enjoy it!!

[Roadtrp]

I will certainly stick with the recommendations from this board in the future. Unfortunately, my rookie status kind of did me in this time. When the guy recommended Zap A Gap I remembered that some of the people here talked about products other than Testors, and I figured maybe this stuff was equivalent to those products. It wasn't until I got home and read the fine print on the bottle that I discovered I had purchased a CA product.

[Anonymous]

Yes Zap A Gap is a cyanoacrylate (CA) which works great on styrene.

[Anonymous]

I use many different adhesive products. I have found that the best for styrene plastic models is the Testers or Tenax type liquids or the old tube (Plastic Model Glue) type for specific applications. There are times, when I might use thick CA and also thin (Super glue) for plastics. However I use this material mostly for wood or adhering metal and plastic detail parts to white metal or brass (the thick CA works very well for this). I use Walther's Goo for sticking weights on, or in cars. I use white glue thinned with water for gluing scenery, ballast or coal in tenders. Straight White or carpenter's glue for bench work and other wood work. At times I use 5 minute epoxy or hour epoxy, when I feel these materials will work best for the application. Having spent 15 years building and flying R/C models, a person learns much about adhesives.

[Big_Boy_4005]

You survived your experience, and got the job done, and that's what counts. Live and learn. [swg]