Midnight Railroader wrote: For those who wish they'd bought the Furlow book of compiled articles on building the San Juan Central, but didn't want to pay exorbitant prices being asked for the original book nowadays, an ad in NG&SL Gazette says it is being reprinted by Becnhmark Books. $20.
For those who wish they'd bought the Furlow book of compiled articles on building the San Juan Central, but didn't want to pay exorbitant prices being asked for the original book nowadays, an ad in NG&SL Gazette says it is being reprinted by Becnhmark Books. $20.
Read that too, was glad to see that!
I only paid $20 for my copy off Evilbay a couple years ago but I will be looking at a copy at the LHS to see the newly added last chapter of the conveluted story of what became of the layout, thats a whole nother interesting topic...
Now if we can just get Kalmbach to reprint the John Allen book...
Also, this same issue of the Gazette includes a nice little mention of another of my top 5 layouts of all time, Bob Hegge's Crooked Mountain traction RR in the forward.
Another great issue!
Have fun with your trains
maandg wrote: While I never consider my work to be anywhere near the caliber of Furlow or Sellios, it has brought me more personal fulfillment than I can express. I have pleased myself with the results so far, which is really all I could hope for. For those who were unimpressed with my work, I still appreciate you taking the time to stop by and take a look anyway.
While I never consider my work to be anywhere near the caliber of Furlow or Sellios, it has brought me more personal fulfillment than I can express. I have pleased myself with the results so far, which is really all I could hope for. For those who were unimpressed with my work, I still appreciate you taking the time to stop by and take a look anyway.
Dont short yourself, its a very well done layout, right up there, any criticisms I may have made were only done so to point out objective differences in the modeling approaches. I respect your layout a great deal.
marknewton wrote: NEMMRRC wrote:Folks,I am at the National Narrow Gauge Convention in Portland, OR this week and Benchmark Publications has released a 25th anniversary release of The San Juan Central by model railroading's long-lost beloved son, Malcolm Furlow...You wrote in a previous post;"All some of us are saying is that we like Furlow and his modeling. It's clear you do not.".Not so. I neither like nor dislike Furlow. His modelling is not to my taste, but I don't feel very strongly about it one way or the other. It's the hagiography that accompanies him that I don't like.Cheers,Mark.
NEMMRRC wrote:Folks,I am at the National Narrow Gauge Convention in Portland, OR this week and Benchmark Publications has released a 25th anniversary release of The San Juan Central by model railroading's long-lost beloved son, Malcolm Furlow...
Cliff Powers, Thanks for sharing that with us. I am sure it will give much insight to some who for what ever reason chose to critise.
You Sir along with Joe F. are my heros and consider you my favorite modelers.
Thanks for all the inspiration and ideas that have been shared over the years. There is not too many sites that have been "bookmarked" on my puter but yours definatley has a place here.
Johnboy out.............
Long Live the Wobbly.................
from Saskatchewan, in the Great White North..
We have met the enemy, and he is us............ (Pogo)
maandg wrote: I was most surprised to see my name brought up in a discussion of Malcolm Furlow and George Sellios. As Wayne and Garth would say, "I'm not worthy". I respect the fact that my layout is not done in the style or taste of everyone who sees it. I'm sure no such layout ever existed. However, given some of the criticisms that have been raised, I thought I would share (not defend) some of the philosophies and influences for my modeling style.First of all, I would like to state for the record that I am a huge fan of both Malcolm and George. Both have left an indelible stamp on our hobby. I think that Mr. Sellios is one of the finest model builders of all time. All of his individual structures are of museum and contest quality. When hundreds of these structures are brought together, however, they create an overwhelming and awesome sensory experience. Some would argue that it is too overly detailed to be realistic...even for a huge metropolitan city. Regardless of opinion, I am nonetheless in awe of what he has accomplished.I think comparing my MA&G to the F&SM is a very apples and oranges proposition. This is mainly due to the subject matter itself. My main goal, at least with the Mississippi level which was mentioned, was to convey the atmosphere and mood of laid-back, small town life in the 50's. Think of Mayberry from the Andy Griffith show or the courthouse square from "Back to the Future". Now I realize that these were sanitized interpretations of such places. But you also have to understand the mindset of southerners. Most people took pride in the way their property and town looked. There was a lot of community spirit, not to mention old money, in many of those towns. The local Ladies Auxiliary would award "Yard of the Month" to very competitive homeowners who would strive to have the most beautiful Azaleas in town. Both of my grandmothers held this honor on several occasions. Things were spit and polished for events like Founder's Day or community Easter egg hunts. People got together for Dinner on the Grounds at church. Such observations are based on personal memories I have from the 60's and 70's. The movie Steel Magnolias (which I realize has probably not been seen by most men) has the sort of small town southern charm I was after. Compared to a city like Franklin or South Manchester, my towns of Wharton or Edna would indeed seem quite dead or sterile. I do understand that some of you see my modeling in that light regardless. I respect your opinion.The one critisism I would definitely agree with has to do with the racial mix of the residents on my layout. At least a third of the population should be of African-American ancestry. My fear is that in our very politically correct society, a visitor to my website could take offense in the way minorities were depicted. I think this is reflected in the lack of ethnic figure sets by Preiser, Merten or Woodland Scenics (although admittedly the first two are European companies). To have whites-only facilities and businesses would indeed be prototypical for the era, but very offensive to most people. This was not my intention. I remember when Allen Keller's Bluff City Southern was published in MR back in the 90's, someone wrote into the RPO column and admonished Allen for depicting the confederate flag in front of his courthouse. He was basically accused of being a racist. This is a perfect example of realism being considered offensive. To be honest, the Mississippi flag, which bears the confederate symbol, flies in front of the courthouse in my town of Wharton. I have deliberately cropped it from any photographs on my layout in an attempt to be sensitive to the nearly 50,000 people who have visited my website. Lastly, I would say that my website has always been a vehicle for me to share, not promote, the layout with others. Even though I live in a highly populated area, there are very few people that are interested in our hobby. I hoped that having the layout filmed for local television and featured on the front page of the newspaper would impact this, but in fact I have very few visitors. For this reason I turned to the web as a means for opening the layout to others. While I never consider my work to be anywhere near the caliber of Furlow or Sellios, it has brought me more personal fulfillment than I can express. I have pleased myself with the results so far, which is really all I could hope for. For those who were unimpressed with my work, I still appreciate you taking the time to stop by and take a look anyway.
I was most surprised to see my name brought up in a discussion of Malcolm Furlow and George Sellios. As Wayne and Garth would say, "I'm not worthy". I respect the fact that my layout is not done in the style or taste of everyone who sees it. I'm sure no such layout ever existed. However, given some of the criticisms that have been raised, I thought I would share (not defend) some of the philosophies and influences for my modeling style.
First of all, I would like to state for the record that I am a huge fan of both Malcolm and George. Both have left an indelible stamp on our hobby. I think that Mr. Sellios is one of the finest model builders of all time. All of his individual structures are of museum and contest quality. When hundreds of these structures are brought together, however, they create an overwhelming and awesome sensory experience. Some would argue that it is too overly detailed to be realistic...even for a huge metropolitan city. Regardless of opinion, I am nonetheless in awe of what he has accomplished.
I think comparing my MA&G to the F&SM is a very apples and oranges proposition. This is mainly due to the subject matter itself. My main goal, at least with the Mississippi level which was mentioned, was to convey the atmosphere and mood of laid-back, small town life in the 50's. Think of Mayberry from the Andy Griffith show or the courthouse square from "Back to the Future". Now I realize that these were sanitized interpretations of such places. But you also have to understand the mindset of southerners. Most people took pride in the way their property and town looked. There was a lot of community spirit, not to mention old money, in many of those towns. The local Ladies Auxiliary would award "Yard of the Month" to very competitive homeowners who would strive to have the most beautiful Azaleas in town. Both of my grandmothers held this honor on several occasions. Things were spit and polished for events like Founder's Day or community Easter egg hunts. People got together for Dinner on the Grounds at church. Such observations are based on personal memories I have from the 60's and 70's. The movie Steel Magnolias (which I realize has probably not been seen by most men) has the sort of small town southern charm I was after. Compared to a city like Franklin or South Manchester, my towns of Wharton or Edna would indeed seem quite dead or sterile. I do understand that some of you see my modeling in that light regardless. I respect your opinion.
The one critisism I would definitely agree with has to do with the racial mix of the residents on my layout. At least a third of the population should be of African-American ancestry. My fear is that in our very politically correct society, a visitor to my website could take offense in the way minorities were depicted. I think this is reflected in the lack of ethnic figure sets by Preiser, Merten or Woodland Scenics (although admittedly the first two are European companies). To have whites-only facilities and businesses would indeed be prototypical for the era, but very offensive to most people. This was not my intention. I remember when Allen Keller's Bluff City Southern was published in MR back in the 90's, someone wrote into the RPO column and admonished Allen for depicting the confederate flag in front of his courthouse. He was basically accused of being a racist. This is a perfect example of realism being considered offensive. To be honest, the Mississippi flag, which bears the confederate symbol, flies in front of the courthouse in my town of Wharton. I have deliberately cropped it from any photographs on my layout in an attempt to be sensitive to the nearly 50,000 people who have visited my website.
Lastly, I would say that my website has always been a vehicle for me to share, not promote, the layout with others. Even though I live in a highly populated area, there are very few people that are interested in our hobby. I hoped that having the layout filmed for local television and featured on the front page of the newspaper would impact this, but in fact I have very few visitors. For this reason I turned to the web as a means for opening the layout to others. While I never consider my work to be anywhere near the caliber of Furlow or Sellios, it has brought me more personal fulfillment than I can express. I have pleased myself with the results so far, which is really all I could hope for. For those who were unimpressed with my work, I still appreciate you taking the time to stop by and take a look anyway.
Cliff, it's great to hear from someone of your calibre on these forums, and as one of the folks who posted I'd just like to say perhaps two obvious things - you're a master modeler and your layout is beautifully done. It's a little bit silly sometimes for those of use who have about an iota of the skill of someone like you to offer a criticism, but I respect and admire the fact that you are open to us all.
I understand what you are talking about with "political correctness", and it's always great to hear the rationale of what went into MR decisions and why. You're caught in a dilemna when you model the south in th 50's, as a Southerner I know that all too well. On the one hand, you depict reality, and the reality is that, yes, a very sizable portion of the community was both black and overwhelmingly in a oppressed and segregated state, and even a prototypical model railroad scene can offend - stirring up unpleasant memories and resentments.
On the other hand, a sanitized view and scene of the South in the 50's can provokes a "hey, wait a minute..." reaction (like mine ) , and can strike some as a denial, apologist or revisionism. For some, that can equally offend, and for some, stir up resentments.
So you are indeed caught in a quandry when modeling the South in the 50s, especially the delta, flatland or tidewater south. I get that, and your explanation made me think more about that, and I appreciate the delicate reasoning. And your explanation does clarify the thinking behind yor layout decision and the honesty and sincerity that went into it. You're obviously good people.
Cliff,
Thanks for stopping by and sharing with us your thoughts/rationale about your layout. It's always nice to hear it directly from the creator, themselves, rather than just from us attempting to speculate what we think or interpret what another's work is "trying to say". Keep up the good work.
Tom
https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling
Time...It marches on...without ever turning around to see if anyone is even keeping in step.
Cliff Powers
www.magnoliaroute.com
marknewton wrote: jackn2mpu wrote:Mark:Your point ios well taken, especially seeing as how it's made from the evidence provided. As stated before in this thread, I'm no fan of Sellios's styleon the FS&M, but what might make the FS&M evidence look better before a jury is if the same picture was taken in the same way the first one was, and not helicopter-style (or Jolly Green Giant style) as it is. Perhaps, buts it's not just the position of the camera that makes this scene look toy-like. The uniform weathering, anachronistic signage and dubious architecture all make the scene look implausible and unrealistic to me.Cheers,Mark.
jackn2mpu wrote:Mark:Your point ios well taken, especially seeing as how it's made from the evidence provided. As stated before in this thread, I'm no fan of Sellios's styleon the FS&M, but what might make the FS&M evidence look better before a jury is if the same picture was taken in the same way the first one was, and not helicopter-style (or Jolly Green Giant style) as it is.
Mark:
You've said what I had in mind but couldn't find the proper words for. I don't think the northeastern US would have looked at all like this in the depression; as someone else said, it's like Sweethaven from Popeye. Construction in inland cities would have been brick for the most part
OT - do you think Geelong can win the Grand Final for 2 years in a row? Long time footy fan here in the USA. I just wish Carlton had made it in the top 8.
de N2MPU Jack
Proud NRA Life Member and supporter of the 2nd. Amendment
God, guns, and rock and roll!
Modeling the NYC/NYNH&H in HO and CPRail/D&H in N
Gazoo wrote: marknewton wrote: wjstix wrote:I'm not sure "being the first" has to do with it exactly. The point being made was that it's harder to model a real railroad in exact detail than it is to make something up. In modelling a real railroad, you have a target you have to hit with your arrow. When you're freelancing, you can shoot your arrow into the wall and then draw a target around it.Stix, I wish I'd said that! That summarises my view perfectly.The people with this view seem to have closed their minds and locked themselves inside a box they can't seem to escape.
marknewton wrote: wjstix wrote:I'm not sure "being the first" has to do with it exactly. The point being made was that it's harder to model a real railroad in exact detail than it is to make something up. In modelling a real railroad, you have a target you have to hit with your arrow. When you're freelancing, you can shoot your arrow into the wall and then draw a target around it.Stix, I wish I'd said that! That summarises my view perfectly.
wjstix wrote:I'm not sure "being the first" has to do with it exactly. The point being made was that it's harder to model a real railroad in exact detail than it is to make something up. In modelling a real railroad, you have a target you have to hit with your arrow. When you're freelancing, you can shoot your arrow into the wall and then draw a target around it.
The people with this view seem to have closed their minds and locked themselves inside a box they can't seem to escape.
... what you just don't seem to be able to release your mind to is that you also can freelance in such a way that you're shooting a target at an arrow. Or shooting your arrow at a target that's under the couch. Or instead of an arrow you're shooting a banana from your bow...None of those are easier they're harder.
vsmith wrote:I do wonder if we would be so different in our opinions if both these layouts pics were B&W, might level the playing feild a tad. For example the pic of the Magnolia Route town in the above pic, in B&W could be something very similar to the old Route 66 Pics of the 50&...
wjstix wrote: (image from wikipedia)
(image from wikipedia)
COOL!
tstage wrote: vsmith wrote:I do wonder if we would be so different in our opinions if both these layouts pics were B&W, might level the playing feild a tad. For example the pic of the Magnolia Route town in the above pic, in B&W could be something very similar to the old Route 66 Pics of the 50's, Sellios town reminds me a great deal of the gritty industrial sections of Chicago and some places here in Los Angeles, so maybe that colors my opinion a little.Victor,I can only speak for myself but I don't think it would make any difference whether the pictures were in color, B&W, or sepia. Cliff's MA&G would look like a small southern town - albeit sterile, perhaps. George's highly-stylized F&SM would still look "busy".I do have a couple of questions for you, Victor. Can a layout ever have too much detail to it? If so, where does one draw the line and what are the tell-tale signs of overdetailing? I am interested in your answer. Thanks.Tom
vsmith wrote:I do wonder if we would be so different in our opinions if both these layouts pics were B&W, might level the playing feild a tad. For example the pic of the Magnolia Route town in the above pic, in B&W could be something very similar to the old Route 66 Pics of the 50's, Sellios town reminds me a great deal of the gritty industrial sections of Chicago and some places here in Los Angeles, so maybe that colors my opinion a little.
Victor,
I can only speak for myself but I don't think it would make any difference whether the pictures were in color, B&W, or sepia. Cliff's MA&G would look like a small southern town - albeit sterile, perhaps. George's highly-stylized F&SM would still look "busy".
I do have a couple of questions for you, Victor. Can a layout ever have too much detail to it? If so, where does one draw the line and what are the tell-tale signs of overdetailing? I am interested in your answer. Thanks.
Tom, I cant answer that question other than giving my own opinion, its like asking "can a locomotive ever have 'too much' detail".
I mean its really a deeply personal perspective as to how much is too much, for some the Magnolia line is just right, to others its sparce, same for Sellios, to many its cluttered and over detailed, yet others look at it and marvel at the level of detail.
I supposed it also has ALOT to do with the scale of the layout, as I said above, what works in HO, doesnt nessecarily work in larger scales like G, the level antes up with each progressive scale change becuase your eye simply see's more in the same respective area, one city block in N is a single building in G, so what you see detail wise ramps up significantly and that affects the way you view everything else.
N layouts tend to have least amount of specific detail per sq ft yet that works in that scale as its the overall scope is whats important, the broader level of detail is what you percieve looking at it, where in G, beleive me, once your in it a while you find your self looking at things very specificly, especially on indoor layouts simply because you can literally look right into windows and open doors on a house on an indoor layout. So its a moving target.
But to address your question, Yes, IMHO a layout CAN have too much detail, but that level of acceptability will be based soley on your personal perspective. If your happy with plasticville buildings, RTR trains running on plastic ballast track rolling over LifeLike grass paper, on a 4x8 sheet of 1/4" plywood drooped on top of 2 saw horses and your pleased as peach with it thats your level of acceptance, but if your level deems you to model every last detail on a specific locomotive becasue you crawled all over and under and through it at the museum with a tape measure and calipers, and researched every known picture so you could represent it right down to the exact pattern of swipe of a dirty window or dusty handprints next to the grab bars that your pictures of that locomotive as it appeared on July 8th 1942 at 3:22 PM as it sat at the station in Pigsknuckle Ark, and btw your station is also modeled to the same level of exactness and even has the exact same schedule writen on the board in the same handscript as it appears in your photo archive on that same day including the station masters sandwich sitting on a bench, then thats your level of acceptable detailing, It no different for the guy who models the garbage piled in a stuffed with deatil alleyway, even to the point of using a fine scale pen to dot in a line of ants going from the garbage to their in scale ant hill, I mean its really an endless question thats going to vary from person to person...It just depends how manic you are.
Myself I hope to achieve a balance somewhat similar to Sellios, who to some might look over done in HO, might look just about right for large scale.
PS In this context I'm limiting my opinions to INDOOR large scale, but there are guys out there with interiors on their outdoor structures, complete with lighting so when night falls, all the insides are visible thru the windows. And not so much to the guys just running large scale RTR trains chasing their tails thru the petunias in the planter, anyways not anymore than the guys in HO with the Snap Track & LifeLike paper rolls or the guys doing classic tinplate layouts in O, its a really wide swath of approaches across the scales out there, but we're a pretty tolerant and forgiving group, right?
Geared Steam wrote:CLiff's layout is beautiful but not realistic. It is a dead layout with out enough life to it. That is what appeals to some though. Some poepl like trains and not the people and life surrounding them others like trains for their emersion. It seems to have plenty of life to it. Not a train in site. http://magnoliaroute.com/magnolia%20route_196.htm
CLiff's layout is beautiful but not realistic. It is a dead layout with out enough life to it. That is what appeals to some though. Some poepl like trains and not the people and life surrounding them others like trains for their emersion.
It seems to have plenty of life to it. Not a train in site.
http://magnoliaroute.com/magnolia%20route_196.htm
it's too clean and perfect. This picture does not look like a period photo Some colors are over saturated and others are to desaturated. There is definately something appealing about it but not realistic.
marknewton wrote: wjstix wrote:I'm not sure "being the first" has to do with it exactly. The point being made was that it's harder to model a real railroad in exact detail than it is to make something up. In modelling a real railroad, you have a target you have to hit with your arrow. When you're freelancing, you can shoot your arrow into the wall and then draw a target around it.Stix, I wish I'd said that! That summarises my view perfectly.All the best,Mark.
No one disagrees with what was said about the arrow. When you're freelancing, you can shoot your arrow and draw a target around it. That makes your job easier if you do that. No one of sound mind disagrees with this.
But what you just don't seem to be able to release your mind to is that you also can freelance in such a way that you're shooting a target at an arrow. Or shooting your arrow at a target that's under the couch. Or instead of an arrow you're shooting a banana from your bow. None of those are easier they're harder. Not better, not superior quality, not examples of what everyone should strive for, just different--and it can be harder.
Well Guys, I guess thats where I'm wierd then, I have also studied that era for a while now and so have seen the delapadated world both Sellios and Furlow are portraying. So it works for me. Mark, CNJ, I DO get both your points, as I stated, its a PERSONAL preference.
I tend to look for those "close in" details, pitfall of being in large scale I guess, you tend to really up the ante in the level of detail simply because what might be an acceptable level of detail in HO would look sparce in O and downright naked in G. Your newspapers are actually large enough to read the headlines so things like that and labels on bottles become your standard detail levels. You HAVE to model the weeds, and beer cans, and junk, and dirt, or it just doesnt look real, so CNJ's comment about what level of density might be "overpowering" in HO may just be an "acceptable" level in G. Something to ponder for you detail guys.
I do wonder if we would be so different in our opinions if both these layouts pics were B&W, might level the playing feild a tad. For example the pic of the Magnolia Route town in the above pic, in B&W could be something very similar to the old Route 66 Pics of the 50's, Sellios town reminds me a great deal of the gritty industrial sections of Chicago and some places here in Los Angeles, so maybe that colors my opinion a little.
I'm still pondering details to add to my own portable layout, like tools and equipment, but am constantly frustrated by the lack of detail products in G, some 1/2" scale doll house stuff works OK but try finding specific mining equipment, you almost have to make most of it, so I guess I'm getting a little nuts...
If I'm not Kookoo now, by the time I get to detailing the main layout, I'll be certifiable
Geared Steam wrote: CLiff's layout is beautiful but not realistic. It is a dead layout with out enough life to it. That is what appeals to some though. Some poepl like trains and not the people and life surrounding them others like trains for their emersion. It seems to have plenty of life to it. Not a train in site. http://magnoliaroute.com/magnolia%20route_196.htm
Not to open a bag of worms Ok, I'll rip it open. This is a view, just based upon the photos I've seen of Cliff's layout...it's obviously beautifully done, but even with not a train in sight, it's the deep south, and there's not a black in sight either. Near the railroads. In shanty towns. Working in his sawmills. No white-only water fountains in that time era? It's a fantasy land. Beautifully done, but highly unrealistic if one is purportedly modeling a relatively specific time and place.
Ok, beat me up now for this comment. Just keepin' it real!
Although maybe I'm wrong about this and all the photos I've seen of his layout and on his site, it just doesn't show up. That's a possibility.
And also, of course, it's perfectly fine and ok to model a fantasy land if that's one's desire. The MR police won't be knocking on any of our doors. Just that as I have gotten more interested in this hobby, I find the layouts that depict a RR in a time and place that is highly plausible or prototypical much more captivating and intriguing.
It simply comes down to what the layout owner's interests are. George Selios is a structure builder. Even if he wasn't a professional, his layout would be a place to display his structures. He hasn't written a book on operation, and I doubt he ever will. It's not his thing. And there's nothing wrong with that. He has a unique vision which he expresses very well. All model railroads shouldn't look the same anyhow. Too many layouts in MR look like different sections of the same large layout.
I have to say, though, that the Magnolia Route linked to above is probably the finest model railroad I've ever seen, albiet in picture form only.
jackn2mpu wrote: Mark:Your point ios well taken, especially seeing as how it's made from the evidence provided. As stated before in this thread, I'm no fan of Sellios's styleon the FS&M, but what might make the FS&M evidence look better before a jury is if the same picture was taken in the same way the first one was, and not helicopter-style (or Jolly Green Giant style) as it is. Jack
Your point ios well taken, especially seeing as how it's made from the evidence provided. As stated before in this thread, I'm no fan of Sellios's styleon the FS&M, but what might make the FS&M evidence look better before a jury is if the same picture was taken in the same way the first one was, and not helicopter-style (or Jolly Green Giant style) as it is.
Jack
George's book "The Fabulous Franklin & South Manchester" has some good street-level views in it, suitable to act as a comparison in this situation, although I expect copyright restrictions would prevent me posting them here. However, the book is highly popular and likely many readers of this forum have a copy.
In certain instances, when the shots of the F&SM are particularly tight (pages 8 or 47), there is a degree of believability to the scenes. However, the moment the images start to include broad surroundings, with many buildings (pages 23, 62-63 or 68-69), the scenes start to take on an almost post-Apocalyptic feel. The level of filth, decay and clutter is simply over-the-top and any initial impression of reality is lost.
Likewise, the "busyness" that Vic so admires becomes totally overwhelming when more than a tiny segment of the layout is viewed at one time. The impression you eventually get from the photos (or in person) is that of moderate-sized city with three to five times the expected normal population...people and intense activity are just everywhere!
Now I'll say again that I have nothing against George's style of modeling. If he and others enjoy it, that's great. I've visited the layout myself and was immensely impressed by it. However...it in no way depicts nor resembles reality and particularly not the appearance of cities in New England during the Great Depression.
If one is looking for examples of realism in model railroading, then I'd also suggest taking a look a Howard Zane's layout.
CNJ831
vsmith wrote: Geared Steam wrote: CLiff's layout is beautiful but not realistic. It is a dead layout with out enough life to it. That is what appeals to some though. Some poepl like trains and not the people and life surrounding them others like trains for their emersion. It seems to have plenty of life to it. Not a train in site. http://magnoliaroute.com/magnolia%20route_196.htm ...but to me, not a thing out of place, not a mar, compared to:http://www.horailroad.com/fsm/fsmlayout0.html
...but to me, not a thing out of place, not a mar, compared to:
http://www.horailroad.com/fsm/fsmlayout0.html
To me the upper picture looks more realistic. Some of the FS&M reminds me of Sweethaven in the Robin Williams "Popeye" movie from years back. The set is now a tourist spot in Malta called "Popeye Village":
Thanks, but to be fair I should point out I borrowed the line about the arrow from someone talking about why they didn't like Sherlock Holmes stories.
marknewton wrote: vsmith wrote: Geared Steam wrote: CLiff's layout is beautiful but not realistic. It is a dead layout with out enough life to it. That is what appeals to some though. Some poepl like trains and not the people and life surrounding them others like trains for their emersion. It seems to have plenty of life to it. Not a train in site. http://magnoliaroute.com/magnolia%20route_196.htm ...but to me, not a thing out of place, not a mar, compared to:http://www.horailroad.com/fsm/fsmlayout0.html Our perceptions obviously differ greatly. When I look at the first photo, I know it's a model, but the scene looks plausible, believable - I can easily imagine a place that looks like this. The second photo looks utterly toy-like to me, and I can't suspend my disbelief.Cheers,Mark.